Border patrol officers convicted

[4201 0]

Border cops convicted of shooting at a drug smuggler on the mexican border? Sentenced to 10+? Some thing does not sound right.
Anyone got a thought on this?

[akarunway 1]

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Border cops convicted of shooting at a drug smuggler on the mexican border? Sentenced to 10+? Some thing does not sound right.
Anyone got a thought on this?

Maybe he can share a cell w/ the pedophile border control cop that got arrested today

I hold it true, whate'er befall;
I feel it, when I sorrow most;
'Tis better to have loved and lost
Than never to have loved at all.

[freethefly 6]

Not sure what to think of this as I cannot find the full story as to what happened. Seems that there was some attempt to cover up the shooting (picking up the casings and not reporting the firing of a weapon). No mention of the guy pulling a gun only that he was running away and was shot in the ass.

03/09/2006

Associated Press


Two U.S. Border Patrol agents were convicted Wednesday of wounding a suspected drug smuggler and trying to cover up the shooting.

Agents Jose Alonso Compean and Ignacio Ramos were convicted of several counts of assault, weapons offenses, obstruction of justice and a civil rights offense.

Federal prosecutors said Ramos and Compean shot Osvaldo Aldrete Davila on Feb. 17, 2005, after the man ran from agents trying to make a traffic stop near the border in Fabens. Agents later found about 700 pounds of marijuana inside a van Aldrete was driving.

Compean was accused of firing several shots at Aldrete and then picking up his bullet casings. Ramos was accused of firing the single shot that hit Aldrete in the buttocks.

Both men admitted in court that they didn't report the incident, but Ramos said he assumed one of several other agents at the scene had reported it. They also testified during the two-week trial that they shot at Aldrete, who ran back across the Rio Grande into Mexico after being wounded, because they thought he had a gun.

Sentencing has been scheduled for June 8. Defense lawyers for the agents, who will remain free on bail until their sentencing, said the men could face up to life in prison because of the civil rights charge.

Families of the two agents were in tears and shocked by the verdict.

"It's the biggest injustice. These are two dedicated agents with 15 years of service combined and this is how the government pays them back? This is a day for the drug dealers to celebrate," Joe Loya, Ramos' father-in-law, said in a story in Thursday's El Paso Times.

"The jury spoke pretty loudly," Assistant U.S. Attorney Debra Kanof said. "It's very important that we police our own."

Border Patrol officials will decide Thursday whether the two agents will be fired.

"...And once you're gone, you can't come back
When you're out of the blue and into the black."
Neil Young

[BillyVance 34]

Yeah, that happened months ago. The trial was a sham. Some stupid overzealous prosecutor pushed this way too hard.

These were bad people that got shot. Damn shame they weren't killed.

"Mediocre people don't like high achievers, and high achievers don't like mediocre people." - SIX TIME National Champion coach Nick Saban

[jenfly00 0]

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Yeah, that happened months ago. The trial was a sham. Some stupid overzealous prosecutor pushed this way too hard.

These were bad people that got shot. Damn shame they weren't killed.

No comment about the severity of sentencing, let's define 'bad'. He was smuggling pot, he was stopped, he ran away, they shot him in the back (in the ass, actually).

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"O brave new world that has such people in it".

[ryoder 1,411]

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No comment about the severity of sentencing, let's define 'bad'. He was smuggling pot, he was stopped, he ran away, they shot him in the back (in the ass, actually).

I have a problem with an armed law enforcement officer shooting someone while on the job, and then covering it up. The fact they tried to cover it up shows they knew it was unjustified. Even it it had been justified, there would still be no excuse for covering it up.

"There are only three things of value: younger women, faster airplanes, and bigger crocodiles" - Arthur Jones.

[Balls 0]

I'm all for harsher treatment of drug dealers, but covering up a shooting is bull.

It sounds like there is quite a bit missing from the story.

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....so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who knew neither victory nor defeat."

[Zee 0]

They forgot to mention that they were pursuing a Mexican drug smuggler who had 800 lbs of pot in his van. The smuggler beat up one of the officers before running across the border. The smuggler was shot in the ass while evading capture.

I believe it was a couple of weeks later a Homeland Security agent in Arizona received a phone call from the smuggler's Mother who complained that her son had been shot in the ass while smuggling drugs across the border. The U.S Government then offered the smuggler complete immunity from prosecution and free medical care in exchange for his testimony against the Border Patrol agents.

