Sluggo_Monster

All, Speaking of “The Cooper "flame," here is an article from yesterday’s (Ogden, UT) Standard-Examiner. It is old stuff but a little more detailed than before. D.B. Cooper mystery -- Did witness see hijacker's parachute? By Scott Schwebke (Standard-Examiner staff) May 22 2010 - 10:20pm OGDEN -- A report of a fireball in the sky and a veiled threat from a mysterious man in a dark suit could aid a lawyer's dogged quest to prove a former Weber State ROTC instructor was infamous skyjacker D.B. Cooper. Galen Cook, a Spokane, Wash., attorney says he's found perhaps the only eyewitness to Cooper's daring parachute escape from a Boeing 727 more than 38 years ago into the dark abyss of the Pacific Northwest. Cook, who has been pursuing the Cooper case for more than two decades and is writing a book about his investigation, believes a woman named Janet may have seen the hijacker as he jumped from the plane carrying road flares and a $200,000 ransom. "Janet has no reason whatsoever to lie, so I believe her story," Cook said in an e-mail to the Standard-Examiner. "I have a suspect (William "Wolfgang" Gossett) who worked for the military, was a trained military parachuter, had special knowledge of aircraft and CIA operations in Southeast Asia, was obsessed with road flares, and retired from the Army at Fort Lewis, Wash. (near where the D.B. Cooper incident took place)." The Cooper case is perhaps the most baffling unsolved crime in FBI history. On Nov. 24,1971, Cooper commandeered a Boeing 727 en route from Portland, Ore., to Seattle. After receiving a $200,000 ransom, walked down the plane's rear stairs and parachuted into the stormy night. Cook maintains Gossett, a former ROTC instructor at Weber State who was 73 when he died in 2003 in Oregon, is the elusive hijacker. He described Gossett as the consummate chameleon who eluded authorities despite a string of highly visible jobs that included private investigator, radio talk show host and priest in the Old Roman Catholic Church. Cook contends Gossett managed to keep his involvement in the Cooper caper under the radar of law enforcement, but confessed the crime to several people, including a son, Gregg Gossett, who lives in Ogden, Maurice Richards, an attorney from South Ogden, now deceased, and Jim Bjornsen, a close friend and lawyer in Newport, Ore. Cook also believes Janet may be the only person to have seen the hijacker jump from the Boeing 727 after it took off from Seattle International Airport en route to Mexico City. Friend's death He learned of Janet's eyewitness account in 2009 following the death of his long-time friend and fellow Cooper hunter Richard Tosaw. Tosaw, a former FBI agent and attorney from California, wrote a 1984 book entitled, "D.B. Cooper: Dead or Alive?, and kept extensive files on his investigation. After Tosaw died, his staff gave Cook some of those files, including one that contained a 1985 interview with Janet. Cook was stunned and excited when he read Janet's account. "To say the least, I was ecstatic as both an investigator and an attorney," he said. "Her report could change the course and the scope of the case, and in part, answer some of the more intriguing questions. Nowhere, in any records that I have found, is there any reference to an eye-witness to the Cooper jump. Yet there she was. There is something very credible and compelling about her story." Janet, who is 65 and requested that her last name be withheld to protect her privacy, told the Standard-Examiner in her first public interview she's certain she saw Cooper jump from the hijacked jet. Eyewitness? Janet recalled that late in the afternoon on Nov. 24, 1971 she had just gotten off work from her job as a billing clerk at Wilhelm Trucking Co. in northwest Portland and was heading to a beauty shop appointment. Suddenly a news bulletin came on her car radio regarding the Cooper hijacking. Janet had her hair done at the salon and didn't give much thought to the news as she drove to her home in nearby Vancouver, Wash. After reaching the house, she and her husband loaded their two children into the family's Datsun to take them to a babysitter so they could go to dinner at the nearby upscale Key Hotel. Janet, who was in the passenger seat, looked up just as the car was backing out of the driveway and saw a light pass overhead. A platform or ladder below a plane caught her eye. "What I saw was flames and thought I saw something on the platform which could have been a person," Janet said. Immediately, the fireball arched away from the platform, split into two and then disappeared in the direction of the Columbia River. Cook believes the fireball Janet saw was Gossett tossing some road flares made to look like a dynamite bomb to judge wind direction to safely guide him to the ground. Cook said his research has shown winds were blowing from the southeast at more than 60 knots in the Portland area around the time of the hijacking. "This kind of wind speed would likely cause a falling flarepack to appear fiery, as reported by Janet," he said. Janet's sighting of the fireball fits with William Gossett's penchant for road flares, said his son, Gregg Gossett. "My father had an obsession with road flares," he said. "He used to light them off for me when I was a kid. There were tons of them around our house growing up." Man in black Janet said that a few days later, after deciding that the fiery object had something to do with the Cooper case, she sent a letter to the FBI field office in Portland. She wasn't prepared for what happened next. Several days later a mysterious, intimidating man in a dark business suit knocked on her door and asked for her by name. Janet said the man, who did not identify himself as an FBI agent or police officer, told her the letter had been received and ordered her to "shut the fxxx up" about it. "I was scared to death," she said. Cook believes the mysterious man was an FBI agent warning Janet not to go to the press because the FBI and other law enforcement agencies were expending considerable resources looking for Cooper near Lake Merwin, 35 miles north of Vancouver. "This would have splintered the FBI's progress and maybe prevented them from capturing D.B. Cooper," he said. FBI Special Agent Larry Carr, who has been overseeing the Cooper investigation, could not be reached for comment. 1985 meeting Janet didn't mention the possible Cooper sighting again publicly until 1985 when she met with Tosaw who was in Portland to promote his book on the hijacking. "When I told Richard...you could see by the look on his face that he absolutely believed it was him (Cooper)," she said. Cook believes he knows why Tosaw didn't follow up on Janet's tip or tell him about it. "Tosaw did not share his info about Janet's eyewitnessing because he thought he had special information that would help him solve the case," said Cook. "The problem is that Tosaw also believed Cooper died during the jump. Any extraneous info indicating Cooper survived would not have fit nicely into Tosaw's version of events. I, on the other hand, believe that Cooper survived the jump and went back to the Salt Lake City area where he lived a relatively quiet life on the run." Cook believes William Gossett planned the hijacking to coincide with Thanksgiving week vacation at Weber State so that he wouldn't be missed. Cook maintains William Gossett probably landed on the Oregon side of the Columbia River, somewhere west of Portland. After spending the night in the woods, he probably made his way to Portland International Airport, took a plane to San Francisco and then traveled to Utah, he said. Battle Ground site The FBI now maintains that Cooper didn't exit near Lake Merwin but near Battle Ground, Wash., about seven miles north of the Columbia River, but didn't survive the jump because the parachute he used couldn't be steered and his clothing and footwear weren't suitable for a rough landing. In 1980, 8-year-old Brian Ingram found on the banks of the Columbia River a rotting package of $20 bills totaling $5,800 that matched serial numbers of the Cooper ransom money, further bolstering the claim that the hijacker was killed, according to the FBI. However, the money could have been planted by William Gossett to throw off authorities, Cook said. Cook maintains that while William Gossett may have needed the ransom money to pay off gambling debts, there was possibly a "higher moral mission" for the hijacking. He claims to have uncovered information indicating William Gossett may have committed the crime because he was upset about a clandestine government operation during the Vietnam conflict. Recent visit Meanwhile, Cook recently visited Janet's former home in Vancouver. Using a radar map, Cook has determined the hijacked jet passed directly over Janet's house and the direction of the fireball she saw drifting away from the plane is in alignment with the river bank where some of the ransom money was found. Cook said Janet's eyewitness account backed up by physical data has convinced him he's closer than ever to solving the Cooper case. "When that happened, it urged me on to pick up the pace and the cold trail of the skyjacker." I have attached a photo of “Janet.” If you want to see the article go HERE Web Page Blog NORJAK Forum

Now, wasn’t that special? All, For those you care (and I’m sure there are some of you out there), I just found out that Larry Carr (Ckret) was promoted and is heading to the Washington, DC area (actually just a little south of there). He said; “I’m not taking the NORJAK case with me but I’ll still be involved with it if the need arises.” The really important thing about Ckret making this move is that it will help him with a health issue he has been experiencing for the last eight-years. You see… Larry has something called CGD (Clinical Grits Deficiency). While in Seattle, gulping down Starbuck’s and Seattle’s Best coffee, he was ignoring his body’s natural need for Grits in his diet. CGD causes your speech to become rapid and clipped, your natural pace to speed up, and it makes you rude and impatient with others. So, now, after eight-years, he will be able to have grits with his breakfast every morning and hence restore his health. In little or no time, he will be talking slower, moving at a snail's-pace, and displaying the “patience of Job” when dealing with difficult personal interactions. Heck, maybe after eight-years in the South (capital ‘S’, he (and every member of his family) will be able to explain on TV what the tornado sounded like. I can just see and hear it now, Larry, standing in his pajama’s saying; “Id went whooo-ooo-ooo… jus’ lik one-o-them freight trains, I ne’er hear’d ana thang lik it since one o’ them B-1 Bum’ers landed at the ar fors base ov’r yonder!”

It is no longer the K-T (Cretaceous-Tertiary) boundary. Now, it’s the K-Pg (Cretaceous-Paleogene) boundary. The historic “Tertiary” comprises the Paleogene and Neogene, and has no official rank per the International Commission on Stratigraphy. I’m just saying.

All, I’m not giving a geology lesson, or writing a biography of Tom Kaye, but, for those of you who don’t know… Tom spends a lot of his time mucking around in the K-T Boundary. The K-T boundary is a geological anomaly which contains unusual iridium concentrations due to a large meteor collision about 65 Million years ago. Many feel this was what caused the dinosaur extenction of 65 Million years ago. I saw this (attached file) and thought of Tom. I sent it to him and I thought (since you are talking about iridium) you guys might get a chuckle out of it (georger especially). Sluggo Web Page Blog NORJAK Forum

All, Oh Boy! You will never know how much it kills me to make this post! I know you guys will massacre me after this, but, I’ve always said: “I am open minded, but not so open my brains fall out.” So here goes… The last two long posts by Bruce are so fantastic that I tend to ignore the info as “telling tall tales” (the subjects he interviewed, not his reporting). I still feel the same way, however, I feel it is incumbent on me (in the interest of honesty) to make this statement: ”The story told in the last post by Bruce parallels (in many ways) information given to me (in confidence) by Skyjack71 years ago.” That’s the statement (no more, no less). There could be a million reasons for the parallel aspects of her story and Don Burnworth’s story. His story has some “material false statements in it. He may have been in contact with her recently and felt like by making his story parallel to her's he could gain traction. I JUST DON’T KNOW! I have distanced myself from Skyjack71 because I felt like she ruined her credibility and could potentially ruin mine (by association). I have been quick to criticize her for her “leaps of logic,” none of that has changed. If she wants to present (formerly withheld) information, I think we owe it to her to listen. If she makes her “typical illogical and circumstantial associations,” that’s her prerogative, we (I) don’t have to give any weight to her conclusions. But, I hope she chooses to weigh in with her information. Now, all of you piranhas, take a big bite of Sluggo, it’s flavorful, tender, satisfying, and filling… but most of all… honest. Web Page Blog NORJAK Forum

Bruce et.al., I don't have much time, but here's something to chew on. The spelling probably should be Burnworth not Burnsworth. DONALD O BURNWORTH 640 S BEAR CLAW PRESCOTT,AZ 86301 Married to Nancy on 8/02/73 From divorce proceedings November 1, 1977: 6 Shortly after garnishment of Donald's employer, United Airlines, Chicago, Illinois, Donald made special appearance in the Oklahoma case seeking by motion to set aside the default judgment, to quash the garnishment, and to dismiss the cause. See: BURNWORTH v. BURNWORTH No. 50138. 572 P.2d 301 1977 OK CIV APP 52 Decided: November 1, 1977. Court of Appeals of Oklahoma, Division No. 2. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- NANCY BURNWORTH, APPELLEE, v. DONALD O. BURNWORTH, APPELLANT. Appeal from the District Court of Oklahoma County; Bill Biggers, Trial Judge. Also see: U.S. Patent Number 4,317,177 Power priority control system for aircraft and test apparatus therefor February 23, 1982 Inventor Donald O. Burnworth, Arvada, CO Web Page Blog NORJAK Forum

Excellent idea Skywhuffo, I have a lot of business activity this week and a long weekend trip this weekend (No! Not to Darlington), but I’ll get on it early next week. Look for it in a couple of weeks. Farflung, Excellent analysis! I’ve been too busy to respond, I haven’t had time to post the whole charts on my site. I’ll post about it next week. Sluggo Web Page Blog NORJAK Forum

Yes, it was in jest. I am truly sorry, I did not mean to offend. That’s twice now I have offended someone here with my use of a depreciating term used as endearment (the other was Orange1 and the “Sky-Ape/Bird-Turd” term). I guess I was just poorly socialized, but, it is the way I talk. If I didn’t “like” you I would be EXTRODINARY POLITE and call you Sir and Ma’am. I guess you guys are just accustomed to dealing with trolls and it would never occur to you that if I really thought of you as animals in a zoo, I wouldn’t bother to post here. Comments? (Like I have to ask.) Sluggo Web Page Blog NORJAK Forum

