stuffit 0 #1 January 29, 2004 Today is the first day that i am going to start flying (atleast trying to fly) hd in the tunnel at perris. Can anyone give some useful tips (besides "relax", i already got that one) for this? Maybe what will be a little different than how i fly it in the air, besides the speed. thanks. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NeedToJump 0 #2 January 29, 2004 I'm guessing that since this is your first time flying HD in the tunnel that you will be doing it on the net? Here's some tips for HD on the net: After you grab the net put your head right in between your hands so when you flip yourself upside-down your hands are on the sides of your body and not pushing you forward or back. Put your head farther back then you think you have to, it's really easy to have your chin tucked against your chest and not realize it. Relax and go slow. Don't try to get off the net yet, get a good stable HD on the net first. Be able to stay stable HD on the net and take grips with both hands, turn and stop in both directions, move forward and back, etc. before trying to fly it off the net. Have fun!! Wind Tunnel and Skydiving Coach http://www.ariperelman.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freeflir29 0 #3 January 30, 2004 Damn I would love to do that. However.....I don't think there is a tunnel made that could get me off the net. Why oh why was I made short and wide?!?!?!?!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
WrongWay 0 #4 January 30, 2004 1. Wear a big ass baggy suit. 2. Go on the Subway diet, and get Aides. (not AIDS) I agree the tunnel kicks ass, but I have yet to fly in it with the spiffy new fans. I bet flying on your head with those babies would be SWEET. Wrong Way D #27371 Mal Manera Rodriguez Cajun Chicken Ø Hellfish #451 The wiser wolf prevails. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DaMan 0 #5 January 30, 2004 QuoteI agree the tunnel kicks ass, but I have yet to fly in it with the spiffy new fans. I bet flying on your head with those babies would be SWEET. Me too - last time (before the upgrade), all I could do was a daffy on the net ...still a lot of fun I'd love to do one of the tunnel camps, but they want you to go through back flying, then sitfly, then back carving HD, then...I just want to work on my daffy.Z-Flock 8 Discotec Rodriguez Too bad weapons grade stupidity doesn't lead to sterility. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
WrongWay 0 #6 January 30, 2004 Quote I'd love to do one of the tunnel camps, but they want you to go through back flying, then sitfly, then back carving HD, then...I just want to work on my daffy. Yeah but if you can fly all of those, if I remember correctly you can go thru each phase with each session in the tunnel (between breaks ya know?) So theoretically you could be flying on your head after 5 minutes or so. Wrong Way D #27371 Mal Manera Rodriguez Cajun Chicken Ø Hellfish #451 The wiser wolf prevails. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NeedToJump 0 #7 January 30, 2004 QuoteI just want to work on my daffy So don't do a camp if they make you do all that first. Just get a coach and do some one on one. If the person doesn't know you then you'll probably have to demonstrate that you can fly on your belly/back/sit before doing HD but you can do all that in a single session. Stuffit - how'd the HD go?Wind Tunnel and Skydiving Coach http://www.ariperelman.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stuffit 0 #8 January 30, 2004 It was cool as fuck. The dude got pissed at me at first though. I had to spend the first two 2.5 min sessions doing back flips and I accidentally tried one before he was ready. He did not like that. Anyways, I was on the net on my head in daffy on the third session. I weigh about 185 and I had my arms and legs stretched out and I was barely off the net. This is probably one of the only times I wish I could be one of the small guys. It was still fun as fuck though. Just takes some leg endurance (I am glad I go to the gym regularly; now I see why everyone was complaining about being sore). I would definitely recommend it to anyone though. It was cool. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NeedToJump 0 #9 January 30, 2004 QuoteI weigh about 185 and I had my arms and legs stretched out and I was barely off the net. I'm 150 and it's still work to fly HD in there. I also find it harder to start on the net and lift off then to just transition to HD and hold it. The air seems a bit better about 2 feet up off the net. Did you try stalling the HD (from a straddle doing forward and backward movements to lift you up off the net)?Wind Tunnel and Skydiving Coach http://www.ariperelman.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stuffit 0 #10 January 30, 2004 I did not get quite that far. I only had about 10.5 min to do it. Mike the spotter guy had to go back to Orlando at 6 so we had to end it. He is the only guy that can spot head down. THAT SUCKS! I wish they would train someone on this side of the country. So, needtojump, how much time have you had on your head in there? How long did it take to get flying on your head in there and how many freefly hd jumps did you have before you went in there? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
VanillaSkyGirl 6 #11 January 30, 2004 QuoteI did not get quite that far. I only had about 10.5 min to do it. Wow, you did really well, then. Congrats! :) I am an RW girl, but I took a FF tunnel camp where I was taught to back fly and sitfly. I cannot FF in the sky because of my rig (doesn't fit me well enough...I'm tiny), but it is VERY fun to have the option of using the tunnel for FF! :) I haven't been to the tunnel in Perris, yet, though. I must say that I have the opposite problems as the bigger guys. When the air is turned up high in the tunnel, it is quite a challenge for me to keep my composure (even on my belly) as my body has to work extra hard to fly gracefully while fighting the wind. I have to be very "strong" with all my limbs, etc. while flying, if that makes any sense. It does makes it much easier when I am in the sky, though. ;) I'm glad that you had a great time, and I hope that you have a good video of it all. I have a video that shows my sitfly progression in the tunnel and also shows me doing some cool superpositioning on my back (I looooved back flying...maybe it's because I also love belly flying so much?) The video is waaaaay better than my tunnel pics, which where taken when I first began to try to "sit". The video shows me trying sitfly docking, forward/back/up/down movement, etc. It was so new for me, but (surprise!) I actually did enjoy sitflying. :) LOL! Edited: Btw, I am only 97 lbs., so someday I will be stoked about learning HD in the tunnel. :) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NeedToJump 0 #12 January 30, 2004 Good job getting off the net at all in 10.5 minutes! I'm happy to hear that Michael is on his way back to Orlando, although I thought the reason that he was going out there was to train more people to be able to spot HD? I have not kept track of my tunnel time at all but just to guess I would say that my total time is around 30 hours with probably about 15-20 on my belly, 8-10 freefly about 5 hours coaching (standing on the net and flying.) Total HD time is probably around 5 hours and I had maybe 30 HD jumps when I started freeflying in there. Most of my jumps are RW as is most of my tunnel time. Those numbers are complete guesses though, I really have no idea. It takes a while to be able to fly HD in there. Rosa - I love back flying in there too, I've done some very cool sessions in there with me on my back with other RW flyers, turned a bunch of points! 97 lbs?! Wow, you were built for freeflying in that thing, you could probably stand if they max it out! Wind Tunnel and Skydiving Coach http://www.ariperelman.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
VanillaSkyGirl 6 #13 January 30, 2004 QuoteRosa - I love back flying in there too, I've done some very cool sessions in there with me on my back with other RW flyers, turned a bunch of points! 97 lbs?! Wow, you were built for freeflying in that thing, you could probably stand if they max it out! LOL! Yes, I'm sure that I could "stand" in there. I am about Juliana's size (maybe the tiniest bit smaller). I purposely wanted to learn FF from her as she is so similar in size/shape as me. :) Anyway, I hope to learn HD in the tunnel someday in the future, but I love RW flying more. If I can scrape up the $$$ to do more tunnel time this year, then I will be focusing on belly flying first. :) Of course, I will practice my sitflying in the tunnel at some point, too. Arrrgh...if only I had more $$$....then I could do it all!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stuffit 0 #14 January 30, 2004 QuoteGood job getting off the net at all in 10.5 minutes! I'm happy to hear that Michael is on his way back to Orlando, although I thought the reason that he was going out there was to train more people to be able to spot HD? I think he was supposed to but it never happened. That was kind of stupid on the staffs part, seeing as how there are a shitload of people looking to begin the HD experience in there. But, we will see. Hopefully perris will be smart enough to send someone over there to train. I will not be going back to the tunnel until they have a HD spotter. They also said that they are going to start charging more money to turn up the fans(as if the current rate was not enough). That sucks again!! And I am not even that big compared to some of the folks in there. I guess I am just going to have to learn better how to "tunnel" fly instead of trying to relate it to freeflying in the sky. Anyhow, back and sit flying are still fun in there. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
arlo 0 #15 January 30, 2004 QuoteIt was cool as fuck. The dude got pissed at me at first though. I had to spend the first two 2.5 min sessions doing back flips and I accidentally tried one before he was ready. He did not like that. how do you "accidently" do a backflip in the tunnel? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NeedToJump 0 #16 January 30, 2004 Quotehow do you "accidently" do a backflip in the tunnel? Come on Arlo, haven't you ever seen me do 4-way in there? Wind Tunnel and Skydiving Coach http://www.ariperelman.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
arlo 0 #17 January 30, 2004 Quote Come on Arlo, haven't you ever seen me do 4-way in there? you know...i'll make it a special point to keep my eye on you next time i'm there. waittttttt a minute. i think YOU'VE 'accidentally' done some shit FFing in the tunnel as well (now that i think about it...). a Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NeedToJump 0 #18 January 30, 2004 Quotewaittttttt a minute. i think YOU'VE 'accidentally' done some shit FFing in the tunnel as well Me? Never... Well not unless you count that time where I came down to exit too fast and got thrown against the wall and yelled at, or the time when I was on my head and hit the wall and I forget who was in there with me but he thought I killed myself, or the time when we were doing 4-way and while waiting for the other 3 to exit I tried to sit fly in my bootie suit and I got tossed out of the tunnel, or when I was HD on the net with Joe and instead of gently taking a grip on him I flew into him and bowled him over... ah good times Wind Tunnel and Skydiving Coach http://www.ariperelman.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stuffit 0 #19 January 30, 2004 QuoteQuoteIt was cool as fuck. The dude got pissed at me at first though. I had to spend the first two 2.5 min sessions doing back flips and I accidentally tried one before he was ready. He did not like that. how do you "accidently" do a backflip in the tunnel? I just meant that I did it before he was ready to spot me. In other words, he hadn't given me the ok to do it yet. And that is why he didn't like it very much. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
