peckerhead 0 #26 March 27, 2007 QuoteQuote...wouldn't it make more sense to try and open the buckle first? They reported that the buckle was unreachable due to the position of the jumper's body. Understood. It sounds like the proper action was taken under the circumstances. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dontiego 0 #27 March 27, 2007 Quoteive only ever seen buckles like (or actually) B12 snaps that hook onto leg straps The only belts I've seen have buckles that look like RSL snap shackles, but much bigger. No problem releasing them even if there's much pressure (I guess). B12 is like regular car seatbelts, right? Couldn't google it."We call on the common man to rise up in revolt against this evil of typographical ignorance." http://bancomicsans.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dragon2 0 #28 March 27, 2007 Why couldn't you google it? ciel bleu, Saskia Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dontiego 0 #29 March 27, 2007 QuoteWhy couldn't you google it? 'cause i tried "buckle", "seatbelt", "belt", but not "snaps". Now I know everything about B12 vitamin. Thanks for making me look like an idiot (and don't reply I don't need help for that). Isn't the use of snap shackles common for seatbelts?"We call on the common man to rise up in revolt against this evil of typographical ignorance." http://bancomicsans.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pirana 0 #30 March 27, 2007 QuoteI hate to admit that although I have never jumped while still strapped, (knock on wood!) I have been strapped all the way to altitude at least 5 times before moving a bit and noticing I am still strapped. On the up side, when possible I always put the seatbelt with no slack around my body (not just the harness), so I notice as soon as I try to move. This is one ot the things that I have a tendency to forget. (Argh!) I do that too (cinch it down, regardless of how it is routed). I have forgotten a couple times, but it was very obvious as soon as I made any movement that the belt was still on. No way was I gonna get close to getting out. I've noticed some people just loop it through or around and leave a boatload of slack. Why wear it if you're gonna do that? Also, I too will keep my belt on sometimes when there is a full Otter load and I'm in the last spot on the bench. Beats fighting my weight, and the weight of those behind me. But again, it is tight enough that I'm not gonna be able to get out with the belt still on." . . . the lust for power can be just as completely satisfied by suggesting people into loving their servitude as by flogging them and kicking them into obedience." -- Aldous Huxley Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tombuch 0 #31 March 27, 2007 Quote I've noticed some people just loop it through or around and leave a boatload of slack. Why wear it if you're gonna do that? One reason is that on some airplanes the seatbelts don't really work and the nylon won't slide through the tension bar. Jumpers that make lots of skydives on those planes learn not to bother tightening the belt because it won't tighten, and then don't bother when they get a belt that actually will work. I've made thousands of jumps on planes with beat-up old belts that have stiff nylon that won't move, or nylon with abrasions that jam in the mechanism. I've complained, but the owners don't think of seatbelts as critical equipment and neither do most jumpers. My suggestion is to tighten the belt if you can, and complain to management if you can't. Consider the maintenance of seatbelts to be a critical safety element, and if they aren't properly maintained you should question the rest of the maintenance program.Tom Buchanan Instructor Emeritus Comm Pilot MSEL,G Author: JUMP! Skydiving Made Fun and Easy Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pilotdave 0 #32 March 27, 2007 QuoteIsn't the use of snap shackles common for seatbelts? In the US, we're required to use approved (TSOd) aircraft seatbelts... just like the ones in airliners. Dave Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
porpoishead 5 #33 March 27, 2007 QuoteQuoteive only ever seen buckles like (or actually) B12 snaps that hook onto leg straps The only belts I've seen have buckles that look like RSL snap shackles, but much bigger. No problem releasing them even if there's much pressure (I guess). B12 is like regular car seatbelts, right? Couldn't google it. not sure how b-12 got mixed in here, but there is no practical reason where a b-12 would be used as passenger restraint. b-12 type snap hook is an off-load type release mechanism, meaning that while under load it cannot release. typical configuration for passenger restraint buckles are on-load release mechanisms of various types, meaning the buckle will release while bearing a load. its practicality and advantage are, that after a crash/collision or whatever, in this case hanging outside an aircraft, you might find yourself in an uncompromising situation like hanging upside down, being dragged, where releiving the load on the buckle is not an option, thus an on load release. with all of this said even with an on-load release system, sometimes the release/buckle cannot be accessed during said inccident. in which case having some type of cutting device readily accessible makes sense. for that matter have two(2) cause two is one and one is none. perhaps a good hook knife and a scissors. hopefully there is nobody out there using an off-load type release mechanism on passenger restraints, especially on aircraft. edited to add: photo of a b-12 snapif you want a friend feed any animal Perry Farrell Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
d20111 0 #34 March 27, 2007 Quote -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- In Reply To -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ...wouldn't it make more sense to try and open the buckle first? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- They reported that the buckle was unreachable due to the position of the jumper's body. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- It's also possible for the buckle to be threaded through the leg strap or lateral, and as the person falls away the released buckle jams under the nylon strap, making it impossible to free while under tension. Obviously opening the belt is an easier way to handle a hang-up than cutting the belt, but sometimes, as you noted in this case, it isn't enough. That's why every jumpship should have a knife, and hopefully there will still be a person on the plane able to use it. That's something for everybody to check at your home drop zone next weekend! This is something I plan for. Whenever possible I always put the flat side of the belt between my leg and harness. Threading it in from the bottom. Then, if somehow you do forget on jumprun you can simply pull the buckle and the flat side of the buckle will just slide out. It also makes it a lot easier to unbuckle on a crowded plane. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
grue 1 #35 April 15, 2007 QuoteSeatbelts MUST be removed before any door is opened for obvious reasons. Barring that, there's no hard and fast reason to remove a seatbelt by X feet (other than as a way to avoid forgetting it, that is!) For what it's worth, when my dytter beeps, I take off my seatbelt, then take off my helmet. Getting into a standard operating procedure helps.cavete terrae. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