All, As I mentioned previously a “friend-of-the-site” has made a 1971 Seattle Sectional Chart available for posting (at no cost to me). I was prepared to spend around $200 and 3-months waiting, but he saved me all the trouble. I haven’t posted the chart on my site yet, because the scans are very high resolution and I am having trouble getting Adobe Photoshop to handle the files on my computer. (Each side of the chart is a 2Gbyte file.) Now, I know some of you don’t understand my fascination with the historic maps and charts, but I feel that when you consider all the time and words wasted in the last 38 years looking at the case, a little bit of time spent with the charts and maps that were current at the time might yield something that has been missed looking at modern charts/maps. The chart that Ckret supplied (with the flight-path marked on it) is of questionable origin. I have always referred to it as a “1971 Seattle Sectional”. Now I can say with certainty that is not! So, now I will refer to it as the “Mystery Chart”. It may be a Northwest WAC Chart, an early 1972 Sectional Chart (I don’t think so), or a pre-1971 Seattle Sectional. With no legend, scale, or other information, anyone’s guess is as good as mine. The (for-real) 1971 Seattle Sectional is different from the Mystery Chart. NOTE: The color is not an issue, there were some primitive color copiers that didn’t match color very well. While breaking down the charts, I noticed something I thought I would share with “The Zoo” here at DZ.com. Attached are the following files: 1971 Seattle Sectional Date of Use.jpg This file is just to show doubters and accusers that I really do have a copy of the chart that was current on November 21, 1971. The chart was valid from July 22, 1971 until February 3, 1972 1971-Seattle-Sectional-Symbols-RED.jpg This will help you to understand the symbols used in aviation charts in 1971. FBI Mystery Chart.jpg This is a small segment of the Mystery Chart centered around Portland. 1971 Seattle Sectional (Compare).jpg This is the (approximately) same area as the section of Mystery Chart above. Now, let’s play the “How Many Things Are Different Game?” Compare the two charts. One thing that I’d like for you to notice (the main thing) is that Scholls Airport (in Orchards) had a DZ in November of 1971. Does anyone know the name of this DZ and who operated it? Quite some time ago, in one of my first communications with the FBI, I was told that there was some “new thinking” that indicated Cooper may have jumped farther south and landed “near Orchards.” About that same time, an Investigative Journalist asked me where Orchards was (he/she couldn’t find it on a map). So… what do you guys think? Sluggo Web Page Blog NORJAK Forum

The REAL reason I haven't posted lately is I heard SKYWHUFFO and Mrs. Whuffo DID NOT name their child Sluggo or Sluggette. I'm pissed! Congrats on the new addition. Now... it begins... be afraid... be VERY afraid! Web Page Blog NORJAK Forum

I’m gonna need the help of some “wrinkled, old-fart, pilots”. I got the Legend off of the L-2 Side of the Low Altitude IFR chart from 1971 posted on my site, but there are a lot of terms that I may need help understanding. [See it here] Not that any of this will find Cooper, but it will help me with “aviation history”. For example what do these things mean? DOD FLIP Terminal? “A” Quadrant? Consola Station? Bone Marker Beacon? Fan Marker Beacon? CMSN? Frequency Protection (T)? Flight Information Region (FIR)? Okay, what do you "old wrinkles" have to say? Guru312, quade, Bueller… Bueller… anyone? Web Page Blog NORJAK Forum

AncestralManor, Yes, I agree. BUT………. Why don’t you take the reins on this issue? In the past I have attempted to do this sort of thing, but due to some basic element(s) of my personality, I have been unable to carry it off (make it work). Some accuse me of being patriarchal, some accuse me of being condescending to other (less informed) posters, some just like to see me fail. So, now it’s time for you to “step up to the batter’s box.” Remember; “Many are cold, but few are frozen” (Or something like that!). Here are my point-by-point’ responses: Yes, let’s get back to CAVA, you tabulate where we are now and introduce the next CAVA Question. (Note: Be sure to be all inclusive and don’t piss anyone off.) So, cite even one “original source.” In over thirty years, I have yet to find one. Was that straight out of Bill Scott’s mouth or from an “Original Source?” Yes, there is a still-living witness who was a radar operator following the flight. He says: “They were never significantly off of Victor-23.” He wishes to remain anonymous and does not want his name published. So good luck with your citation(s). (Sluggo Note: He said V-23, not V-23 E or V-23 W. The flight was cleared for V-23.) Ahh! So, now I understand “Original Source.” I have more maps (historical and otherwise) that you can shake as stick at, but, I can’t get them to tell me a damned thing! Duh? I don’t know. Eyewitnesses maybe? Not Himmelsbach, he has a theory. Maybe if we could find Cooper, he would clue us in. But probably not. I tried that, didn’t work… maybe because of my personality and approach (see above). Okay, find a focus and get everyone (or most everyone) to agree and stick to it. (Like the CAVA process.) Ditto from the above. Most descriptions are something like this: “15 miles NW of the search area,” or “On the side of Brokeback Ridge”. I don’t think the finder(s) could have told you exactly where they found it. They didn’t say to themselves; “WOW! We found a placard from Flt. 305! This will be important, we need to remember where we are!” They thought it was a candy wrapper and didn’t read it until they were putting it into the trash. A few “low-value” eyewitnesses that thought they heard a plane overhead. They came out of the woodwork initially and then again in recent years. You’ve seen it… I’ve seen it… NWA (now Delta) is still sitting on unpublished info, but I haven’t been able to get access to it. You and Ruby Tuesday too! Seriously, I’m sorry if this seems overly cynical. It started out to be an attempt at humor… but it triggered all my frustrations. I have thought of all of this in the past and been thwarted at every turn. The only solution I can see is to ask President Obama to appoint a panel (committee) of citizens, give them subpoena powers, and make the FBI, and NWA open up their records. (Oh yeah… include the CIA to make skyjack71 happy). I don’t think there’s much chance of that happening. Thank you (all) for the opportunity to vent my frustration. Now I’m going to go ride my bicycle and see if I can wear down some of my other stress builders. Web Page Blog NORJAK Forum

All, What follows is an example of why we (this thread) never make any progress. {SPECIAL NOTE TO GEORGER: Please, don’t take this personally… it is just a convenient example of something that I think is hurting us as a group. I could dig out examples that involve me, 377, orange1 or anyone else. This example just happens to be something that I was replying to, and thought I would use it to segue into the issue.} See This Post by Sluggo_Monster where I show what map the FBI LZ was plotted on. (The 1954 La Center Quadrangle Topo.) In that post I explain that the map used was a 1:62,500 scale topo-map produced by the Army Corps of Engineers. And that the 1:24,000 scale (7½ minute) USGS maps of that area did not exist in 1971. That is why there are no modern maps with the La Center name. This map, last updated in 1954 was the current 1:62,500 scale map in 1971. I don’t blame georger for missing (or forgetting) that post. Anyone could have missed or forgotten it. With all the back-biting, carping, flaming, and insults that go on here, the signal just gets lost in the noise. We (the regular posters on this thread) have a WEALTH OF KNOWLEDGE about NORJAK, we just don’t have a parliamentarian to keep us in order (that’s NOT quade’s job) or a recording secretary to keep a history of the things we decide. At any rate, we DO know what map was used for the plot of the FBI LZ. Edit: Here is a direct link to the LZ Map (in color). Web Page Blog NORJAK Forum

I have posted (on my site and referenced it here) a Low Level Enroute Chart valid from Nov. 11 to Dec. 9, 1971. The current chart during NORJAK and the one which would have been supplied to the flight crew of Flt 305. I haven’t even had a chance to look it over yet. I am not stating, or implying that this changes anything as far as actual flight path. I am not implying or stating that Flt. 305 passed over the City of Portland or over Portland International Airport. The only thing I have stated, is, that what is now called the BTG VORTAC was called PDX VORTAC at that time. I also suggested that you guys search through logs, transcripts, and any other data you might have for references to distance from PDX (remember Sluggo = Librarian, you guys = Researchers and Investigators). This might show that previous assumptions based on reported distance from PDX (the airport) were really 11 statute miles North of previously assumed, because they were actually referencing PDX (the VORTAC now called BTG). I am not a scientist by profession (even though I have held the title “Senior Scientist,” but that’s just the guv’ment’s way of getting me the money I asked for) but I do try to apply the scientific method. That means… tiny little incremental steps, not giant leaps. I have provided you with another tool… nothing more… nothing less. I’ve been at this (studying NORJAK) for about 35 years now, I’m patient, I can take time to think, study, and learn… and then form theories. +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Sluggo’s Quoteable Quotes: “Study to show thyself approved unto God, a workman who needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.” - - - - - - 2 Timothy 2:15 (21st Century King James Version) [Not bad… for an atheist… huh?] +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Web Page Blog NORJAK Forum

I want to apologize. I should not have been so vague (and sort of mysterious). My only excuse is that it was late and I had a long day. As I said before, I have had no time to look at the chart myself. I view myself as a librarian more than an investigator and sharing the info is more important to me than cogitating how the info might affect my beliefs about NORJAK. The first thing I noticed (I was tipped off by Robert before the file arrived) was that what is now the BTG VORTAC was then the PDX VOR. [BTW: This is shown on the FBI’s Sectional, I just never noticed it.] It was the same frequency, same location just a different name. PDX is now the PORTLAND VOR/DME located “on field at PDX Airport. On the 1971 L-1 the airport was I-PDX. So what needs to be done is to re-scan all the flight communications and find references to PDX. Why? Because there is an 11 statute mile difference between the 1971 PDX (the nav-aid) and current PDX the airport. I had thought (yesterday) that one of the reporting points that I plotted on my “missing minute” plot was expressed as “On V-23 XX DME from PDX". This morning I’m thinking it might have been reference to SEA instead of PDX. I may be wrong, but I’ll have to have time to re-think it. (It’s been two years and I’ve slept since then.) So, is this going to solve NORJAK? Probably not, but it may shed some light on the possibility of a different jump location. It will give us a chance to argue “Interpreted language” used by the crew vs. “perceived language” as we hear it today. It’s sort of like the flaps issue (i.e. Did Cooper say “Flaps down,” “landing configuration,” or “flaps to 15-degrees.”) I’m hoping the L-2 chart will have a symbol-legend on it to help me understand the symbol-ogy of 1971. I’m sorry that I didn’t meet your expectations. You may copy them from my site, resize them, and place them on your site. Then your expectations will be met. I mistakenly though that, after hundreds of dollars and months of work (on Robert’s part), getting them out (for free) to serious investigators was more important. He is a person who is seriously trying to do analysis of the flight dynamics and possible errors in the FBI-determined LZ. He certainly has the background to do it. He doesn’t post on DZ.com because your favorite (former) poster was snide and sarcastic when he sent a PM asking a serious question. See A Post About Robert. ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Sluggo's Quotable Quotes: "I like long walks, especially when they are taken by people who annoy me." ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Web Page Blog NORJAK Forum

All, I’ve posted the L-1 Side of the United States Government Flight Information Publication “Enroute Low Altitude – U. S.” chart on N467US.com. The effective date is: 11 NOV 1971 to 09 DEC 1971. This is a JPEG of the chart supplied to Flight 305 while on the ground at SEA. I added some additional files that are mostly “Splits” of this chart to provide more manageable files for analysis. I’m not going to say much about my interpretation of the info as it relates to assumptions made about NORJAK in the past. Not because I want to be mysterious (like skyjack71), but because I want to see if others see what I see and interpret it the same. I haven’t had the time to really go over this chart while looking at the FBI flight path drawn on what I have always assumed was a late 1971 or early 1972 Seattle Sectional, and reading the transcripts and plotting reports. I have no idea where the chart the FBI plotted on came from, but I don’t think it was in effect in November 1971. There are some things that I want to check, before I start “popping off at the mouth” about how this chart changes some of my theories. NOTE: A small amount of recognition here. These files were made possible by the hard work and generosity of Robert Nicholson. Robert is truly a “Friend-of-N467US.com.” It took him months to track down the originals and cost many $’s to get them scanned and printed (at original scale). Robert made a copy of the CD and shipped it to me (overnight delivery) the very day he received it. The L-2 side (which may not be any help) is due in any day now. I will start working on the Seattle Sectional for the same period on Monday. If it is available, it will take a few months to get the work done. Take a look at the two files labeled “2010 L-1 (Portland Area)” and “1971 L-1 (Portland Area)”. These print nicely on an 8.5” x 11” page for easy comparison of the area most people will be interested in. These two, relatively small files, contain the meat of the issue that has my attention. Due to the fact that these are charts use for flights at low altitude operating under Instrument Flight Rules (IFR), I am particularly interested in hearing from pilots. Send me your comments via my site. (SLUGGOatN467USdotcom) Oh! I almost forgot… (It’s getting late!) You can find the files HERE. Web Page Blog NORJAK Forum

Orange1 said: Orange1, Yes, unfortunately. Just like school kids… amazing! I have done all I can do to attempt to help turn this thread into something useful, maybe someone else has some ideas. Skyjack71 said: Jo, You are one screwed-up woman. When things don’t go your way, you blame everybody but the one responsible (you). And then you have the gall to send a e-mail, looking for sympathy, or whatever. If you are looking for sympathy, it’s in the dictionary between “Shit” and Syphilis.” No one is going to sue anyone! Again, you do not seem to understand the internet (it ain’t the “real-world”). You state that you can’t say anything in public, then go ahead and list a string of parameters that would let even a simpleton figure out the relationship. What a nut-case you have become. To let someone like Jerry pull your strings shows how desperate you are for attention. I don’t know where the Jo Weber I met in 2003 went, but the Jo Weber of 2010 isn’t even close. Jerry accuses me of being on your side, you accuse me of being on Jerry’s side, or ckret’s side, or georger’s side. Well, guess what, I’m only on Sluggo’s side. Just because I treat people with dignity and respect, doesn’t mean I have some sort of affinity to/for them! All, Like many others, I have given up on my hope that this thread will help me gather any useful information. BUT, I do have some interesting new information to share. I have just received the Enroute Low Altitude – U.S. L-1 Chart with an effective date of 11 NOV 1971 through 9 DEC 1971. This chart has some surprises on it! I have been operating under some false assumptions based on current (and the FBI –supplied chart)! This is the chart given to the crew of Flt.305 so they could fly according to their clearance. I will make .jpgs of this chart and post them on my web site no later than Monday (hopefully). The info on these charts will make me give up on some of my most sacred theories. [NOTE: You see Jo, this is how it works… You form a theory, you defend your theory, then when presented with factual information that doesn’t fit your theory, you modify the theory and move on.] I will make a post (on this thread) when I put the charts on the site. These charts (L-1 and L-2 from 1971) were made possible due to much work (and expense) of a “Friend of N467US.com.” He ordered and paid for L-1 and L-2, so I am going to order the Seattle Sectional from the same period. It may take 3 months to get the chart (if it is available). In the mean-time you guys know what forums, blogs, and e-mail addresses to contact me at. Sluggo ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Sluggo’s Quotable Quotes: “Time flies like an arrow… Fruit flies like a banana!” And especially for Jo: "Just because I don't care doesn't mean I don't understand." ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Web Page Blog NORJAK Forum

I thought for a while there that I had “Killed the thread.” I posted Post #17314 at 7:46 AM on Apr 6, 2010. There were no other post until skyjack71 posted at 12:26 AM on Apr 8, 2010. That’s 40 hours and 40 minutes! That has to be a record for this thread. [All times CDT (Zulu -6).] I can remember when I would write a reply and there would be three or four posts sandwiched between the reply and the post I was responding to. ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Sluggo's Quotable Ouotes There are 10 kinds of people in the world: those who understand binary numbers, and those who don't. ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Web Page Blog NORJAK Forum

AE6IM, I won’t OUT you here, since you didn’t post it here. But, you have inspired me (on several levels). I turned 63 yesterday, maybe you’ll get me “under canopy” (in some form) by/on my 64th birthday. What a great way to meld two hobbies! Consider posting the video link here, let everyone share. KE7GED Web Page Blog NORJAK Forum

Skydive71 said: That is a situation that you created yourself. When you loose your creditability, no one will EVER listen to you! Web Page Blog NORJAK Forum

