NCclimber 0 #1 November 1, 2007 QuoteTULSA — A new immigration enforcement law, arguably one of the nation’s toughest, is effective Thursday.... HB 1804 requires local and state law enforcement to check the immigration status of anyone arrested for felonies and DUIs, and then coordinate with the Department of Homeland Security to have those individuals deported. It also requires state agencies to verify citizenship before dispersing public benefits or funds. In addition, it stops illegal immigrants from obtaining driver’s licenses. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gawain 0 #2 November 1, 2007 Heard about this on the news this morning. I wonder if this will sow some seeds of courage from other states to do the same thing. Ironically, California would have been one of the first to pass this nearly 20 years ago, but the State Supreme Court overruled the will of the republic.So I try and I scream and I beg and I sigh Just to prove I'm alive, and it's alright 'Cause tonight there's a way I'll make light of my treacherous life Make light! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 1,672 #3 November 1, 2007 Quote In addition, it stops illegal immigrants from obtaining driver’s licenses. Yeah, THAT will stop them from driving!... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NCclimber 0 #4 November 1, 2007 Quote Quote In addition, it stops illegal immigrants from obtaining driver’s licenses. Yeah, THAT will stop them from driving! True. But maybe now they'll be detained, instead being told to show up in court, where if they do show up, the judge will tell them to go get a license and come back in 30 days and then when they don't show back up, the courts will issue an arrest warrant for whatever name they initially gave to cops for not having a license. Can you see what's wrong with this picture? And yes, I know this is off topic.... but I feel better. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BIGUN 1,097 #5 November 1, 2007 QuoteYeah, THAT will stop them from driving! If they can't get a DL, Then they can't fill out an I-9 form (OK's DL's are damn hard to counterfeit) If they can't fill out an I-9 Form, They can't get a job, No workie - no pay rent, no buy groceries, no buy gas = no live here, No live here, no drive here. In addition, that's only half the story. Oklahoma employers found guilty of hiring illegal aliens can be arrested. California must be in an uproar.. How dare we pass a law that makes it illegal to hire someone who's here illegally and forces those here illegally to be deported. Oh, the horror. We're not shooting anyone, just patting them on the butt and sending them home. All they gots to do is fill out the right paperwork to start the process and once they legally get here, they are more than welcome to be a part of the community.Nobody has time to listen; because they're desperately chasing the need of being heard. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 1,672 #6 November 1, 2007 QuoteQuoteYeah, THAT will stop them from driving! If they can't get a DL, Then they can't fill out an I-9 form (OK's DL's are damn hard to counterfeit) If they can't fill out an I-9 Form, They can't get a job, No workie - no pay rent, no buy groceries, no buy gas = no live here, No live here, no drive here. . I doubt that. They'll just be part of the underground, cash based, economy instead where I9s aren't needed. Then they'll pay no taxes either. Quote In addition, that's only half the story. Oklahoma employers found guilty of hiring illegal aliens can be arrested. Good. That is a more likely way of dealing with the problem.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NCclimber 0 #7 November 1, 2007 I can hardly wait for all the flakes to start chiming in with: "But we're nation of immigrants... how dare you deny them the right to entry giving to your ancestors... the only true Americans are Native Americans... you hypocrite... it doesn't matter if they're here illegally, they're still entitled to free government handouts... blah, blah, blah..." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lefty 0 #8 November 1, 2007 QuoteI doubt that. They'll just be part of the underground, cash based, economy instead where I9s aren't needed. Then they'll pay no taxes either. Another endorsement for the FairTax. Ya'll heard it here, folks.Provoking a reaction isn't the same thing as saying something meaningful. -Calvin Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AWL71 0 #9 November 1, 2007 It should be a federal law.The most terrifying words in the English language are: I'm from the government and I'm here to help. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nathaniel 0 #10 November 1, 2007 Quote they're still entitled to free government handouts I take it then you now endorse free government handouts for citizens...My advice is to do what your parents did; get a job, sir. The bums will always lose. Do you hear me, Lebowski? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NCclimber 0 #11 November 1, 2007 QuoteQuote they're still entitled to free government handouts I take it then you now endorse free government handouts for citizens... What do you mean by "now"? Have I ever stated that we shouldn't have any social programs? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
masterrig 1 #12 November 1, 2007 How 'bout them Okies! That's a good start. Hopefully, the idea will spread and give other states the courage to stand-up and do something about the problem. All anyone seems concerned with is the money ie taxes that will be lost. What about the criminal element crossing our border? Houston, for example, has had a dramatic crime increase as a result of illegals. Other cities across this country are experiencing the same thing. All we do is cater to them because politicians have this wild idea they will gain votes and tax money and big business wants the cheap labor. I think, we the people are just being 'sold out'. Chuck Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
