faulknerwn 36 #26 October 17, 2007 You mean just leave a little bit of slack at the top above the pin? You have to do that on ALL rigs - whether they have velcro or not. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JerryBaumchen 1,048 #27 October 17, 2007 Hi mom & zig, As regards the French link coming undone, I recall Beezy Shaw describing using one of the '0' rings that are twice wound from spring steel ( the kind of ring that many of us keep our keys on ) in lieu of the F-link. This ring would not come undone but I think it would be an effort to get the two loops wound in it. HTH, JerryBaumchen Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
peregrinerose 0 #28 October 17, 2007 I've seen slinks used for the same thing... easier to hook up and less chance of losing them. I've seen the key rings start pulling apart, if they are the thinner type key rings. Do or do not, there is no try -Yoda Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ZigZagMarquis 8 #29 October 17, 2007 Jerry, PRose, et all, I've seen the key-ring thing done too and it works as long as you have a decent quality key-ring as PRose points out. I've seen Slinks used to attach the bridle to the top of the canopy. I keep meaning to try this on one of my rigs. I wonder though if a Slink would have enough ass to it if used at the inside top of the D-Bag vs. a speed link (F-link) to keep from being pulled through the grommet on the D-bag at opening? Over the years, I've gone through enough Jim Cazer pilot chutes that I've got a small collection of extra speed links (you get 2 new with each of his pilot chutes) hanging on a loop on one of the zippers on my gear bag. I won't use them on risers / suspension lines (I will use new (good) ones, just not these old used ones I got with pilot chutes), but a few extra are handy to have around when someone needs to hook a D-bag / bridle to a main or looses one off of their kill-line set up like its sounds like divermom had happen. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
popsjumper 2 #30 October 17, 2007 QuoteI've seen slinks used for the same thing... easier to hook up and less chance of losing them. I've seen the key rings start pulling apart, if they are the thinner type key rings. I use the spring ring exclusively...and yes, they must be heavy-duty ones. IMHO, only a fool would use a light-duty one.My reality and yours are quite different. I think we're all Bozos on this bus. Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ZigZagMarquis 8 #31 October 17, 2007 Quote IMHO, only a fool would use a light-duty one. Potential damage to your D-bag and/or canopy and/or your kill-line pilot chute de-cocking itself, sure, but in reality, your D-Bag/bridle/pilot chute doesn't even have to be attached to your main to still work... if you don't mind chasing it down after ever jump. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
popsjumper 2 #32 October 17, 2007 Quote Quote Quote Last, but not least... Quote I had my first high speed malfunction this weekend...at my first out of state boogie. That's 2 Cases of Beer!!!! Oh, come on. That's not fair! Ummm... since when does "fair" enter into Beer Rules? Right here: "If more than one first is accomplished on a single jump, only one case of beer is required." Also included in the Beer Rules is this: "Equally sad is the fact that some unscrupulously thirsty jumpers will shamelessly try to "weasel" a case of beer out of a jumper for an inauspicious event." Note to kathleen: IF this was NOT your first jump of the boogie, then Ziggy's declaration holds true....buy the beer and quit whinin' for The Rules also say: "These articles are ironclad and binding. For the price of an additional six-pack, a sniveling skydiver may enlist the services of an S & TA to represent him or her in a hearing where the committee will rule against that skydiver a second time." Luv ya', girl.My reality and yours are quite different. I think we're all Bozos on this bus. Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ZigZagMarquis 8 #33 October 17, 2007 Quote "If more than one first is accomplished on a single jump, only one case of beer is required." *Flag* Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
marks2065 0 #34 October 17, 2007 sorry but i was on my gf's (quadit) computer when i responded - slack above the pin is what i am talking about - i have a racer and my bridle has the hook and latch of the velcro both on the bridle instead of one on the container and one on the briddle - most people do not know what this is for - it is to keep the bridle from preventing the pin from pulling out - on most containers people think the velcro is for routing the bridle so they use it as such - on racers the bridle is routed under the top flap and the pin comes up to the closing loop - the briddle needs to be pinched at the velcro and tucked under the top or side flap - without doing this ( depending on how tight the pack is ) may result in pilot chute hessitations or even a pilot chute in tow malfunction - this is why i am very carefull about who packs my rig - unless someone works with racers and knows this they usually don't pinch the veclcro on the bridle - i have had a couple riggers not know what this is for on the racer and gave me a pilot chut in tow that i had to pull the pin - not fun leaving a big way and having to pull the pin after tracking to 2000 feet Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
marks2065 0 #35 October 17, 2007 is the ring you are talking about the one that attaches to the kill line - if it is that is what colapses the pilot chute - with that missing it won't colapse but shouldn't prevent it from operating normally Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
faulknerwn 36 #36 October 17, 2007 That's bizarre. I own 6 Racers and none have that velcro like you describe. But I think most of pilot chutes are Cazar or other ones. Though I know two for sure are from the factory and neither have that velcro. Must depend on the age of the container. I just tuck the excess under the top flap - even on my tiny Power Racers that's enough slack to not cause a pc-in-tow. Almost 5000 jumps on 8 different Racers and never had a pilot chute hesitation or one in-tow so it seems to work. Is your rig extra-super-duper tight or something? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
marks2065 0 #37 October 17, 2007 mine is a standard racer made in 1998 - i don't know about the newer racer's but all the ones that i saw back when i got mine had the velcro pinch on the bridle - now racer had an issue about that time with bridles that were to short and not getting out of the burble enough to get full pull on the pin and they made the bridles longer maybe they changed the design at that time also Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