Well, it’s finally been proven! Jo was right, we were wrong. It is a known fact the Duane received military (skydiving) training! How do I know it’s true? I read it on the internet! An online magazine, called “mental_floss magazine” ran an article about 7 incredible stories of escapes. Here’s what it said {Emphasis mine}: … 2. Skydiving for Cash On November 24, 1971, a man calling himself Dan Cooper boarded Northwest Orient Flight 305 from Portland to Seattle, carrying only a briefcase. Once in the air, he handed the stewardess a note. When she ignored the gesture, Cooper politely redrew her attention to the message. This time, she realized how serious the situation was. The note said that Cooper had a bomb in his briefcase, and that he planned on setting it off unless he received $200,000 cash and some parachutes upon landing in Seattle. After having his demands met, Cooper redirected the plane to Mexico. He also gave the pilot instructions to maintain a speed of less than 150 knots and an altitude of less than 10,000 feet, and to keep the flaps set at 15 degrees. All of this kept the plane moving slowly enough for Cooper to make a dramatic exit. With cash in hand and a parachute on his back, Cooper jumped out of the plane somewhere over the Washington-Oregon border. To this day, Cooper’s whereabouts are unknown. Authorities maintain that he probably died while leaping from the plane, but there’s evidence to suggest otherwise. In 1978, hikers in Oregon (near the area where Cooper had jumped) found instructions for descending the rear stairwell of a Boeing 727. And in 1981, an 8-year-old boy discovered $5,880 that turned out to be part of Cooper’s ransom money. Neither discovery is conclusive proof, but there is one more piece of evidence: In 1997, the FBI opened a posthumous investigation into Duane Weber, an antiques dealer in Florida who made a deathbed admission that he was Dan Cooper. It turns out that Weber had a criminal record, serving six prison terms for burglary and forgery, and that he’d received military training during WWII, which included skydiving. … You can read the whole article HERE and find out about the other six escapes. So it’s settled, Jo can now put Duane under canopy with military training. It has to be true, it’s (in print) on the internet, it has to be true because “they” wouldn’t let them publish it if it wasn’t true. I happy now and I’m sure Jo is too! What you got to say now Mr. 377? Doubter, skeptic and cynic. Duane was under canopy!

Quade, No “guys” just Jerry. No one else commented and Jerry doesn’t speak for me. As I have expressed previously, dropzone.com (as an entity) has been very welcoming (and tolerant) of us whuffos posting about DB. I’m not sure it is deserved. If the thread was closed tomorrow, I would be sad, but understanding. Jerry, Speak for yourself. You don’t represent my web site in any way, read the disclaimer on your page at my site: My site does not accept advertising (and never will as long as I can afford to keep it up (the site, not that other thing

georger said: If Cooper had checked the packing CARD on the one dummy chute he would have known it was a dummy chute. Good point georger, but I have a little different take: There were no D-rings on the NB-6 Harness. If Cooper attempted to use the “Training Dummy” he tied it to the harness. Both reserves were equally useless (EVEN IF he didn’t know one was a “dummy”). So, my question is: How would things be different if Cooper knew (or did not know) one of the reserves was a “dummy”. By “things be different” I mean how would the evidence gathered after the flight be different. I think the dummy chute went out of the plane just like the briefcase, paper sack (based on CAVA #1), and Cooper (with his money). Anything I could say about whether or not Cooper knew it was a dummy would be pure speculation on my part. (Something that I have never been short of.) PS: You guys getting better weather? It was 85-degrees yesterday and today here. I thought Spring was never going to coime. Web Page Blog NORJAK Forum

Galen has been leaving messages on my Blog site. No one has shown any interest in my forum. Web Page Blog NORJAK Forum

BruceSmith said: The fact that DBC commanded the pilots to trim their flaps at fifteen degrees impressed the heck out of Rataczak, who told me that the 727 was the only Boeing craft to have a fifteen-degree setting and he thus considered Cooper to have a highly advanced knowledge of the plane. Bruce, maybe some fact checking is in order here. I haven’t ever flown a passenger airline, but I’ll bet that in 1971 there were a “grunge” of passenger planes with 15-degree flap settings. I checked a few technical sites and found that the B-737-100 and B-737-200 both had 15-degree settings, The First flight dates for the 100 and 200 were 04/09/1967 and 08/08/1967 respectively, so they were around in 1971. Here’s some stuff from a quick check (doesn’t make it the truth): From an NTSB B-737 Accident Report: The captain reported that control became increasingly difficult during the approach to land when the flaps were extended from 15 degrees to 30 degrees. Some conversations (on forums) from a couple of Captains: The 737 has flaps settings of 0, 1, 2, 5, 10, 15, 25, 30, and 40. I believe most airlines use 15 degrees on take off and 30 degrees for landing. a few more notches that 0, 1, 2, 3, full. On the old 737-300/400, you had flaps UP, 1, 2, 5, 10, 15, 25, 30 and 40. Most takeoff were 5 or 15. So, I don’t know where Rataczak was coming from. Also, the “terminology” Cooper used is lost to history. I’ve read reports that indicate he said “Flaps down,” “Flaps to 15-degrees,” “Flaps extended,” and Himmelsbach is quoted as saying “Cooper asked for the plane to be flown ‘dirty’”. That’s how I would expect Himmelsbach to express it, but I’m not sure he was quoting Cooper (in that case). It needs a lot of digging and research (a possible CAVA). Web Page Blog NORJAK Forum