masterrig 1 #13 November 1, 2007 Just heard on the news, a judge in Oklahoma, over-ruled requests of Latino groups. The law stands. 1 down, 49 to go! Chuck Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BIGUN 1,097 #14 November 1, 2007 So far, before the law has even taken effect, 20,000 illegal immigrants have left Tulsa. It's not a perfect plan and there are ramifications: http://www.koco.com/news/14434766/detail.html?rss=okl&psp=news Now, here's where this has gone askew - and for this I blame the media. They're just sensationalizing a portion of the bill. There is a provision that allows those of illegal status to apply for temporary status, but the media doesn't tell them that, or how, or anything: A pending or approved application for temporary protected status in the United States; Approved deferred action status; or A pending application for adjustment of status to legal permanent residence status or conditional resident status. So for most of those fleeing who've been here for awhile, all they have to do is go down to INS and apply. As long as they haven't been arrested for a felony or DUI, there's an "amnesty" program (for lack of a better term) to put one on the path of legal status. Here's the bill. http://72.14.205.104/search?q=cache:dvFJSZC5udAJ:webserver1.lsb.state.ok.us/2007-08HB/HB1804_int.rtf+Oklahoma+HB+1804&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=1&gl=usNobody has time to listen; because they're desperately chasing the need of being heard. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andrewwhyte 1 #15 November 1, 2007 QuoteA. It shall be unlawful for any person to transport, move, or attempt to transport within the United States any alien knowing or in reckless disregard of the fact that the alien has come to, entered, or remained in the United States in violation of law, in furtherance of the illegal presence of the alien in the United States. So if Andy Copland asks for a ride to the DZ,...Felony Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Trent 0 #16 November 1, 2007 Quote So far, before the law has even taken effect, 20,000 illegal immigrants have left Tulsa. So, it's working already! Excellent! Other states and cities need to step it up. It is absolutely absurd to allow illegal immigrants any special protections or services. There just isn't a leg to stand on for "the other side" of this argument.Oh, hello again! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
masterrig 1 #17 November 1, 2007 QuoteQuote So far, before the law has even taken effect, 20,000 illegal immigrants have left Tulsa. So, it's working already! Excellent! Other states and cities need to step it up. It is absolutely absurd to allow illegal immigrants any special protections or services. There just isn't a leg to stand on for "the other side" of this argument. We have towns here in Texas, who have passed similar laws. A small hand-full of communities back East have also. Now that an entire state has taken action, we might just get their attention that we're tired of the whole mess. It's going to take time and effort on the part of all the states. Chuck Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Trent 0 #18 November 1, 2007 Would that MY town in Texas was one of them. Apparently, elected idiots are scared of the lobby that wants us to NOT uphold our laws.Oh, hello again! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
piper17 1 #19 November 1, 2007 It is. Now, if we could just get the federal government to enforce the immigration laws that are on the books!!!"A man can never have too much red wine, too many books, or too much ammunition"...Rudyard Kipling Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
masterrig 1 #20 November 1, 2007 Those idiot elected officials just don't want that 'gravy train' from the lobbyists to quit running. They have their 'agendas' and don't want anything or anyone getting in the way. Chuck Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AWL71 0 #21 November 1, 2007 QuoteIt is. Now, if we could just get the federal government to enforce the immigration laws that are on the books!!! Good point. Same thing can be said for gun laws. They need to enforce the ones on the books as opposed to making more.The most terrifying words in the English language are: I'm from the government and I'm here to help. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jm951 0 #22 November 1, 2007 The really sick part of handing DLs to the illegals is this-- many states have "motor voter" laws, so, give the illegal a DL, and presto, a new voter. Just where in the Constitution does it guarantee a non-citizen the right to vote in a US election? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
masterrig 1 #23 November 1, 2007 It doesn't say that anywhere... till now. Just so those politicians get those votes!!! Chuck Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andy9o8 0 #24 November 1, 2007 First, a technical point: I think this law, and others like it, is in serious jeopardy of being overturned by the Federal appellate courts, on the grounds that the Federal immigration laws preempt any state or local immigration laws. This was the basis, for example, upon which Hazelton, PA's immigration ordinance was struck down. A couple other random observations: Quote 3. The discharge of any United States citizen or permanent resident alien employee by an employer of this state, who, on the date of the discharge employed an unauthorized alien, shall be an unfair trade practice as defined in Section 752 of Title 15 of the Oklahoma Statutes. The discharged employee shall have a private cause of action for such unfair trade practice. Whoa. No exceptions for why you fired the citizen, not even if it's for willful misconduct. So under a literal reading, if employee Citizen Johnson is sitting on his ass with his feet up at 10:30 am, and Employer tells him "Get back to work", and Johnson laughs in his face and ignores him, and Employer fires him for this - but Illegal Gomez also worked there on that date - firing Johnson would be deemed an unfair trade practice for which Johnson could sue Employer. Interesting ranking of social priorities. Quote A. It shall be unlawful for any person to transport, move, or attempt to transport within the United States any alien knowing or in reckless disregard of the fact that the alien has come to, entered, or remained in the United States in violation of law, in furtherance of the illegal presence of the alien in the United States. Clumsily - or foolishly - drafted. It says "within the United States", not something like "within and/or into Oklahoma". Technically, that means that anyone doing this anywhere in the U.S. - for example, driving an illegal from Miami, FL to Ft. Lauderdale, FL to help him remain in the US illegally - would violate Oklahoma law. Oklahoma has no authority do that. But let's assume they amend this section to fix this little problem. Under a strict interpretation, if you simply give your illegal immigrant friend a lift to the grocery store in Tulsa, you could go to jail: he needs to be able to eat to keep himself alive in order to remain in the US, so by driving him to the store, you're furthering his illegal presence in the US. Now there's a real chiller to picking up a hitch-hiker who's a little too brownish. "Pick up a wetback; risk a big setback." Brrrrr. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 1,672 #25 November 1, 2007 QuoteThe really sick part of handing DLs to the illegals is this-- many states have "motor voter" laws, so, give the illegal a DL, and presto, a new voter. Just where in the Constitution does it guarantee a non-citizen the right to vote in a US election? Voter registration is not automatic when you get a driver's license - you are also required to affirm that you are eligible to vote. Giving a false answer is a felony and is grounds for deportation, even for LEGAL immigrants. Is there any evidence that illegal aliens are actually registering as voters due to this law in numbers sufficient to affect the outcome of any election?... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
