Is this how you really do a demo???

[DSE 3]

I'm only now working on my Pro rating, so all of this is dead center in front of my face, take it for what it's worth. It's not as easy to achieve as one might think. It hurts like hell to hit nine of the pre-declareds and then be arrogant enough to think that a higher wind shouldn't be a problem for the tenth.

It doesn't matter if George W, Elvis, or God himself is waiting for skydivers, a landing area that hasn't been previously checked out shouldn't be used according to the recommendations.
Do any of the four have Pro ratings? Even though it's not a stadium, your description sounds like an enclosed landing area.

...the first three got away without injury. And looked poor in the process. Either of those first two could have turned out much worse. Professionalism and skill aren't why they weren't worse, IMO. It was the lack of a gopher hole, rock, earth depression, whatever unknown that could have made it worse.
If the bulldozer was in place for the pre-determined landing area, could it not have been moved?

Would "Rather than put our safety at risk, we'd prefer to either use the landing area we pre-determined in the direction we need to, or we need to not leave the plane" been appropriate to ask?

At a recent demo we couldn't use smoke. Crepe streamers on the ground worked just fine.

If the situation was out of control enough that the police couldn't keep the crowd in the designated area, should the demo have still occurred?

I'd sure like to read Airtwardo's comments.

[BillyVance 34]

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So Billy needs to shut his mouth until he can show us some video of him doing something better.

Oh and by the way the public was in awe and treated the skydivers like celebrities. So ultimately the skydivers did their job and thrilled the public and stirred up some interest in the audience for skydiving.

Mission accomplished.

Yeah, great, now all those people think it's okay for skydivers to pound in like that and get dirty. Great way for you young whippersnappers to show how it's done.

How many demos has that group done total? I know one said it was her first. I have been doing demos for 10 years. I have also LED a demo team to a northern state and called off a demo at the last minute because the conditions just weren't right, and we got paid for our expense. That was a tough call, but the right one. I have done stadium and level 2 demos and am pro rated.

I am not at all impressed with the show you guys put on down there. That was embarrassing to me, to other PRO rating holders, to S&TAs and to USPA.

Maybe I will show the video clip of me landing with the US flag at Visionland's wave pool for Honda day. Place was jam packed, NO OUTS, parking lot completely full, right down the middle of the beach with a few steps, and there was no wind.

"Mediocre people don't like high achievers, and high achievers don't like mediocre people." - SIX TIME National Champion coach Nick Saban

[Clark7766 0]

No one said the police could not keep the crowd in the designated area. The police chose to use the extra space for parking.

So a huge ass construction site across the highway was used for the landing.

Instead of saying you shouldn't have done it. Go do some yourself.

Like I said earlier I'll ban any links from the forums to my web site then we won't have to worry about people giving their 2 cents worth on a group of folks who went and did a demo and made the best of the situation at hand.

personal attacks removed. your one warning.

[airathanas 0]

I'm not a part of the banter back and forth here, but I'm going to put my two cents in anyway...

It sounds to me like the people who make the arrangements made some sketchy judgment calls. What could have been a disaster (because of the last minute change of plans and the gas canister failing) though everything turned out fine. They impressed the crowd, mission accomplished in their eyes.

I have seen clips and heard about demos going horribly wrong- people biffing into trucks, pavement, sides of stadiums, etc... Instead of showing the crowd that skydiving is a legitimate safe sport, they break their legs trying to show off. Luckily, that didn't happen in this demo. Not-so-nice landings are not a big deal- especially if you are being honest about skydiving. Car wrecks happen all the time in NASCAR, yet people keep coming back.

I don't have a pro-rating or anything, but that's just what I think about it-

http://3ringnecklace.com/

[Clark7766 0]

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Maybe I will show the video clip of me landing with the US flag at Visionland's wave pool for Honda day. Place was jam packed, NO OUTS, parking lot completely full, right down the middle of the beach with a few steps, and there was no wind.

That's great! By all means show it. Put up or shut up

[DSE 3]

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Instead of saying you shouldn't have done it. Go do some yourself.
.

I have. So have most of the people that have commented so far.

BillyVance possibly has a hard-on for ASC. Like most skydivers probably do, as well as the State of Georgia. However, your own descriptions suggest that this demo likely shouldn't have happened under the conditions in which it did.

The conditions aren't really about the landing quality, it seems last minute decisions were made that compromised the safety of the performers. You pointed out the GK that biffed it. Sure...pro's biff it. But pro's don't jump into landing areas they haven't seen before, and pro's carry extra smoke, streamers, or whatever necessary, don't they?

That said, with your experience, do you feel you're in a position to say whether it should or should not have taken place?

Closing comment....IMO, it's not about "making the best of the situation at hand." It's about making the opportunity the best it can be before it becomes a situation.

Good luck with the next one.

[billvon 2,417]

>Like I said earlier I'll ban any links from the forums to my web site then
>we won't have to worry about people giving their 2 cents worth on a group
>of folks who went and did a demo and made the best of the situation at
>hand.

The _purpose_ of this forum is for other people to give their two cents on what happened. This demo wasn't all that bad, but as I am sure you realize now, there are things to be learned as well. You now have two choices:

1) Defend all your decisions as correct

2) Listen and learn

When I started skydiving, I did some very stupid stuff on demos; I think it's pretty common. It's almost like there's a list of mistakes that everyone has to make on demos before they learn things like when to call off a demo, when to sink it in, when it's OK to overfly obstacles, what size landing area is acceptable etc.

Fortunately back then I had people who told me "hey, buddy, that was some stupid shit" - and I learned from it. Had I gotten defensive, and told them "you're a jerk for criticizing me" I wouldn't have learned much from the experience.

[Clark7766 0]

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The _purpose_ of this forum is for other people to give their two cents on what happened. This demo wasn't all that bad, but as I am sure you realize now, there are things to be learned as well.

I agree the forum is for people to give their 2 cents worth. And there is a lot to learn from this for everyone.

But I do not agree with some Pa removed by slotperfect using links to my videos as a tool to bad mouth people and carry out his own personal agenda/vendetta against them like he has done here in the past.

"Not a really good representation of the sport to the general public" no need for that comment at all. But if you look at Vance's posts in the past you will see this is not the 1st time he has made such a comment.

I shoot video because I enjoy it. I share my video for the enjoyment of others, and in some cases for us to learn from as well.

I do not work with video to give Billy PA removed by slotperfect Vance an avenue to spew forth his bullshit. If I have to shut the whole damn site down I will and then ya'll can go somewhere else for your entertainment.