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skydive435

Using my rear risers

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SRI85



You ever watched a competitive round of speed swooping? The top finishers are always on rears.



Actually the top swoopers may have their hands on their rears but they are mostly using very little input to plane out.

In the Speed competition they are carving on their rears because it's a curved course and rears produce less drag than toggles.
"The ground does not care who you are. It will always be tougher than the human behind the controls."

~ CanuckInUSA

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Actually the top swoopers may have their hands on their rears but they are mostly using very little input to plane out.



You never been to any competitions lately I take it. Rears are used I would have to say every time. Either to help level out or to keep speed and power. Look at some of the videos that are out there and take a good look. You might be surprised.
If you find yourself in a fair fight, your tactics suck!

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Rookie120



You never been to any competitions lately I take it.



Yeah, you're right I have not seen any swoop comps this year...;):P

Rookie120

Rears are used I would have to say every time. Either to help level out or to keep speed and power. Look at some of the videos that are out there and take a good look. You might be surprised.



I know they are using some rears, but much less than the beer line swoopers. Just look at the degree of deflection on the rears that the pro's use.

Minimal input makes for bigger, faster, longer swoops.
"The ground does not care who you are. It will always be tougher than the human behind the controls."

~ CanuckInUSA

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I know they are using some rears, but much less than the beer line swoopers. Just look at the degree of deflection on the rears that the pro's use.



That's because they're going faster. Control surface effectiveness increases with airspeed. The faster you go, the less deflection you need to achieve the same result.

I'm 99% sure nobody is letting the canopy plane out on it's own. It's just not the way to get the power of the dive down into the swoop.

On a shallow trimmed canopy, like a Stiletto, you can let it plane out on it's own because it will do so rather quickly, minimizing the loss of power in the roll out.

On a steeper trimmed canopy, like any of the modern swooping wings, it's just wants to keep plowing toward the ground for too long and you lose too much power. If you want to go fast/far, you need to bring that power down to ground level, and 'fly' the canopy out of the dive.

When you're talking about rear risers, you're deflecting about 2/3 of the canopy when you add input. When you're talking about the plane out from a dive, you're talking about the fastest point of the swoop. Put the two together, and you can see how you end up only needing a 'touch' of input to set the canopy into level flight. It's not much, but it's there.

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Honestly I don't get it. You're probably doing a good job swooping on the toggles but I'm sure you realize that rears are the way to go. Here's what I dont get....... I understand why you don't want to try new technique in a complex approach like a 270, however any canopy I have ever owned has always started with a straight in or 90 degree speed Inducing turn followed by a riser plane out. I literally learn the rear riser until I am stalling the canopy at the end of my swoop for fun. Then I make my setup more aggressive. I've never flown your canopy but I would recommend fully understanding the rears with a very basic approach before trying any advanced approach. Rears are awesome. Just be aware that you can't stab with rearslike you can with toggles. Learn the rears first. Then modify your approach.

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