Elisha 1 #1 November 6, 2006 I'm just curious how long it takes a manufacturer to build a lineset. A certain manufacturer sent me the wrong one (their fault), and I'm just a little pissed...since it delays me by at least a week from getting in the air again. Don't want to say anymore. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
marinho 0 #2 November 6, 2006 QuoteI'm just curious how long it takes a manufacturer to build a lineset. A certain manufacturer sent me the wrong one (their fault), and I'm just a little pissed...since it delays me by at least a week from getting in the air again. Don't want to say anymore. Hi Elisha, Technically, it takes about an hour to make a lineset for a sport canopy. Sometimes, they have a lot of orders to be done and new employees. Once, it took almost a month to get a lineset, but the customer understood the situation and he's very happy with his new canopy. The good thing is that you're getting the lineset from the manufacturer. The way we do in our shop is we only get the customer's canopy when we receive the lineset. This way, the customer can jump until he gets the new lineset. Cheers,Gus Marinho Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
highspeeddirt 0 #3 November 6, 2006 depends on the canopy.when i worked for steve snyder we had some canopies that would take 14 hours to make a lineset Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Elisha 1 #4 November 6, 2006 OK. Thanks guys. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
beezyshaw 0 #5 November 6, 2006 QuoteTechnically, it takes about an hour to make a lineset for a sport canopy. Hey Gus, I think I want to contract my lineset manufacturing to your loft! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
marinho 0 #6 November 6, 2006 QuoteHey Gus, I think I want to contract my lineset manufacturing to your loft! Beezy my friend, what's up man?!?! Common on, you know it can be done. Specially with spectra lines!!!! ps. We don't make lineset in our shop! Cheers,Gus Marinho Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BKR 0 #7 November 6, 2006 Me too, are you looking for a job I pay you 1 hour per line set, great for me Jérôme Bunker Basik Air Concept www.basik.fr http://www.facebook.com/pages/Le-Luc-France/BASIK-AIR-CONCEPT/172133350468 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
diablopilot 2 #8 November 7, 2006 Why does it delay you? Was the old one damaged? Was it taken off before the new one arrived?---------------------------------------------- You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
FreeflyGoat 0 #9 November 7, 2006 Beezy, How long does it take you to make a lineset? thnx,_________________________ goat derka jerka bukkake jihad Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Elisha 1 #10 November 7, 2006 QuoteWhy does it delay you? Was the old one damaged? Was it taken off before the new one arrived? The rigger discovered it was wrong while installing it and then had to call to let them know and have them figure it out. They don't keep them stocked. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
slk2go 0 #11 November 10, 2006 Um just a thought this summer I walked into a conversation half way in so I apologize for not knowing all the details and I don't remember which company it was but... the canopy company being discussed only designed them and then out sourced the design to 3 seperate manufacturers, for some reson depending which company manufactured the canopy and the date they could require different line sets. also in this story the canopy company was not very helpful in resolvign the situation. same scenario? not that that helps but it may explain it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
beezyshaw 0 #12 November 10, 2006 QuoteHow long does it take you to make a lineset? On a Nitro or Blade, there are 36 suspension lines, 8 upper control lines, and of course 2 lower control lines, for a total of 94 finger-trapped sections and 94 passes under a sewing machine. So, considering the entire process, start to finish (including installing on the canopy), one person can do 2 canopies in an 8-hour work day. Now, in a more assembly-line fashion of a factory that would split the tasks among more people and such, it would probably be more like an average of 4 canopies per day per person involved. But productivity is much less when you "multi-task" like a typical rigger would do. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Cacophony 0 #13 November 11, 2006 My canopy is currently in its reline phase. Here is a tidbit from the email for PD support: Quotethanks for contacting us. We offer 500 lb HMA line sets for Velocity canopies. The price is $195 plus shipping, taxes and/or import duties. The lead time is around 4 - 5 days to build the linesets after receiving the order. We usually ship within 24 hours after completion. They did the inspection the day after they recieved the canopy and were ready to start working on it as soon as I gave the ok. PD rocks the party! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
riggerrob 561 #14 November 13, 2006 That is why I always stretch out the new line kit and compare it with the chart before cutting the old lines off the canopy. I learned this - the hard way - after Strong Enterprises and Aerodyne sent me "different" line kits. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Elisha 1 #15 November 13, 2006 QuoteThat is why I always stretch out the new line kit and compare it with the chart before cutting the old lines off the canopy. I learned this - the hard way - after Strong Enterprises and Aerodyne sent me "different" line kits. Well, I jumped my newly relined canopy this weekend. Now....what to do with a bundle of old spectra.....hmmmm... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
marinho 0 #16 November 13, 2006 QuoteWell, I jumped my newly relined canopy this weekend. Common on Elisha, give us a feedback how's your canopy is flying in comparison with the old lines!!! Cheers,Gus Marinho Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Elisha 1 #17 November 14, 2006 QuoteQuoteWell, I jumped my newly relined canopy this weekend. Common on Elisha, give us a feedback how's your canopy is flying in comparison with the old lines!!! Cheers, Well, I think I may need some of that Byron wind (there wasn't really any on Sunday!) to test better - to see it hopefully keep shape better. It definitely felt more uniform and seemed to flare more evenly (which would make sense since the lower steering lines are not 2" out of trim anymore). I'm happy. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Spizzzarko 0 #18 November 14, 2006 I thought you wanted to swoop? Wind doesn't do any good things for swooping. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Elisha 1 #19 November 14, 2006 QuoteI thought you wanted to swoop? Wind doesn't do any good things for swooping. I don't want wind! But to answer Marinho's question, next windy day (plenty of them at Byron) I'll be able to hopefully see the canopy weather (no pun intended) the bumps better than before. Now...back to the swoop thing...go read AggieDave's respone again - how are we defining a swoop? If I do a regular straight in approach and two-stage flare (holding half brakes to plane out or "surf" or "swoop") in stead of doing one, slow smooth motion, am I swooping? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Spizzzarko 0 #20 November 14, 2006 If you want definitions then ask Brian Germain. He has a tendancy to define things. But if I were to define a swoop, it would be as follows: Forward movement over the ground that is caused by bleeding off excess energy in the flare of a parachute. How you achieve that can come from many ways, but to achieve the "swoop" longer, some methods are better than others. The "two staged flare" is a shitty way to explain how to swoop. Read the following and you can get some more insight on why the "two staged flare" is a flawed logic. "I think when people are talking about staged flares they are just passing on bad information! Think of it this way. in it's simplist form there are 3 areas to a landing. 1. Approach 2. Plane out 3. Stopping To transition from your approach to plane out, you need to give input to the canopy wether it be toggles or rears. Now do you stop from there? NO. You have to give more input to the canopy to transition from plane out to stopping, correct? Now I'm going to introduce a little bit more of a radical concept here, so everyone take a second and catch your breath..... Let's first of all get rid of this concept of a two or three staged flare. You don't come in flare halfway, stop, and then flare the rest of the way do you? If so you are doing it wrong. Does that method work? Yes, sometimes, but we are a little more advanced than that, aren't we? I believed this concept was brought about by the old timers who were transitioning from F-111 to ZP canopy's. They used this when their canopy's would ballon up when they flared all the way like they were used to with their F-111's. Let's take the three area's that I spoke of earlier and make them into just one. 1. Landing You need to start thinking this way because, when you are transitioning to smaller faster canopy's, landing doesn't just happen when your altitude reaches zero. Many of the high speed low drag dudes here will probably agree with me that landing for them starts just after they get everything stowed away after opening. Watch them, and talk to them, and you will soon see that every manuever they make is to set up for landing. There's really no more "Playing Around" when you get to small canopy's. Now let's get back to Landing. Your approach flare and stopping should all be one smooth movement. Only flare as much as you need to maintain the altitude above the ground that you want. Try looking at the horizon during this part of you landing. I want you to standup right now and look at a far door knob or something out your window on the horizon. Now stand on your toes, and then back on your flat feet. Do you see the difference in your sight picture? Now how much have you actually moved? 