aphid 0 #1 January 5, 2014 My '93 Evo in my custom rigid gave me a problem last week; it would start and run for about 5 minutes, then inexplicably would shut down. All electrical power ceased. No headlight, gauge lights, no start function, you name it, nada. Let it sit for 5-10 minutes and it would come back to life and start and run again for a few minutes then shut down again. Replaced both the main breaker (2 post metal style) and the starter relay (black plastic 30amp, 4 spade). Took care of the problem. Yesterday a couple of us skydivers enjoyed a casual all-day bar-hop with multiple stops. At the very last stop, in attempting a start I got one click at the relay (or solenoid, not sure which), then nothing. Tried the start switch again, and not even one click. BUT, still had plenty of power to the headlights, Vibe-Rider, etc. The only way I could get another start "click" was to cycle the ignition (key) switch to off, then on. Same result though. One click, then absolutely nothing. I'm about to dive back in and start checking all the connections, terminals, etc. but I'd appreciate any ideas. Unless of course one of you guru's is hanging at Skydive Arizona right now, 'cause that's where the bike and me are this month.(ETA: 'cause there's a cold beverage in it for you if you stop by my motorcoach and supervise) BTW: load-tested the battery and it is in stellar condition. Oh, and none of the Harley shops will even look at my bike because it's a custom. Thanks John Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CSpenceFLY 1 #2 January 5, 2014 I don't have a clue but I'll sent this to someone who might. Edit: I didn't read all the way through. It sounds very much like a ground problem.My Road King has done this before and it has always been a loose or dirt ground at the battery terminal. I would start with a good wire brushing of the battery leads and terminals and then check the other side of the ground. It's possible you were actually dealing with multiple problems when you started out. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
piisfish 136 #3 January 5, 2014 Hi Aphid, is your bike yellow ? Quote Vibe-Rider reminds me something of easter boogie in Eloy around 8 years ago, inside the Bent Prop scissors beat paper, paper beat rock, rock beat wingsuit - KarlM Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
aphid 0 #4 January 5, 2014 piisfish Hi Aphid, is your bike yellow ? Quote Vibe-Rider reminds me something of easter boogie in Eloy around 8 years ago, inside the Bent Prop Guilty, your Honour. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
piisfish 136 #5 January 5, 2014 it was one of the most incredible thing I saw. Many thanks for that. scissors beat paper, paper beat rock, rock beat wingsuit - KarlM Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
roostnureye 2 #6 January 5, 2014 CSpenceFLYI don't have a clue but I'll sent this to someone who might. Edit: I didn't read all the way through. It sounds very much like a ground problem.My Road King has done this before and it has always been a loose or dirt ground at the battery terminal. I would start with a good wire brushing of the battery leads and terminals and then check the other side of the ground. It's possible you were actually dealing with multiple problems when you started out. There is also a ground to the frame aside from the battery. I would look there first.Flock University FWC / ZFlock B.A.S.E. 1580 Aussie BASE 121 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kawisixer01 0 #7 January 5, 2014 I'd be looking at the voltage regulator. I've seen a lot of voltage regulators go on bikes, mostly connections melting right off of them. Sounds to me like something warming up, expanding, and losing connection. Then cools back down and retacts back into connection. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CSpenceFLY 1 #8 January 6, 2014 roostnureye ***I don't have a clue but I'll sent this to someone who might. Edit: I didn't read all the way through. It sounds very much like a ground problem.My Road King has done this before and it has always been a loose or dirt ground at the battery terminal. I would start with a good wire brushing of the battery leads and terminals and then check the other side of the ground. It's possible you were actually dealing with multiple problems when you started out. There is also a ground to the frame aside from the battery. I would look there first. Yeah, that would be the other side of the ground I referred to. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
