cypres vs. vigil

[erdnarob 1]

Go for Vigil II. They are way more advanced in technology and certainly more user's friendly. There is no scheduled maintenance but anytime you would like to have yours maintained, you can send it back to the manufacturer. The Vigil II tells you in clear language the 3 items it's testing and shut off if one test fails. The Vigil II has 3 modes (Student, Pro, Tandem) you can choose from within a couple of minutes. That feature makes your device easier to sell or for a DZO easier to manage the DZ equipment. The make is also way stronger than competitor's with sturdy cast aluminum and kevlar reinforced cables. Check on google: Advanced Aerospace Designs. This is the Vigil manufacturer. You will have all details you are looking for.

Learn from others mistakes, you will never live long enough to make them all.

[BUBLHED 0]

Also, the vigil very clearly says, student, pro or tandem on the display. So if you turn it on then you will know how it's set. You do look at the display after you turn it on don't you? If you're concerned about accidentally changing settings then you're just as likely to accidentally change the ground offset on either device.


Of course I look at the display. I guess since you are obviously so much smarter than me you have never locked your keys in the car. My point is there are things distracting us all day long. Maybie your trying to catch a load last minute, maybie some hot chick walks by, or someone asks you some kind of question. It would be easy to mess-up. Not saying or implying (as you are) that anyone is an idiot but mistakes can and will happen. I like the simplicity of the cypres. You are no dobt pro Vigil and thats cool. either will work I prefer cypres.

ATTACK LIFE ! IT'S GOING TO KILL YOU ANYWAY!!!!

[antonija 0]

"Have you heard from BUBLHED lately?"

"Dude... he died... :\"

"How'd that happen?"

"A hot chick walked by the DZ and his vigil fired... downplaned right into the ground."

It really doesn't take any "smart" to check lifesaving stuff... even with hot chicks around.

I understand the need for conformity. Without a concise set of rules to follow we would probably all have to resort to common sense. -David Thorne

[erdnarob 1]

Cypres and Vigil are based on the same simple 3 factors : pressure sensor, timer and software. Vigil is just more up to date and leave you the choice (like the argus) to set up your mode and that chosen mode stays clearly on display when the device is switched on. Your comparison with a key set locked in the car is wrong since it is sure you have no more access to your key. OTOH forgetting to switch on your AAD doesn't garantee you will die. Anyway, AAD status check should be part of the every jump check up just like checking your pins.

Learn from others mistakes, you will never live long enough to make them all.

[pilotdave 0]

Fact is that there have been vigil fires caused by the unit being set to the wrong mode. How that happened, I don't know. Seems crazy. But it simply can't happen with a cypres. And being able to switch modes just isn't an advantage to a regular jumper. It's functionality they will never use. It might make some sense for a DZ, which might have to move AADs between tandem and student rigs, etc.

I'm not saying the vigil has no advantages, I'm just suggesting that multiple modes is not a valuable advantage, and has been a disadvantage where it was misused.

Dave

[BUBLHED 0]

Exactly. The point is that although bonehead mistakes like setting the wrong mode shouldn't happen, they can. With only one mode it eliminates that possibility. Yes you could set up the wrong field elevation correction but that is with both systems so that cancels that out as a differance.

I never said that the Vigil wasn't a great product. The OP asked for an OPINION and I gave mine and the reasons for it. Nobody has to agree with me. Opinions vary that's why we have so many choices.

To the Op use all the information that you can get and choose the system you feel would be right for you.

I started when nobody except students jumped any kind of AAD. As we all got more information and "educated" in the use and advantages of them most of us have changed our minds on the subject. If there is enough factual evidence that the vigil has become the top choice when I am ready to buy again then that is what I would go with. For now I just haven't seen that evidence, so I'll stick with my cypres.

Cypres or Vigil lets all hope that if any of us ever need it to work ,it does. As far as I'm concearned that's all that really matters.

ATTACK LIFE ! IT'S GOING TO KILL YOU ANYWAY!!!!

[hackish 8]

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Fact is that there have been vigil fires caused by the unit being set to the wrong mode. How that happened, I don't know.

I caught a local jumper on a 170 with similar wingloading to me. He was still jumping his on student mode. I have tried and succeeded on the same canopy to exceed the student activation speed on mine (set to Pro obviously). Simple fact he didn't know. I don't think this is a shortcoming of the AAD design, just a jumper who needs to know more about his equipment.

You can design the best AAD in the world but if the jumper doesn't know how to use it then all bets are off.