faulknerwn 36 #38 October 17, 2007 I think most of mine are non-Racer original pilot chutes so they don't have the ability to "pinch" anyway. But I've never seen a problem. The only problems I've ever seen are when people try to tuck the walrus teeth under the bottom flap instead of the top flap. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skydivermom 0 #39 October 17, 2007 Quote is the ring you are talking about the one that attaches to the kill line - if it is that is what colapses the pilot chute - with that missing it won't colapse but shouldn't prevent it from operating normally Geez I am really embarassed. I should know the terms of my gear better.....maybe this wouldn't have happened had I been more familiar with my rig. The ring I'm talking about is in the D-bag and it connects 2 pieces of rope that are inside the bag. The guy who discovered it only did so because he was packing for me and attempted to cock the PC. Without that ring, it would absolutely not cock. It had to have come off in the plane or something, because it most definately was not cocked when I tried to deploy.Mrs. WaltAppel All things work together for good to them that love God...Romans 8:28 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ZigZagMarquis 8 #40 October 17, 2007 Quote I should know the terms of my gear better.....maybe this wouldn't have happened had I been more familiar with my rig. Please, do not feel picked on, but "Yes" it will. Again... your mission... if you choose to accept it... is to get with a rigger or experienced skydiver at your home DZ this weekend and have them go over a hands-on demo for you showing you how to removed and replace your D-Bag/Bridle/Pilot Chute assembly on your rig / main. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skydivermom 0 #41 October 17, 2007 Quote Quote I should know the terms of my gear better.....maybe this wouldn't have happened had I been more familiar with my rig. Please, do not feel picked on, but "Yes" it will. Again... your mission... if you choose to accept it... is to get with a rigger or experienced skydiver at your home DZ this weekend and have them go over a hands-on demo for you showing you how to removed and replace your D-Bag/Bridle/Pilot Chute assembly on your rig / main. Oh PLEEEEEASE! How could I feel picked on? I certainly would not have posted this in here if I was that thin-skinned.....especially when I did some things wrong....or rather....didn't do some things I should have. And anyway, If being/feeling picked on could save my life, I am all for it.Mrs. WaltAppel All things work together for good to them that love God...Romans 8:28 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skydivermom 0 #42 October 17, 2007 Thanks Pops. You're a great guy! Mrs. WaltAppel All things work together for good to them that love God...Romans 8:28 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
marks2065 0 #43 October 17, 2007 this is not picking it is understanding your gear - i am not a rigger and have alot to learn myself - i own a racer that is why i am reading this thread - i have had a couple riggers that have spent alot of time with me and my rig - you should do the same - remember that it is your life and you should learn all you can about not only your gear but other peoples gear that you may be asked to check before exit - also if you don't know something find out before checking someone elses rig or jumping your own Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ZigZagMarquis 8 #44 October 17, 2007 Quote Thanks Pops. You're a great guy! No! Pops is trying to subvert and liberalize the Beer Rules! ... but that is a different topic. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skydivermom 0 #45 October 17, 2007 Quote this is not picking it is understanding your gear - i am not a rigger and have alot to learn myself - i own a racer that is why i am reading this thread - i have had a couple riggers that have spent alot of time with me and my rig - you should do the same - remember that it is your life and you should learn all you can about not only your gear but other peoples gear that you may be asked to check before exit - also if you don't know something find out before checking someone elses rig or jumping your own Exactly, that's why I said if it could save my life, I could care less if I feel picked on. I am really, really embarassed about not being more familiar with my system, and I'm lucky there are extremely knowledgable folks that can go over it with me next time I'm at my home dz. It's a shame that it took me being shook up good to take this step, but I'm glad I am alive to take it.Mrs. WaltAppel All things work together for good to them that love God...Romans 8:28 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skydivermom 0 #46 October 17, 2007 Well, the funny thing is, I don't buy alcohol anyway so it really doesn't matter Mrs. WaltAppel All things work together for good to them that love God...Romans 8:28 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ZigZagMarquis 8 #47 October 17, 2007 ... and you call yourself a skydiver. Turn in your USPA license! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skydivermom 0 #48 October 17, 2007 Quote ... and you call yourself a skydiver. Turn in your USPA license! Oh sheesh....why did I post that? I really must still be suffering from jet lag.Mrs. WaltAppel All things work together for good to them that love God...Romans 8:28 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ZigZagMarquis 8 #49 October 17, 2007 Quote Quote ... and you call yourself a skydiver. Turn in your USPA license! Oh sheesh....why did I post that? I really must still be suffering from jet lag. My advice to you is to start drinking heavily... oh wait... this is the Safety and Training forum... I meant to say... Please drink responsibly and always have a designated driver. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
peregrinerose 0 #50 October 17, 2007 Hate to break this to you, but beer rules apply to everyone... At least at our DZ, I will let those who stay away from buying/drinking alcohol get away with buying at minimum 3 cases of soda or lots of gatorade to throw in the beer fridge, that way the penalty is paid and the non drinkers get something to drink too. Do or do not, there is no try -Yoda Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites