"Bodies" Exhibition & Ethics in Art

[masterblaster72 0]

Anyone else think this exhibition is beyond morbid and disrespectful to the dead? I have an open mind when it comes to art, but this is where I draw my line. I have friends who have gone to see this and enjoyed it and encouraged me to go, but after seeing some pictures (you can get a glance here) I say no way in hell would I go -- for ethical reasons and simply because I find no aesthetic value in a dead human body.

What I find especially revolting is the way some of the bodies are carved up and/or positioned in certain ways for spectacle.

And as an aside, I heard the exhibition is smelly too -- I imagine it's the formaldehyde or whatever preservatives they use to keep the bodies from decomposing.

I just don't see how someone would be motivated to go see this, but I'm curious to hear other opinions. Thanks.

Be humble, ask questions, listen, learn, follow the golden rule, talk when necessary, and know when to shut the fuck up.

[MarkR 0]

Quote

Anyone else think this exhibition is beyond morbid and disrespectful to the dead?

Yes. Me.

»Somewhere between the lies and truths borderlines get shady.
Somewhere between the yesses and nos you can find the maybe.«

[Skyrad 0]

I went to see it in London. Far from being morbid I found it fascinating. There was no smell as the bodies are plasticinated. From a anatomical perspective the exhibits were very interesting. The funniest thing was that in the comments book underneath lots of pretentious comments on the exhibition someone had simply written...

I see dead people.


I would recommend this exhibition to anyone execpt the recently bereaved and women who've had abortions. As for disrespectful to the dead I disagree, unlike some other exhibitions Dr Gunter Von Hagen only uses the bodies of volunteers of which there are hundreds.

When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy.
Lucius Annaeus Seneca

[Rebecca 0]

Are you kidding me??

These people donated their bodies well before they died for the purpose of this exhibit.

It's absolutely fascinating and educational - I would take my kids in a heartbeat!


This isn't just art, it's science. And no it's not smelly at all - even remotely.

Do your research - this is amazing, and we can all benefit from SEEING how incredible the body is.

you've got to ask yourself one question: 'Do I feel loquacious?' -- well do you, punk?

[kallend 1,651]

Quote

Anyone else think this exhibition is beyond morbid and disrespectful to the dead? I have an open mind when it comes to art, but this is where I draw my line. I have friends who have gone to see this and enjoyed it and encouraged me to go, but after seeing some pictures (you can get a glance here) I say no way in hell would I go -- for ethical reasons and simply because I find no aesthetic value in a dead human body.

What I find especially revolting is the way some of the bodies are carved up and/or positioned in certain ways for spectacle.

And as an aside, I heard the exhibition is smelly too -- I imagine it's the formaldehyde or whatever preservatives they use to keep the bodies from decomposing.

I just don't see how someone would be motivated to go see this, but I'm curious to hear other opinions. Thanks.

Who said is was art?

It's science, it's well done.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[masterblaster72 0]

Quote

Are you kidding me??

These people donated their bodies well before they died for the purpose of this exhibit.

My understanding, from this and several other articles about "Bodies: The Exhibition" is that no consent was given by those on exhibit when they were alive. That's something I have an ethical problem with. It is Guther von Hagen's "Body Worlds" where those being exhibited gave consent.

Be humble, ask questions, listen, learn, follow the golden rule, talk when necessary, and know when to shut the fuck up.

[beowulf 1]

I saw this exhibit in Chicago and I was fascinated by it. I think everyone should go see it.

[masterblaster72 0]

Quote

Who said is was art?

It's science, it's well done.

I get the idea that it's art from the way the bodies are being shaped in for spectacle -- resembles sculpture. Also read a promotion about it with the words "celebrating the wonder of the human form."

Be humble, ask questions, listen, learn, follow the golden rule, talk when necessary, and know when to shut the fuck up.

[Skyrad 0]

Sorry, my mistake. No I wouldn't go and see this particular exhibition either. Two bodies were alegedly found to have been shot. Political prisoners. No way.

When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy.
Lucius Annaeus Seneca

[Rebecca 0]

Quote

Quote

Are you kidding me??

These people donated their bodies well before they died for the purpose of this exhibit.

My understanding, from this and several other articles about "Bodies: The Exhibition" is that no consent was given by those on exhibit when they were alive. That's something I have an ethical problem with. It is Guther von Hagen's "Body Worlds" where those being exhibited gave consent.

Let me clarify: I have seen the Body Worlds exhibit. This is the installment I know about - with bodies in acrobatic, ballet, and social poses - as well as every system in the body, healthy and diseased, cross-sectioned and whole.

The horse and rider exhibit is astounding.



Any use of a body that wasn't donated, willed, volunteered, or otherwise appropriately and respectfully acquisitioned is of course unethical.

you've got to ask yourself one question: 'Do I feel loquacious?' -- well do you, punk?

[Skyrad 0]

Yea, I made the same mistake.

When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy.
Lucius Annaeus Seneca

[Nightingale 0]

With regards to BodyWorlds:

No, the exhibit does not smell.

No, it isn't disrespectful. The bodies were donated to the institute specifically for the purpose of plastination and educating the public. There is a huge demand for plastinated human specimens from medical schools and science classes, and the exhibit makes people aware that this kind of donation is possible. The exhibit is set up in a way to not only educate the public about human anatomy, but to demonstrate that the human body is also an amazing work of art. Visitors to the exhibit were very aware that they were looking at real people, and approached the exhibit with a reverent state of mind. I didn't see a single person disrespecting any of the bodies in the exhibit.

When I went to the exhibit, I learned an incredible amount of information about the human body and how it works. My brother learned what smoking does to a human lung. He quit.

Before you judge the exhibit, go see it. You might learn something, and, at the very least, you'll be able to discuss it from a knowledgable standpoint.

[masterblaster72 0]

Quote

Before you judge the exhibit, go see it. You might learn something, and, at the very least, you'll be able to discuss it from a knowledgable standpoint.

Fair enough; I posted here to get other points of view on the exhibit to understand why someone would go see it. But the exhibit I'm talking about is "Bodies: The Exhibition," not Gunther von Hagen's "Body Worlds." They're similar, but different.

edited for a spelling mistake

Be humble, ask questions, listen, learn, follow the golden rule, talk when necessary, and know when to shut the fuck up.

[Skyrad 0]

Agreed.

When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy.
Lucius Annaeus Seneca

[Nightingale 0]

I've heard of Bodies: the Exhibition, but I've heard BodyWorlds is much better, and doesn't have the ethical issues.

There are legal ways for science to obtain bodies without the consent of the donor, for example, someone who dies with no next-of-kin to claim the body. Bodies like that are usually made available to medical schools, etc... However, I don't think that bodies should be used for public display without permission of the donor, or at least, the family. If the donor or family desires to be a part of the public's scientific education, great! But if they haven't made that choice, the body should go to a medical school or other scientific research that is not in the public eye.

[Lindsey 0]

I think it's exceptionally well-done. It's educational and artistic.

linz

--
A conservative is just a liberal who's been mugged. A liberal is just a conservative who's been to jail

[FlyingJ 0]

I thought the exhibit was absolutely amazing. I'm not sure that some pictures of it can do it justice though. I went in a little weary of what I was going to see, but the way it was presented was incredibly fascinating, educational and tasteful.

Killing threads since 2004.

[pirana 0]

Quote

However, I don't think that bodies should be used for public display without permission of the donor, or at least, the family.

Why is that? If no family member can even be located to be informed of the person's death, who's going to be offended. It's not like anyone could identify the person once they are disected.

" . . . the lust for power can be just as completely satisfied by suggesting people into loving their servitude as by flogging them and kicking them into obedience." -- Aldous Huxley

[masterblaster72 0]

Quote

I thought the exhibit was absolutely amazing. I'm not sure that some pictures of it can do it justice though. I went in a little weary of what I was going to see, but the way it was presented was incredibly fascinating, educational and tasteful.

How does one find this to be in good taste? Personally, I find it morbid as all hell, bordering on sadistic.

