RonD1120
-
Content
10,818 -
Joined
-
Last visited
-
Feedback
0% -
Country
United States
Posts posted by RonD1120
-
-
QuoteI could rebut item-by-item (soul, spirit; etc. versus mind, emotions will, etc.), but I'm just not going to take the time right now.
You're re-defining attributes that exist in the physical world as though they necessarily are attributes of the supernatural world, and vice-versa. They are not. The fact that some people continue, into their adulthood, to imagine - or, if you will, believe - that they are so does not make them any more so.
Over these past few weeks I have come to the conclusion that you believe you have reached the level of development where you know all there is to know. There is nothing left for you. You have conquered universal knowledge.Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them. -
Quote
Now to make the statement “without the capacity for a soul” we first have to identify what this “soul” is and show empirical evidence that this “soul” exists.
Which I don’t think anyone has ever been able to do, so into the I think the “soul” can go into the same box as the Tooth Fairy, Loch Ness Monster, Yeti, Witches, Homeopathic remedies, fortune tellers and gods.
FYI, Homeopathic remedies are real and valid and have nothing to do with spiritual beliefs.
Soul has a specific definition. The soul is comprised of the mind, emotions and will. Man is spirit, lives in a body and has a soul.
Does empirical evidence exist for the mind? Is there evidence of emotions? Are people able to make independent decisions?
As for spirit, are you familiar with the French term elan vital?Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them. -
Quote
It's possible to be spiritual without being religious, and vice versa.
That is a conceptual belief I have been espousing since the beginning of my recent posts.Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them. -
QuoteI see spirituality as another means of describing the psychological part of our existence. The laws of science are inadequate to explain the psychological make up of an individual. Psychologists and Psychiatrists are spiritual teachers in a way. But pale in comparison to the True Spiritual teachings provided in the Word of God. Constructing a reality with spiritual Truth produces the fruits of the spirit, failing to do so results in chaos.
The first part of Oswald Chambers, My Utmost for His Highest for this morning as follows:QuoteJuly 27th.
THE WAY TO KNOW
"If any man will do His will, he shall know of the doctrine...” John vii. 17.
The golden rule for understanding spiritually is not intellect, but obedience. If a man wants scientific knowledge, intellectual curiosity is his guide; but if he wants insight into what Jesus Christ teaches, he can only get it by obedience. If things are dark to me, then I may be sure there is something I will not do. Intellectual darkness comes through ignorance; spiritual darkness comes because of something I do not intend to obey.
Obedience is the key, metanoia - the Greek concept of changing one's mind - is the beginning process. Christians refer to this as repentance. Natural man is rebellious. The Bible equates rebellion with witchcraft.
I my profession I equate rebellion with arrested maturational development, usually thought of as adolescent or sophomoric. That statement is not meant as a put down, merely the state of the situation as it is. It is what it is.Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them. -
QuoteQuotePsychologists and Psychiatrists are spiritual teachers in a way.
Yes, just like witch doctors.
BTW, that is the position taken by Scientology.Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them. -
Quote
Do you have experience or knowledge on a treatment facility/program without a spiritual component?
Yeah. It's called jail.
Winsor, you're back! Good to see you again.
After jail you get court ordered to treatment. Ergo, the spiritual component comes into play. My last job was providing treatment for the FL Dept. of Corrections and U.S. Probation Office.Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them.
Quote
Not recognized by others - believed by others. And I reject the premise that variances in the way different people's brains are hard-wired are simply "cultural relativity." I'm referring to a function of the hard sciences, not the social sciences. See my post #30.
Hmmm! My career field was in the social sciences. Cultural relativity is paramount for understanding others. Certainly brain functioning is different between individuals and types. For example, left-handed people tend to be more creative than right handed people. Women use both sides of their brains simultaneously. Ukrainians are more mean spirited than Okinawans. What causes people to change?
Quote
I disagree with your definitions, which I think impart artificial distinctions. To me, they are one and the same; or if you will, the overall category is "supernatural", with everything else
(including, but not limited to, God, gods, the Devil, Heaven, Hell, spirits, spirituality, the soul, reincarnation of the soul, karma, magic, Wicca, witchcraft, faith healing, reiki, predetermined destiny, spirits of land or plants or animals, good luck, bad luck, any and all superstitions, the Flying Spaghetti Monster, etc.)
all being subsets of "supernatural".
Revealing a certain level of consciousness pertaining to a facet of cultural relativity and lacking actual knowledge of the understanding of the difference as recognized by others.
QuoteQuoteQuoteseed of Abraham? I'm not sure what you mean by that.
Judaism begins with Abraham, his son Isaac, his son Jacob later Israel. God told Abraham his seed would be greater that the stars in the heavens.
I am proposing weak theory in this soul reference.
OK, but my post was about spirituality in general (through any religion, or even through no organized religion at all).
I am saying that there may be some people who lack any capacity for spiritual experience of any sort.
I got off on a tangent. To come back to your point. I think you may be correct. I always try to look for the best possible potential in others. I believe a spiritual value system is good. Therefore, I think I can always influence them to change their minds. Of course that is not possible. Some never will. A psychiatrist friend of mine warned me of falling into that trap at the very beginning of my graduate studies. But, I press on in faith.
Quoteseed of Abraham? I'm not sure what you mean by that.
Judaism begins with Abraham, his son Isaac, his son Jacob later Israel. God told Abraham his seed would be greater that the stars in the heavens.
I am proposing weak theory in this soul reference.
Quote
From my perspective, my spirit is very self evident to me. To RonD, the same is also probably true. Hence his desire for spiritual exploration, in his case through Christianity.
In JackC's mind, things might be entirely different.
Here's one possibility to consider:
It may well be that some people do not have the same capacity as others for any sort of spiritual experience.
Some people may lack any form of an "Inner Life".
In short, if someone says "I have no soul." it may very well be true. The person could have an intellect that allows them to outwardly function as a human being, but might have little or no capacity for any sort of inner life or spirit or soul (call it what you will).
To such a person, any sort of spiritual efforts would appear to them to be like chasing after pink unicorns. It would be completely and mind-bogglingly meaningless to them, since they don't have a soul to begin with.
Since we are not inside each other's heads, we can never know for sure, until someone invents the Vulcan Mind Meld or something.
It would explain why these arguments never go anywhere. To someone without the capacity for a soul, spirituality in pretty much any form would seem like so much bullshit. To someone who DOES have a soul, it seems so obvious that we have this inner existence, that we might naturally, but incorrectly, believe that all other people feel it as well.
I have often thought about the possibility that some folks are without the genetic predisposition for any understanding of spirituality. My thought is that without the seed of Abraham in their heritage it is difficult to impossible for them to comprehend. As the AA Big Book says, "There are such unfortunates. They are not at fault; they seem to have been born that way."
QuoteQuoteHowever, to some of those in the substance abuse/chemical dependency/mental health profession, both professionals and client/patients, spirituality is an integral aspect of treatment.
Fixed
Do you have experience or knowledge on a treatment facility/program without a spiritual component?
Quote
To me spirituality is a meaningless concept, that's why I have no interest in it. It's got nothing to do with the fact that science actually explains things and is quite useful; pretty much everything religion isn't.
However, to those in the substance abuse/chemical dependency/mental health profession, both professionals and client/patients, spirituality is an integral aspect of treatment.
QuoteThe replies so far in the thread pretty much explain why spiritual discussion are rare (around a dropzone anyway). They assume the science of today is correct and therefore God or anything else "supernatural" is a myth. It's tough to have a discussion on the meaning of life, the soul, or levels of consciousness if people think science explains it all.
It becomes easy to see the level of discernment or level of consciousness the responder is operating in.
QuoteAnd you share this view of spirituality with the use of technology.
I did not mean to imply they are mutually exclusive.
QuoteQuoteTime to focus on real issues of the day that affect people's lives, like the coverup of Obama not having really been born on Earth.
I have proof!
And he believes it.
As a sport parachutist from the 60's I considered myself outside the norm. I'll explain the concept of “normal” later. Apparently, so did many others as evidenced by the topics of discussion after a day's jumping activities. In the early 70's a very common and popular topic, along with the Vietnam War, was spirituality. It was the “Dawning of the Age of Aquarius” you know. We sought to discover levels of consciousness and different dimensions of thinking and living.
