luisvar 0 #1 March 7, 2002 I have been reading that the Cobalt has the highest glide ratio of any canopy, but that also it can be landed straight in. That sounds a bit contradictory to me, however I want to learn how to do it if it is real fact. I just ordered a new Cobalt so I will need to develop the skill. My Canopy will be a 150, my exit weight is 207, have a total of 205 jumps in the last 9 months (7 jumps in a Cobalt 170, and 17 in a 150, and most of the rest in a booooriiiing PD190), Anyone?Cielos Azules!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rhino 0 #2 March 7, 2002 Land it the same way you land the cobalt 170..Blue Skies and Smooth Rides!! http://www.aahit.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
luisvar 0 #3 March 7, 2002 In all the jumps with the demos (170 and 150) I glided the landing, couldn't land it straight in Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkymonkeyONE 3 #4 March 7, 2002 I load my 65 at up 2.6 on a regular basis and have no problem landing it straight in. My webpage HERE Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rhino 0 #5 March 7, 2002 You can land ANY canopy straight in??Are you ready to goto a Cobalt150??RhinoBlue Skies and Smooth Rides!! http://www.aahit.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
indyz 1 #6 March 7, 2002 QuoteIn all the jumps with the demos (170 and 150) I glided the landing, couldn't land it straight inThis makes me think that you are wondering about landing straight down, not straight in. By straight in, they mean without riser input to gain speed for a swoop-type landing.--BrianHomepageAIM: suprmath Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rhino 0 #7 March 7, 2002 Do you mean SINKING the canopy in???Blue Skies and Smooth Rides!! http://www.aahit.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
luisvar 0 #8 March 7, 2002 I assume that practise and experience will do it, however any tips will help.With regards to whether I am ready rhino, I flew many other canopies (stilleto, batwing, hornet, silouthe, sabre,triathlon), and the one a felt more in control and comfortable with was the Cobalt. However, I have not forgotten that despite I am very current, I am still a begginner, so I intend to jump it very conservatly until I gain the necessary experience to enjoy the full potential of the canopyCielos Azules! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rhino 0 #9 March 7, 2002 You didn't answer the question??Blue Skies and Smooth Rides!! http://www.aahit.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
luisvar 0 #10 March 7, 2002 Yes, Sinking the canopy in (I guess when I translated from spanish it didn't translate literally :-) ) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhreeZone 15 #11 March 7, 2002 Sinking any ZP canopy is tricky. I've just started to get a good sink going on my Cobalt 150 @ 1.23:1. The heavier you load a canopy, the less likley you will be to get a "sink" out of it. My best rate of sink is deep in brakes, it does'nt leave much toggle input for flaring. NO where near the stall point, but getting close to it. In my opinion you need to go be in full glide to stand up most ZP landings gracefully.If you need sink, jump an accuracy canopy or an F1-11 canopy, either would have a better sink then a high proformance canopy.Cause I don't wanna come back down from this cloud... ~ Bush Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,435 #12 March 7, 2002 >You can land ANY canopy straight in??Yes, outside of small, really ragged out F111 canopies. I once jumped a PD150 with about 700 jumps on it that needed a little extra speed to land well. Compare that to sub-100 square foot Extremes and Jedeis, which I had no problems landing straight in with no tricks.-bill von Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rhino 0 #13 March 7, 2002 You would have better luck sinking a Triathlon than a Cobalt.. It has a slower stall speed.. I had a Triathlon150 at 1.25 and could sink it straight down.. It was a very safe and versatile canopy..Blue Skies and Smooth Rides!! http://www.aahit.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
