Layton 0 #1 December 19, 2003 a guy that i work with took the first jump course with me.that was july 20 2001.i now have 128 jumps and a c liscense.my buddy just got his a test done and he sent the card back from uspa and they told him it was incomplete.they didnt send back the money order just the card.i still dont know what they wanted.our s&ta told us that only the left side of the card has to be filled out.anyone know what was left out?***if you're on the edge ya might as well step off Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jeremyneas 0 #2 December 19, 2003 any way you can scan it and post it? since there are a couple versions of the A card, it would make it easier to distinguish Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tombuch 0 #3 December 19, 2003 The entire card must be filled out, including the license exam part that confirms the skydiver passed the "check dive" and an oral exam (NOTE: USPA recently allowed the substitution of a written exam for the oral). The "A" license card is the license once it has been completely filled out, signed by an instructor, and stamped in the box on the last page. It only needs to be sent to USPA if you want to register the license (a good idea). Tom Buchanan Instructor (AFF, SL, IAD, Tandem) Author JUMP! Skydiving Made Fun and EasyTom Buchanan Instructor Emeritus Comm Pilot MSEL,G Author: JUMP! Skydiving Made Fun and Easy Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
flyinggoose 0 #4 December 19, 2003 In October the rule changed to a minimum of 25 jumps. How many does he have? It is not a grand-fathered rule. "Never waste a heartbeat." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Layton 0 #5 December 19, 2003 he has enough jumps its a card about the size of a greeting card and its yellow.the s&ta stamped it with the a stamp after he gave him the test. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AggieDave 6 #6 December 19, 2003 Quotethe s&ta stamped it with the a stamp after he gave him the test. Doesn't matter, if the card isn't 100% filled out and signed, then the USPA doesn't recognize it.--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kelel01 1 #7 December 19, 2003 But I see the question . . . there are now 2 cards floating around out there? If the "old" one is completely filled out, does that mean no A? Kelly Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AggieDave 6 #8 December 19, 2003 Quotethere are now 2 cards floating around out there? If the "old" one is completely filled out, does that mean no A? No, either card, you still get your A. The "small" card is 100% fucking worthless. Its for DZs that don't use the ISP and basically have their own student program, they can pencil-whip the card at the end of the program and the student gets their A. It doesn't have all the benefits of the new ISP integrated onto the card and if the student is using it, the student is pretty lost as to all the details they need to accomplish (like riser turns, braked approaches, swooping to formations in freefall, etc).--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
indyz 1 #9 December 19, 2003 Quote(like riser turns, braked approaches, swooping to formations in freefall, etc). Actually, all three of those are on the small card. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AggieDave 6 #10 December 19, 2003 Compare the two cards, you'll see specifically what I'm talking about.--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
weegegirl 2 #11 December 19, 2003 preference. that's all. our dz uses the small card. i finished with the small card. i think we run a fantastic, very thorough student program. just my opinion. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
peek 20 #12 December 19, 2003 AggieDave wrote (about the USPA A License Profiency Cards): "No, either card, you still get your A. The "small" card is 100% fucking worthless. Its for DZs that don't use the ISP and basically have their own student program, they can pencil-whip the card at the end of the program and the student gets their A. It doesn't have all the benefits of the new ISP integrated onto the card and if the student is using it, the student is pretty lost as to all the details they need to accomplish (like riser turns, braked approaches, swooping to formations in freefall, etc)." Dave, I am extremely disappointed in your response. I will assume you wrote this in a hurry. Most drop zones do not use the USPA ISP. The quality of training depends mostly on the drop zone and its attitude toward student instruction, not on USPA documentation. (Actually, a student's logbook is the most important document of all.) I think that since this thread is fairly new, that you will soon see a number of responses from others that feel the same way. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AggieDave 6 #13 December 19, 2003 You're right, I did write my response in a hurry. You are also right in that the student program is dependant on the DZ's attitude towards student training. Where I'm coming from is what I've seen from students coming from other DZs that have been moved along in their jumps, but haven't accomplished nearly as many goals and skills as students that I've seen trained under the ISP. IMHO () the USPA's ISP is a really good program, it trains students with a good "tool set" of skills...also, whats very nice is the ability for a student to go from one DZ that uses the ISP to another DZ that uses the ISP and pick up right where they left off and still be on the same page.--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tombuch 0 #14 December 19, 2003 QuoteYou're right, I did write my response in a hurry. You are also right in that the student program is dependant on the DZ's attitude towards student training. Where I'm coming from is what I've seen from students coming from other DZs that have been moved along in their jumps, but haven't accomplished nearly as many goals and skills as students that I've seen trained under the ISP. Many students don't know what is expected of them, or what is required to get a license. Often they don't see the ISP, or any part of the SIM. Frequently, drop zones use their own program and then fill in the card later. The advantage of the formal ISP program and four page card is that it clearly lays out each and every requirement. If an instructor is rushed, or misses something, the student has the knowledge of the program to prompt more complete instruction. A school using the 2 page card may be doing a good job, or may not...there is no way for the student to know. It is much easier for a student to follow along and demand a complete program if the 4 page card is used, and if a comprehensive outline (such as the ISP) is available. Likewise, it is easier for an instructor or DZO at another DZ to determine the depth of a jumpers training with the detailed 4 page card. The 2 page card is adequate (given a solid program), but the 4 page card is much better. Tom Buchanan Instructor (AFF, SL, IAD, Tandem) S&TA Author JUMP! Skydiving Made Fun and EasyTom Buchanan Instructor Emeritus Comm Pilot MSEL,G Author: JUMP! Skydiving Made Fun and Easy Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