-Michael

[erdnarob 1]

OK I will be clear. Cypres approach is that you as a skydiver you are not smart enough to: choose a mode on your AAD, to monitor the mode, to change the batteries...in other word Cypres maker is considering you as a sort of a child. You as a skydiver are like an airplane pilot and you have to first know your equipment and set it up accordingly. A C-182 airplane pilot has to do a magnetos check before each flight. What is the trouble to check the status of your AAD (ON and with the proper mode) when doing your pin check (if your AAD is installed under the yoke) or to have a look at your back pad if located there ???? It just takes the time of a glance say half of a second. Ask a Vigil owner to show you since seeing is believing. OTOH on a Vigil, Cypres and also on the Argus the difference of the firing altitudes between Expert/Pro and student mode is 200 feet. Now lets see what normally happens: you open your chute at 2000-3000 feet. Even a Vigil set up on STUDENT mode will make no big difference. A problem happened when a skydiver used a Vigil on a normal jump when the AAD was set up in Tandem mode(firing altitude is way higher). Where is the big problem here, skydiver or the AAD ??? Most of the accidents in skydiving (probably 80%+) come from human bad attitude or mistakes. One of the major mistake/bad attitude is not knowing your equipment and technique. You certainly don't want to have an AAD which switches on automatically when arriving at the DZ don't you. I guess you would rather like to keep a certain amount of control on what you are doing. You are doing an extreme activity and you are better to stay on alert mode. Monitoring your leg and chest strap adjustment, your release system system, handles and your AAD status before each single jump is part of staying in alert mode.

Learn from others mistakes, you will never live long enough to make them all.

[pilotdave 0]

Sorry, I just don't agree. The vigil has a nearly useless feature. That doesn't make it a better AAD and that doesn't make the cypres the AAD for children. It makes it a better AAD than a cypres for users that might want to change modes on a regular basis. Airtec will convert cypreses from one mode to another for free (if i remember correctly). In the very unusual event that someone wants to change modes of their AAD, it can be done.

I agree that skydivers should be able to handle checking their AAD, but didn't a very experienced jumper have it in the wrong mode and have it fire? If it can happen, it will happen... and it already has, even in the short lifespan of the vigil so far. Having a vigil in student mode inadvertently might be much worse due to the lower fallrate required to set it off. Under canopy, I mean. There is a reason why experienced jumpers shouldnt use student AADs.. something vigil users might be tempted to try.

Dave

[gearless_chris 1]

I was originally going to get a Vigil instead of a Cypress2, but the Vigil wasn't water resistant and the Vigil 2's weren't out yet, so Cypress won. Just in case someday I end up swooping ponds. I'm kind of glad because I would probably be one of the people that would end up with my AAD in student mode and it would definitely fire under canopy if it was. It is good to hear that if I end up at the level that I would need a speed Cypress I can get it changed. I don't see that happening but you never know.

"If it wasn't easy stupid people couldn't do it", Duane.

My momma said I could be anything I wanted when I grew up, so I became an a$$hole.

[ozzy13 0]

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I know this has surely been discussed somewhere else on this forum, but the search doesn't work, so I can't find it. Anyways, I was wondering what was the general concensus on cypres vs. vigil as an AAD...

I know cypreses cost a lot more and require more maintainence... but I'm more concerned with what works better in relation to mis-fires or not firing at all.

I have both. I have two rigs that were made 6 months apart. The first one has a cypres and the second one has a vigil.

To me I think its a no brainier. The vigil like you said is cheaper. It allows you to put in the mode you want and the maintenance or down time is less. Last but not least it lasts for 20 years compared to 12.
Again I think its a no brainier. You are getting a whole lot more for you money

Never give the gates up and always trust your rears!

[erdnarob 1]

When a Vigil is set up on a specific mode it shows it on the display window as long as the device is switched on. To change that mode you need to go thru a sequence of actions and the mode changing cannot occurr without a deliberate action. Just like the device cannot be switched off or on by chance.
One does not have to set up the chosen mode every jumping day. The chosen mode on a Vigil stays on as long (20 years if you want) as you want. All you have to do is to switch it on at the DZ and that's it. I don't see why a jumper will have the wrong mode if he knows a minimum about his rig. You don't use a ordinary rig to do a tandem and you don't use a tandem rig for doing FS. Students rigs stay generally for students. There is no mode change to be done since AAD's stay normally in the same rig for a specific type of jumps. I know that people using the wrong mode has happened but I know just one case so far. Then where is the problem.
OTOH when comes the time to sell your rig, you can sell your AAD separately and have more chance to sell it because of the three modes. Now a DZO has to manage his equipment (tandem, student and rental) and it's quite easier to do so when having the possibility to change a AAD from a rig to another rig within 10 minutes because the AAD have the 3 modes. If you are not sure of what I am saying ask to a DZO using Vigils... (and no scheduled maintenance which means you choose when you want it).
I invite people to be shown how a Vigil (or Argus) works.
Knowledge dispels fear.

Learn from others mistakes, you will never live long enough to make them all.