arlo 0 #20 January 30, 2004 well that's cool that you at least got to try it in there.:) (generally speaking) i know that you guys are really antsy to have someone spot headdown, but PLEASE keep in mind that the instructor's job is not as easy as folks may think it is. things happen super quick in the tunnel and the instructor has to be even quicker to spot for people. please be patient with the progress of stuff in perris. the reason they are there is for YOUR safety, so try to keep that in mind. i can tell ya that i'll be quite pissed at the first person that goes in the tunnel cocky as hell thinking they don't need no stinkin' spotting. that's the person that will end up breaking their neck and it'll cost alot of people a nice toy to play in. you think PMS is bad.... our guys in orlando have months and years of almost daily experience, so you can't expect the perris folks to be there just yet. anyway, enjoy your tunnel in perris! i still think it's outstanding that you have it there on the dz!:) blues, arlo Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stuffit 0 #21 January 30, 2004 Easy for you to say, you have a HD spotter! I know this but it still sucks. I dont think that it is a physical impossibility for someone to learn from him how to spot in a relatively short period of time. It seems like if something goes really wrong, there is not much that anybody could do, no matter how much spotting experience they have. I watched him get slammed into the wall last night, and there was nothing he could do about it except brace for impact. I know I should be more patient, but I dont want to be. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
arlo 0 #22 January 31, 2004 that's exactly what i mean, though. it LOOKS alot easier than it IS. running across the tunnel floor isn't easy...seriously. michael is an incredible tunnel flyer. ask anyone from swanson and rook to anyone from airspeed. he's a great instructor. michael getting slammed in the wall tells me that whoever he was spotting for fucked up and should be damn glad michael got between him and the wall. that's another thing. the instructors put themselves between you and the walls...to help minimize possible injury to the person. it'd be cool if they'd let the folks that thought it was an easy job just go in and spot a class or even experienced skydivers for 1 hour. i think folks would have a MUCH better appreciation for the level of training NEEDED to run that place and the minimal incidents that it has. take care and enjoy your weekend... arlo Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JJohnson 0 #23 February 2, 2004 You and me both brother. 5 foot 4 inches at 170lbs....I ain't found many fall rates I couldn't keep up with. If I shed every pound of bodyfat I might get down to 160.JJ "Call me Darth Balls" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
VivaHeadDown 0 #24 February 14, 2004 Thanks, Arlo, for helping to explain to these guys how tunnel flying works. I'm one of the guys here at Perris, and learning to spot HD tunnel flying scares the crap out of me. Michael did work with me for a little bit. He did all the hard work while I watched and helped with the easy stuff. And I use "easy" loosely. There's no way I'd take responsibility for someone's safety at this point when it comes to learning HD in the tunnel. It takes the speed, strength, and understanding of someone who's been in the tunnel a lot longer than any of us have (which is only two months). If you hadn't noticed, none of us are flying HD in the tunnel either, and it's killing some of us. But it's actually a pretty good thing. I can probably outfly most people in every other FF possition. And I've only been working here two months. Tunnel flying is not just about perfecting techniques (like working on your daffy), it's about raising your body awareness to unimagined levels. To understand the effect of every square inch of your body on your flight is the most powerful tool you can have in the air. By not flying in the tunnel until we get a HD spotter, you are doing a huge disservice to nobody but yourself. You're limitting yourself in the long run because you've closed off your mind to learning true freeflying. There are nearly an infinite number of variations on each traditional FF possition because of the flexibility of the human body. There is no way you could have maxed out that understanding to the point where you have nothing to learn but HD left. Joe, Carlos, Michael, and all the other top Orlando staff have more freefall time than most skydivers on your DZ combined, and yet everyday I was training I saw them learning new things. Trying new ways of doing things. Some of them have been working there for 5 years and they still have so much to explore. It's very common to limit our learning because we want to feel we're better than we are. But you'll learn more if you humble yourself a little. Recognizing our weaknesses is the only way to eliminate them. Don't limit yourself, keep flying, never stop learning. Those three things are reason enough to keep jumping and tunneling. The tunnel allows us to learn at an accelerated rate, but don't ever fool yourself into thinking you've learned all you can. Think of your potential as a distant goal that you can never reach. If you never try, then you'll never know just how far ahead it is. Blah blah blah, it's 1:30 in the morning, I just got home from a great last session of the day with the FF guys from Elsinore, and I'm still real pumped about it. One of those nights where I know exactly why I chose this path in life. And if any of this wasn't enough to convince you that HD is not the only good that can come out of the tunnel for you, then all I can say is patience. It's not going to happen any time soon. No matter how many times we bring out Orlando guys, we will not begin training until the job can be safely done. Maybe by nationals, maybe by thanksgiving, but there's no good reason to risk someone's neck, period. Don't Confuse Me With My Own Words Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
winnt 0 #25 September 4, 2006 Hi guys, is it recommended to start HD in the sky?? Or do you think one can start HD basics with a tunnel coach?? Thanks Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