My hypothesis is modern day skydivers are consumed with technology and have no interest in things spiritual. So, I offer a primer for the seekers among us.
There are levels or dimensions of thinking and I present my concept in reverse hierarchy as follows:
1.Physical – the observation and categorization of data from the five senses.
2.Emotional – the experience and categorization of feelings
3.Scientific or cause and effect
4.Mental – daydreaming or fantasy activities
5.Spiritual or metaphysical
Consciousness expansion is the desire and ability to progress through the levels or dimensions.
Quote[07.19.2009]
NETANYAHU TELLS OBAMA ALL OF JERUSALEM IS OPEN TO JEWS
President Obama's campaign to take control of Jerusalem from the State of Israel intensified over the weekend.
Michael Oren, Israel's Ambassador to the United States was summoned by the Obama administration and told that Israel must stop building in Jerusalem Jewish homes in what is wrongfully called East Jerusalem. The administration disturbed the Jewish Sabbath to deliver this order because the lame duck President of the Palestinian Authority had asked them to stop Jewish people from moving into parts of Jerusalem.
http://www.onejerusalem.org/2009/07/netanyahu-tells-obama-all-of-j.php
QuoteI guess he should have thought about it before he fucked her.
...like most others guys do.
Quote
I had a client suffering with suicidal ideation because he had no power over his girlfriend's decision.
That makes me wonder whether he might already have been emotionally fragile enough that any extreme stress might have triggered suicidal ideation.
Hard to say. He was an airline pilot and skydiver. He fell in love with the lady and wanted to get married. She said no, aborted the kid and said goodbye. She did a number on him.
QuoteQuoteBill Would Require Man's OK For Abortion
Holy shit.
I didn't realize Bill had that much power. I am truly humbled.
I had a client suffering with suicidal ideation because he had no power over his girlfriend's decision.
I am not an eschatologist but I read articles on the subject because I believe the countdown clock began ticking in 1948. People always get into trouble when they predict "the day." The Bible clearly states that the big event will come as a "thief in the night" when no one is expecting it. Bill's findings tie in with what other investigators are saying. He is definitely in the ball park.
Most all agree, the next major prophetic event will be the "rapture" of the believers and followers of Christ. There is major in-house discussion on that subject because it is a term whose beginning was in the 19th century. I hope it is in my lifetime.
QuoteIt's 1000 pages long. The President doesn't know what's in it. More likely than not, your Congressman doesn't know either.
http://www.opencongress.org/bill/111-h3200/text
Some of my favorite parts:QuoteSEC. 59B. TAX ON INDIVIDUALS WITHOUT ACCEPTABLE HEALTH CARE COVERAGE.
2
‘(a) Tax Imposed- In the case of any individual who does not meet the requirements of subsection (d) at any time during the taxable year, there is hereby imposed a tax equal to 2.5 percent of the excess of--CommentsClose CommentsPermalink
‘(1) the taxpayer’s modified adjusted gross income for the taxable year, overCommentsClose CommentsPermalink
‘(2) the amount of gross income specified in section 6012(a)(1) with respect to the taxpayer.
...and this...Quote‘(d) Acceptable Coverage Requirement-....
‘(F) VA- Coverage under the veteran’s health care program under chapter 17 of title 38, United States Code, but only if the coverage for the individual involved is determined by the Secretary in coordination with the Health Choices Commissioner to be not less than the level specified by the Secretary of the Treasury, in coordination with the Secretary of Veteran’s Affairs and the Health Choices Commissioner, based on the individual’s priority for services as provided under section 1705(a) of such title.
Just a few gems to yell at my Senators and Congressmen about while I urge them to kill this initiative. ...and that was just from my first 10 minutes of browsing.
Check it out. I heard something on the radio about reporting about equipment being used or some crap like that...
Attached is the chart recently released.
Observation Regarding Spirituality
in Speakers Corner
Not soul, the spirit. Two separate components.
Hebrews 4:12
For the word of God is living and powerful, and sharper than any two-edged sword, piercing even to the division of soul and spirit, and of joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.