Several other officers including their supervisor was present after the incident and also knew about the shooting but they also failed to file the paperwork for discharging their fire arms while on duty. They did not know if they had hit the smuggler since he was picked up by a waiting car across the border.

Just Google the agents name and you can find the whole story

This is total bullshit.

Action©Sports

[jenfly00 0]

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They forgot to mention that they were pursuing a Mexican drug smuggler who had 800 lbs of pot in his van. The smuggler beat up one of the officers before running across the border. The smuggler was shot in the ass while evading capture.

I believe it was a couple of weeks later a Homeland Security agent in Arizona received a phone call from the smuggler's Mother who complained that her son had been shot in the ass while smuggling drugs across the border. The U.S Government then offered the smuggler complete immunity from prosecution and free medical care in exchange for his testimony against the Border Patrol agents.

Several other officers including their supervisor was present after the incident and also knew about the shooting but they also failed to file the paperwork for discharging their fire arms while on duty. They did not know if they had hit the smuggler since he was picked up by a waiting car across the border.

Just Google the agents name and you can find the whole story

This is total bullshit.

"According to testimony, Compean swung his shotgun around in an attempt to hit Aldrete-Davila with the butt of his weapon, but lost his footing and fell face down into the dirt and brush."

http://www.usdoj.gov/usao/txw/press_releases/2006/Sutton%20statement%20re%20compean%20and%20ramos%20conviction.pdf


Your version ("The smuggler beat up one of the officers") seems a bit ...well,dishonest.

In addition:

"At the time of the shooting, neither agent Compean nor agent Ramos knew that the van driven by Aldrete-Davila contained 743 pounds of marijuana. The evidence was un-controverted that, at the time the victim was shot, neither agent knew whether the driver was illegally in the United States or whether a crime had been committed. The only information they had was that the driver had failed to pull over to be identified."

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"O brave new world that has such people in it".

[Richards 0]

No problem with them shooting him in the back. If you are running from the cops when you know they will shoot at you then you have only yourself to blame. Covering it up did however cross the line.

Richards

My biggest handicap is that sometimes the hole in the front of my head operates a tad bit faster than the grey matter contained within.

[Zee 0]

There are a few different versions - that's why I suggested people Google the names to get the whole story.

The simple fact is that the U.S Government gave complete immunity against prosecution to a freakin' international drug smuggler in exchange for his testimony against two Border Patrol Agents. In addition, they're also aiding the smuggler in a 5,000,000 lawsuit for Civil Rights violations. Guilty or not, that's fucked up.

So now the drug smuggler goes free while we have two less agents and a demoralized Border Patrol.

Even if they are guilty as charged - how can we prosecute one guilty party while letting the other go free in exchange for his testimony?

Total bullshit.

Action©Sports

[ryoder 1,411]

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No problem with them shooting him in the back.

http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/lawenforcement/policeintegrity/chapter1.htm

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Law enforcement officers are authorized to use deadly force only when it is reasonable and necessary to protect the officer or others from an imminent danger of death or serious physical injury to the officer or another person

"There are only three things of value: younger women, faster airplanes, and bigger crocodiles" - Arthur Jones.

[Richards 0]

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No problem with them shooting him in the back.

http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/lawenforcement/policeintegrity/chapter1.htm

***Law enforcement officers are authorized to use deadly force only when it is reasonable and necessary to protect the officer or others from an imminent danger of death or serious physical injury to the officer or another person

Well I suppose they could use the 12 guage loaded with birdshot or an appropriate small shot. It would take him down without killing him (unless it was real close). Why should they risk ambush by chasing him into the desert if they can just take him down (provided they give him a warning). Choice and consequence. If he does not want a doctor picking buckshot out of his ass then he should stop running when told to do so. These smugglers can get quite violent when pursued so why should the border patrol risk it?

Richards

My biggest handicap is that sometimes the hole in the front of my head operates a tad bit faster than the grey matter contained within.

[Calvin19 0]

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Families of the two agents were in tears and shocked by the verdict.
.

i hate people.

i really do.

not only does it bug me that the border patrol fuckers SHOT someone they didnt need to and cover it up, but the FAMILY was shocked they are getting punished accordingly for it. people are so stupid.

[jenfly00 0]

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No problem with them shooting him in the back.

http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/lawenforcement/policeintegrity/chapter1.htm

***Law enforcement officers are authorized to use deadly force only when it is reasonable and necessary to protect the officer or others from an imminent danger of death or serious physical injury to the officer or another person

Well I suppose they could use the 12 guage loaded with birdshot or an appropriate small shot. It would take him down without killing him (unless it was real close). Why should they risk ambush by chasing him into the desert if they can just take him down (provided they give him a warning). Choice and consequence. If he does not want a doctor picking buckshot out of his ass then he should stop running when told to do so. These smugglers can get quite violent when pursued so why should the border patrol risk it?

Richards

They gave him a choice, he attempted to surrender with hands in the air. One officer attempted to beat him with the butt of his shotgun (missed, slipped and fell on his face). The guy ran away, they tried to kill him, then tried to cover it up. The only crime the officers were aware of at this point was failure to stop his vehicle.

"This office did not prosecute the defendants because they had violated Border Patrol policies. They were prosecuted because they had fired their weapons at a man who had attempted to surrender, but, while his open hands were held in the air, Agent Compean attempted to hit the man with the butt of his shotgun. In fear of what the agents would do to him next, the man ran away from the agents, who then fired at least 15 rounds at him, although they had seen his open hands and knew that he was not holding a weapon and had no reason to think that he had a weapon, hitting him once causing serious bodily injury. The references to policies are made only to demonstrate that had the defendants believed that the shooting was justified, there was no reason for them to conceal it from supervisors and remove evidence from the scene. The laws of the United States make it a crime for law enforcement officers to use excessive force in apprehending suspects. It is a violation of any person’s Constitutional rights to shoot at them after they have attempted to surrender, knowing that they are unarmed and pose no danger to the officers or anyone else. "

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"O brave new world that has such people in it".

[jenfly00 0]

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Families of the two agents were in tears and shocked by the verdict.
.

i hate people.

i really do.

not only does it bug me that the border patrol fuckers SHOT someone they didnt need to and cover it up, but the FAMILY was shocked they are getting punished accordingly for it. people are so stupid.

Reading some of the replies here, not just the family.

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"O brave new world that has such people in it".

[Zee 0]

But it's totally ok to smuggle over $1,000,000 worth of pot across an international border?

I'm not saying the Border Patrol agents are innocent but, neither is the damned drug smuggler. How can you justify tossing two Border Patrol Agents in jail for 10+ years based on the testimony of the drug smuggler they were trying to apprehend while giving him immunity for crimes that would otherwise send his ass to prison for at least an equal term?

Action©Sports

[jenfly00 0]

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But it's totally ok to smuggle over $1,000,000 worth of pot across an international border?

I'm not saying the Border Patrol agents are innocent but, neither is the damned drug smuggler. How can you justify tossing two Border Patrol Agents in jail for 10+ years based on the testimony of the drug smuggler they were trying to apprehend while giving him immunity for crimes that would otherwise send his ass to prison for at least an equal term?

They were trying to apprehend (and murder) someone who (from what they knew) had broken no laws, then attempted to cover it up (based on their own testimony).

"The evidence was un-controverted [uncontroverted: not disputed or opposed] that, at the time the victim was shot, neither agent knew whether the driver was illegally in the United States or whether a crime had been committed."

So a pot smuggler gets a pass to get two sworn officers who attempted to murder someone who (as far as they knew at the time) had broken no laws. If the border patrol is demoralized because of this, then we have a much larger problem than this case. Seems a realistic tradeoff to me.

Why is this pill so hard for you to swallow?

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"O brave new world that has such people in it".

[Zee 0]

I'm not defending the actions of the Boarder Patrol Agents. I just don't see how they can justify giving a known drug smuggler immunity against prosecution in exchange for his testimony against the very Agents who were trying to apprehend him. Do you honestly think that his testimony will be true and accurate?

Why in the hell should this drug smuggling asshole get a free pass plus government aid in filing a $5,000,000 lawsuit - he was shot in the ass during the commission of a serious international crime?

Action©Sports

[jenfly00 0]

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I'm not defending the actions of the Boarder Patrol Agents. I just don't see how they can justify giving a known drug smuggler immunity against prosecution in exchange for his testimony against the very Agents who were trying to apprehend him. Do you honestly think that his testimony will be true and accurate?