Not challenging your morals or anything, but I'm at a loss as to how you could find something like that tasteful. I'm genuinely curious to hear your thoughts.

Be humble, ask questions, listen, learn, follow the golden rule, talk when necessary, and know when to shut the fuck up.

[masterblaster72 0]

Quote

Quote

However, I don't think that bodies should be used for public display without permission of the donor, or at least, the family.

Why is that? If no family member can even be located to be informed of the person's death, who's going to be offended. It's not like anyone could identify the person once they are disected.

My answer to that would be that everyone has a right to a burial/cremation and to rest in peace, regardless of whether the person has family or not.

Or failing that, everyone at least has the right not to have their body turned into a public spectacle that others profit from.

Be humble, ask questions, listen, learn, follow the golden rule, talk when necessary, and know when to shut the fuck up.

[pirana 0]

Quote

My answer to that would be that everyone has a right to a burial/cremation and to rest in peace, regardless of whether the person has family or not.

Or failing that, everyone at least has the right not to have their body turned into a public spectacle that others profit from.

Not to be redundant, but I have to ask why to that also. Where are those rights coming from? Are they codified somewhere, or personal opinion?

I'm going on the assumption, stated elsewhere in the thread, that any bodies not donated specifically for this were completely unclaimed.

Who is being hurt anyway if there is no live person to be offended? I'm also operating under the assumption that a dead body with no next of kin has no "rights."

" . . . the lust for power can be just as completely satisfied by suggesting people into loving their servitude as by flogging them and kicking them into obedience." -- Aldous Huxley

[Nightingale 0]

Because just because they can't locate a next-of-kin doesn't mean there isn't one.

Many of the BodyWorlds bodies could be identified if you knew the person. They didn't always remove all the skin, so sometimes you could tell what the person looked like.

Culturally, our bodies are something personal and precious, and if someone (or their family) doesn't consent to being put on display, then they shouldn't be put on display.

[Trent 0]

While this may be about the "Bodies" exhibition, I'll comment on the "BodyWorlds" that I saw here at the museum in Houston.

I wasn't overly offended by the exhibit, but I DO feel that the premise that it is a science exhibit is total crap. If the only reason for the exhibit was to show anatomy, it would be much less a spectacle. As it is, the bodies there are put into some poses that really made me ask if this guy is trying to make "shock art" under the guise of science in order to get it approved by the museums and the masses. Some of the bodies are flayed and mangled in ways that seem pretty tasteless to me. See the guy with his face pulled up like a witches hat and riding is spinal column like a broom. Also, I think I read while at the exhibit that the von Hagens guy is a dentist. It'd have a little less "artsy wannabe" feel to it if that weren't the case, IMO.

Not to mention that I've read articles in science mags that accuse the "artist" of buying bodies of executed Chinese prisoners. In retrospect, some of the bodies DID have Asian characteristics to them, even though the fake eyes were blue.

The exhibit is interesting, but it could be done with more taste. I'd probably find it just as fascinating if the "artistry" had been left out of it. The fact that it looked as if it was art undercover as science kinda took away from it.EDIT- He's a visiting prof at my alma mater's dentistry school... that's where I got that.

Oh, hello again!

[Armour666 0]

No it’s not disrespectful as all have chosen to donate their bodies to this. I found it very fascinating and incite full to the working of the human body. My friend who is in med school at U of T said after a survey over 90% of med classes has gone to the exhibit. I found it not so much art but more interesting that they were positioned in ways that people lives are, caught in motion. He’s not a dentist you can read more of his BIO on the website. I took my oldest son to see it he’s only 5 at the time, he was always asking about the body and reading picture books from school on it. A year latter he still talks about it!! It’s a well don’t tastefully done exhibit. I would donate my body to it if it wouldn’t cost to dam much to ship my dead ass over to him when the time comes. Many of the creation they do full time are destined for med schools.

http://www.bodyworlds.com

SO this one time at band camp.....

"Of all the things I've lost I miss my mind the most."

[Skyrad 0]

http://www.bodyworlds.com

There you go

When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy.
Lucius Annaeus Seneca