luisvar 0 #14 March 7, 2002 so, net net, going back to my initial question, What do I need to do to be able to sink in the cobalt, at 1.38 loading? I guess I still don't have it clearCielos Azules! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhreeZone 15 #15 March 7, 2002 You will not easliy get the Cobalt to sink. You will not easly get most ZP canopies to sink. Look at my last post for what seems to work good for me on my Cobalt.ZP caopies are made to glide, why do you want to sink it in?Cause I don't wanna come back down from this cloud... ~ Bush Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,435 #16 March 7, 2002 >so, net net, going back to my initial question, What do I need to do to be able to sink in the cobalt, at 1.38 loading? Well, I'm not sure why you'd want to sink in Cobalt, unless you're trying to land somewhere very tight, but to do it:1. Find the stall point up high.2. On approach, bring the brakes to just before the stall point. A cobalt will likely not like flying like this, and will buck and shake a lot. Do _not_ suddenly let the toggles up or it will surge in a really nasty way. Do _not_ stall the canopy completely.3. At an appropriate altitude, _gradually_ bring the brakes back up. The canopy will dive to recover its airspeed.4. Once you are back to normal airspeed, flare like normal. Note that if you are not back to normal airspeed by the time you get to the ground you are going to land very, very hard - so choose your altitude in step 3 carefully. If you do it right, you will have effectively done a straight-in toggle hook turn.-bill von Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rhino 0 #17 March 7, 2002 You get much above 1.2 and you had better forget really sinking anything..Blue Skies and Smooth Rides!! http://www.aahit.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkymonkeyONE 3 #18 March 7, 2002 Just read the updated posts. Everything about sinking any ZP main is right on the money. It is an iffy proposition and should be practiced at altitude during your formative jumps on the canopy. I once landed a Sabre 135 in a dudes VERY crowded back yard for a demo. Stupid, but I lived through it. My buddy Randy Phillipi landed on the roof of the house next door, Kenny Lovette swooped the pond and landed in the yard next door, and lastly, my buddy Norm pounded in under a Sabre 190 and hit the far fence. The most critical piece of advice given so far was NOT to let the toggles up abruptly when you are sinking it, no matter how much the main bounces around. ChuckMy webpage HERE Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rhino 0 #19 March 7, 2002 This is MUCH safer done under a seven cell... Like a Triathlon..Blue Skies and Smooth Rides!! http://www.aahit.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
luisvar 0 #20 March 7, 2002 Great! thank guys (&girls?).Why do I want to know how to sink a cobalt in? In december I had a close call with the cobalt 150 I was demoing at Skydive Miami. Because of inexperience, and being unfamiliar with the DZ, I miscalculated the distance I had to get to the DZ, at the altitude I was playing. So I ended up landing in a Tomato field, far away from the DZ. For those who don't know what a tomato field looks like: straight lines of small tomato plants that are kept straight up by using a STEEL stick, about Three Feet!! high, separated 2 feet one from the other. Landing there is basically landing on a bed of arrows pointing at you... The only space to land safely is a dirt road, 20 feet wide that goes through the center of the field. I was lucky enough that day to be able to land, in a nasty crosswind, on that little piece of space. So, after that scary experience, I thought it would be useful to learn how to sink in my canopy, in case the skill is needed againCielos Azules! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkymonkeyONE 3 #21 March 7, 2002 There you have it: a fantastic reason for wanting to know how to perform a specific task. Right on, Brother.My webpage HERE Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,435 #22 March 8, 2002 >The only space to land safely is a dirt road, 20 feet wide that goes through the center of the field. >I was lucky enough that day to be able to land, in a nasty crosswind, on that little piece of space. I think that if I were in that situation, I would just try to land it straight in on the road. No need to sink it in if you have a decent runway, and you can always either crab or flare-turn to compensate for the crosswind. I think the only time I would try sinking a canopy like that would be if my only option was a _very_ soft or wet clearing in the middle of a forest. -bill von Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
luisvar 0 #23 March 8, 2002 Totally agree with you bill von, only if had to do it again (hope not!). The conditions of the moment (inexperience, failure to realize that those were steel sticks but until I was at less than 100 feet high, high winds, unfamiliar canopy), put me on a crossed path to the road, and I was too low for a radical turn, so I had no option (I actually landed it on a kind of a half brake turn, with toggels down, hard landing, but being able to tell about it!!). Everything that could go wrong, went wrong, so when all the bad things that can happen get together at the same time, is when even the most experienced skydiver will probably be grateful to have practised things like sinking-in a ZP. Cielos Azules!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