Why in the hell should this drug smuggling asshole get a free pass plus government aid in filing a $5,000,000 lawsuit - he was shot in the ass during the commission of a serious international crime?

whatever

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"O brave new world that has such people in it".

[Zee 0]

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They were trying to apprehend (and murder) someone who (from what they knew) had broken no laws, then attempted to cover it up (based on their own testimony).

Now I’d have to say that your version is, well, dishonest.

That was not their testimony - here is what Ramos said: Link

Ramos said Aldrete-Davila pointed what he believed to be a gun at him. Ramos fired one shot. He did not know the single shot had hit Aldrete-Davila in the buttocks because the smuggler kept running and disappeared into the brush along the Rio Grande.

Aldrete-Davila was later seen by agents at the scene getting into a van on the Mexican side of the border. He left behind a van filled with nearly 800 pounds of marijuana, worth more than $1 million. The U.S. Attorney's Office gave Aldrete-Davila immunity and free medical care at William Beaumont Army Medical Center for his testimony against the agents.

And here’s what some of the jurors said following the trial:

“Claudia and another juror, Bob Grouley, who teaches special-needs students, said the guidelines provided to the jury were at times difficult to understand and that several of the guidelines regarding the convictions were open to interpretation. Both added that several of the jurors, including the foreman, pressured colleagues to go with a guilty verdict because spring break was a week away and they didn't want to be stuck in a long deliberation. Grouley said the foreman told the jurors, several of whom were holding out, that Judge Cardone would not accept a hung jury. The foreman, whose name is being withheld, could not be reached for comment.

Grouley said he contacted Mary Stillenger, Ramos' attorney, several weeks after the trial was over to let her know he was not comfortable with the verdict.

"We had to go by the judge's orders, but this punishment doesn't fit the crime," Grouley said.”

Feel free to check out CNN’s interview with Jose Compean Link


You're basing your remarks soley on the prosecutions press release. There is a lot more to this story than that.

It makes absolutely no sense that two decorated agents would just pull the guy out of the van and without being provoked in any way, start shooting at him while he's waving his hands in the air.

I'm sure there's more to this story than the Agents testimony as well - but there is no way in hell these guys received a fair trial.


What else is to be expected when when you pay a criminal for his testimony?

Action©Sports

[akarunway 1]

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I'm all for harsher treatment of drug dealers, but covering up a shooting is bull.

It sounds like there is quite a bit missing from the story.

Drug dealers. POT. Gimme a break. How bout the phamachutical corps,(big corps) and doctors shoving all the fuckin drugs down your throat you dont need. Gimme a fuckin break. I'll smoke a joint rather any day. BUT I can't cause I have to take drug tests for work. But's it OK to get bilthering drunk. WTF is wrong w/ this picture?

I hold it true, whate'er befall;
I feel it, when I sorrow most;
'Tis better to have loved and lost
Than never to have loved at all.

[akarunway 1]

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No problem with them shooting him in the back. If you are running from the cops when you know they will shoot at you then you have only yourself to blame. Covering it up did however cross the line.

So. If you are RUNNING away and not a threat that justifies attempted homicide?

I hold it true, whate'er befall;
I feel it, when I sorrow most;
'Tis better to have loved and lost
Than never to have loved at all.

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[akarunway 1]

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But it's totally ok to smuggle over $1,000,000 worth of pot across an international border?

I'm not saying the Border Patrol agents are innocent but, neither is the damned drug smuggler. How can you justify tossing two Border Patrol Agents in jail for 10+ years based on the testimony of the drug smuggler they were trying to apprehend while giving him immunity for crimes that would otherwise send his ass to prison for at least an equal term?

Me thinks it's called the U.S Constitution and the prevailing law. Boy I sure hope you ain't a cop or judge

I hold it true, whate'er befall;
I feel it, when I sorrow most;
'Tis better to have loved and lost
Than never to have loved at all.

[Zipp0 1]

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Yeah, that happened months ago. The trial was a sham. Some stupid overzealous prosecutor pushed this way too hard.

These were bad people that got shot. Damn shame they weren't killed.

Someone read one too many "Judge Dredd" comix growing up, or God forbid, saw the movie.

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Chuck Norris doesn't do push-ups, he pushes the Earth down.