3 to 4 inches if that. Now that you have that mastered, think about continuing your flare only as much as you need to, so that your sight picture doesn't change! I told you it was going to get radicle! Now that we are flying flat and level over the gound we eventually need to stop. Well just keep flaring, and maintaining your sight picture. Eventually you will have flared so much that your canopy will no longer beable to produce the amount of lift required to hold your body in the air. This is usually when you put your feet down on the ground. I can't tell you how many people I see that don't fly their canopy to it's fullest potential, and then complain that their canopy doesn't have enough flare to support their fat ass's, and that they need to get a Velocity because it has a more powerfull flare Learn to flare your canopy all of the way. You should not have to run out your landings very much if you are flaring it correctly, even on low wind to no wind days. If you change your thought process, and learn to fly your canopy to it's fullest then you will be unstopable!" This is more suited for the canopy control forum so let's make some sort of mention of lines in this post: Inspect your lines after every day of jumping. Do not jump worn lines. They are relatively cheap to replace and don't let the cost prevent you from jumping well maintained gear. Nothing in aviation is cheap and you get what you pay for for the most part when it comes to gear. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites marinho 0 #21 November 14, 2006 QuoteWind doesn't do any good things for swooping. QuoteWhere did you get that from?Gus Marinho Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites marinho 0 #22 November 14, 2006 QuoteBut if I were to define a swoop, it would be as follows... QuoteMaybe you should review you views here!! Be safe & have fun,Gus Marinho Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Spizzzarko 0 #23 November 14, 2006 Think about it... If your goal is to swoop, and that being moving horivontally over the ground, then flying into a strong wind will limit your ability to achieve said goal. Down wind is a different story, but we will not get into that here and now. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Spizzzarko 0 #24 November 14, 2006 Maybe you should review you views here!! What do you mean by that? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites marinho 0 #25 November 14, 2006 QuoteThink about it... If your goal is to swoop, and that being moving horivontally over the ground, then flying into a strong wind will limit your ability to achieve said goal. Down wind is a different story, but we will not get into that here and now. Agreed! But you can use the winds to your favor! Cheers,Gus Marinho Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Prev 1 2 Next Page 1 of 2 Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. Display as a link instead × Your previous content has been restored. Clear editor × You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL. Insert image from URL × Desktop Tablet Phone Submit Reply 0 Go To Topic Listing
Spizzzarko 0 #18 November 14, 2006 I thought you wanted to swoop? Wind doesn't do any good things for swooping. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Elisha 1 #19 November 14, 2006 QuoteI thought you wanted to swoop? Wind doesn't do any good things for swooping. I don't want wind! But to answer Marinho's question, next windy day (plenty of them at Byron) I'll be able to hopefully see the canopy weather (no pun intended) the bumps better than before. Now...back to the swoop thing...go read AggieDave's respone again - how are we defining a swoop? If I do a regular straight in approach and two-stage flare (holding half brakes to plane out or "surf" or "swoop") in stead of doing one, slow smooth motion, am I swooping? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Spizzzarko 0 #20 November 14, 2006 If you want definitions then ask Brian Germain. He has a tendancy to define things. But if I were to define a swoop, it would be as follows: Forward movement over the ground that is caused by bleeding off excess energy in the flare of a parachute. How you achieve that can come from many ways, but to achieve the "swoop" longer, some methods are better than others. The "two staged flare" is a shitty way to explain how to swoop. Read the following and you can get some more insight on why the "two staged flare" is a flawed logic. "I think when people are talking about staged flares they are just passing on bad information! Think of it this way. in it's simplist form there are 3 areas to a landing. 1. Approach 2. Plane out 3. Stopping To transition from your approach to plane out, you need to give input to the canopy wether it be toggles or rears. Now do you stop from there? NO. You have to give more input to the canopy to transition from plane out to stopping, correct? Now I'm going to introduce a little bit more of a radical concept here, so everyone take a second and catch your breath..... Let's first of all get rid of this concept of a two or three staged flare. You don't come in flare halfway, stop, and then flare the rest of the way do you? If so you are doing it wrong. Does that method work? Yes, sometimes, but we are a little more advanced than that, aren't we? I believed this concept was brought about by the old timers who were transitioning from F-111 to ZP canopy's. They used this when their canopy's would ballon up when they flared all the way like they were used to with their F-111's. Let's take the three area's that I spoke of earlier and make them into just one. 1. Landing You need to start thinking this way because, when you are transitioning to smaller faster canopy's, landing doesn't just happen when your altitude reaches zero. Many of the high speed low drag dudes here will probably agree with me that landing for them starts just after they get everything stowed away after opening. Watch them, and talk to them, and you will soon see that every manuever they make is to set up for landing. There's really no more "Playing Around" when you get to small canopy's. Now let's get back to Landing. Your approach flare and stopping should all be one smooth movement. Only flare as much as you need to maintain the altitude above the ground that you want. Try looking at the horizon during this part of you landing. I want you to standup right now and look at a far door knob or something out your window on the horizon. Now stand on your toes, and then back on your flat feet. Do you see the difference in your sight picture? Now how much have you actually moved? 3 to 4 inches if that. Now that you have that mastered, think about continuing your flare only as much as you need to, so that your sight picture doesn't change! I told you it was going to get radicle! Now that we are flying flat and level over the gound we eventually need to stop. Well just keep flaring, and maintaining your sight picture. Eventually you will have flared so much that your canopy will no longer beable to produce the amount of lift required to hold your body in the air. This is usually when you put your feet down on the ground. I can't tell you how many people I see that don't fly their canopy to it's fullest potential, and then complain that their canopy doesn't have enough flare to support their fat ass's, and that they need to get a Velocity because it has a more powerfull flare Learn to flare your canopy all of the way. You should not have to run out your landings very much if you are flaring it correctly, even on low wind to no wind days. If you change your thought process, and learn to fly your canopy to it's fullest then you will be unstopable!" This is more suited for the canopy control forum so let's make some sort of mention of lines in this post: Inspect your lines after every day of jumping. Do not jump worn lines. They are relatively cheap to replace and don't let the cost prevent you from jumping well maintained gear. Nothing in aviation is cheap and you get what you pay for for the most part when it comes to gear. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
marinho 0 #21 November 14, 2006 QuoteWind doesn't do any good things for swooping. QuoteWhere did you get that from?Gus Marinho Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
marinho 0 #22 November 14, 2006 QuoteBut if I were to define a swoop, it would be as follows... QuoteMaybe you should review you views here!! Be safe & have fun,Gus Marinho Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Spizzzarko 0 #23 November 14, 2006 Think about it... If your goal is to swoop, and that being moving horivontally over the ground, then flying into a strong wind will limit your ability to achieve said goal. Down wind is a different story, but we will not get into that here and now. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Spizzzarko 0 #24 November 14, 2006 Maybe you should review you views here!! What do you mean by that? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites marinho 0 #25 November 14, 2006 QuoteThink about it... If your goal is to swoop, and that being moving horivontally over the ground, then flying into a strong wind will limit your ability to achieve said goal. Down wind is a different story, but we will not get into that here and now. Agreed! But you can use the winds to your favor! Cheers,Gus Marinho Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Prev 1 2 Next Page 1 of 2 Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. Display as a link instead × Your previous content has been restored. Clear editor × You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL. Insert image from URL × Desktop Tablet Phone Submit Reply 0
Spizzzarko 0 #23 November 14, 2006 Think about it... If your goal is to swoop, and that being moving horivontally over the ground, then flying into a strong wind will limit your ability to achieve said goal. Down wind is a different story, but we will not get into that here and now. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Spizzzarko 0 #24 November 14, 2006 Maybe you should review you views here!! What do you mean by that? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
marinho 0 #25 November 14, 2006 QuoteThink about it... If your goal is to swoop, and that being moving horivontally over the ground, then flying into a strong wind will limit your ability to achieve said goal. Down wind is a different story, but we will not get into that here and now. Agreed! But you can use the winds to your favor! Cheers,Gus Marinho Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