normiss 721 #9 January 6, 2014 This was my guess too. Good luck with the repair! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BIGUN 1,229 #10 January 6, 2014 kawisixer01I'd be looking at the voltage regulator. I've seen a lot of voltage regulators go on bikes, mostly connections melting right off of them. Sounds to me like something warming up, expanding, and losing connection. Then cools back down and retacts back into connection. Agreed. The one I sold last year was a '93 electra-king (I converted an electra-glide into a Road King), but I also re-wired the whole bike. I also stuck on a solenoid housing starter switch. http://www.jpcycles.com/product/3800353 Nobody has time to listen; because they're desperately chasing the need of being heard. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CSpenceFLY 1 #11 January 6, 2014 normiss This was my guess too. Good luck with the repair! I'm missing how the voltage regulator could cause the second half of his problem. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freethefly 6 #12 January 6, 2014 CSpenceFLY ***This was my guess too. Good luck with the repair! I'm missing how the voltage regulator could cause the second half of his problem. You are not missing anything as the voltage regulator has nothing to do with the system that starts the bike. The voltage regulator does as the name implies. It regulates/rectifies the AC voltage produced by the alternator. The AC voltage is rectified to DC. Now, there may be a problem with the regulator in that it is not sending current to ground and over charging the system but, this can only occur if the bike is running and the magnets are spinning. Also, I highly doubt that a bad regulator would affect the starter relay, starter switch or, main relay as these components are out of the loop. I would perform a few simple diagnostic tests such as: Continuity on the starter relay. There should be continuity. Starter current draw. Is there current present? If no, follow the wires to the next component. If current is present, does it exceed 150 amps? If so, replace the starter. I would also check all connections in the loop from the handle bar switch to the starter. Likewise, I would also test the switches themselves. I was factory trained through Harley-Davidson. I can do amazing wire jobsThe pics are of a 72 Sportster that came into the shop I was spinning a wrench at. The wires in the before pic were stuffed up under the seat. I completely rewired the bike, changed out the components and replaced the starter (the armature and commutator were so badly shorted that any hope of a bench job was out.) A friend of the owner of the bike wired it for him and the bike never started right or even run properly. The fool even wired the lights off of the coil with an inline switch. I am sure your problem is a simple one, even if it is a bad starter (one hour job to replace.) It is only a matter of following the wires."...And once you're gone, you can't come back When you're out of the blue and into the black." Neil Young Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
theonlyski 3 #13 January 6, 2014 freethefly The pics are of a 72 Sportster that came into the shop I was spinning a wrench at. The wires in the before pic were stuffed up under the seat. I completely rewired the bike, changed out the components and replaced the starter (the armature and commutator were so badly shorted that any hope of a bench job was out.) A friend of the owner of the bike wired it for him and the bike never started right or even run properly. The fool even wired the lights off of the coil with an inline switch. Good god, were there rats living in that nest? I just had to replace 3 relays in my truck for the electric fans I installed. They were providing the voltage but the contacts were so jacked up that they were passing practically no current."I may be a dirty pirate hooker...but I'm not about to go stand on the corner." iluvtofly DPH -7, TDS 578, Muff 5153, SCR 14890 I'm an asshole, and I approve this message Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dzswoop717 5 #14 January 6, 2014 I am no harley expert but I always start with the simpelest thing first. Try cleaning the battery cables and grounds first. then go through and make sure any plugs in the wiring harness are completely plugged and snapped togeather ( try to pull the plug apart, if it is clipped correctly it won't come apart). I had that problem once in a car, the little tab that kept the plug locked in place was broken off and the car acted just like what you explained. I found the problem when I started to trace the ignition system and I pulled on the plug and it just fell apart. Sometimes people don't get the plug completely snapped in place when they do maintenance and eventually it viabrates out. Once I have tried the simple stuff and it still doesn't work I take it to an expert. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
aphid 0 #15 January 6, 2014 Thanks everybody for the advice. It seems at this point the issue is at the solenoid. It's triggering but doesn't seem to be transferring the full voltage through to the starter. Some research suggests that over time on the early Evo's the internal contact would pit/corrode from internal arcing. Ultimately, I found a shop in town that does work on customs and they're going to upgrade both the solenoid and starter. And they are supplying the optional external solenoid over-ride/start button similar to the item suggested by Bigun. I'm considering having the bike re-wired completely as it's been on the road for 16 years with all the usual electrical decay found on rigids riding in all types of weather. Thanks again, folks. John Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites