CaretakerAl

I suggest it was not at the direction of the FBI, but the Project, and that is MORE than a reasonable deduction. It is a certainty, right Jerry??? They also discussed a "Tina" approach for Jo. They did NOT authorize her "T" bone accident, however. Jo is not totally off base on everything. Some things are too obvious for even her to misinterpret.

"Somebody out there knows what happened, and they are still alive." Yes, and you just blow me off as another nut case. You all suffer from the same blindness. I was there. First hand information. I know who was involved, eyeball to eyeball. We just have a failure to communicate on your part. You have mental blocks and believe one or more of the 1000's of wrong planted information or even FBI lies. Cap planned it, Mac facilitated it, and Duane did it. The FBI and the FAA protected and assisted, and I recorded it. Cap knows it. Mac knows it, the FBI knows it. You all don't count. You are not worthy. So be it. The end.

SURPRISE 377! I have pages of FBI lies that are intentional. I know the agents. I know the truth. I know that THEY know the truth. I watch them lie through their teeth time after time. There is NO QUESTION about it. I can make a long list of the agents who I have watched lie about facts we both know to be different. Face facts. The FBI is not a trustworthy organization. They have "higher purposes" which justify ANYTHING they feel like.

Wow! I never suspected you guys were still so pervasive and devious. Never expected this extent or degree of corruption and conspiracy! Never dreamed the United States of America could come to this. Hope you didn't run the Arizona thing, too. Hell, Mexico might be nice. At least you KNOW if they are going to shoot you. You people scare the living SHIT out of me. There, now you can please ban me too, QUADE. Speak softly to ALL of them. I'm convinced they ALL carry very big, ugly sticks and drink human blood Sunday through Saturday. Even the 'ladies.' Most unreal, unbelievable spectacle I have ever witnessed. The Third Reich reincarnated and reinforced. Where's Glen Beck? GLEN! Wait for me. I wanna get on YOUR wagon, can food, save gold and insult progressives..... Beam me up, Scottie, warp speed. (Play theme song)

"Crazy Knoss will take exception to that and claim I am in Kahoots with McCoy and Jerry and Himmelsbach and the FBI and CIA - that I am part of a cover-up!" Now that you brought it up....... An accomplice after the fact is as guilty as the instigators. Whether the FBI considers it a crime or not is not important to the Judicial system. This can be prosecuted in Oregon, Washington, California, Nevada, Minnesota, or Federally. Covering or excluding information of the crime that you know to be true, or evidence relevant to the case would qualify. Since we both know, and the World suspects you are covering and holding information, as I have record, YES, you ARE guilty, aren't you. It can not be denied and YOU are the problem here, not me. So, OK, I'll comply with your plea. You are a conspirator too. That make you happy? The picture the women referred to was not Richard McCoy, Jr., so there is no possibility they were related. Just another Jason half-literate boner. Had they related to the real pictures I might have even deleted those, instead of the trolled one. I got the message. Nice to talk with you again, Mac. Have a nice life. Sorry, Cap. Kept as quiet as I could about the other half. I'm not Gray. I'll be around. Fake it up, Jo. Do your job.

"you upset a child and that is wrong. This happened and you cannot deny it." You are totally incorrect. The person to whom I replied was a grown person, and made no references to family. The only child I bopped on the head was your little pain in the rear friend, Jason, who continually tries to make trouble with his intentionally incorrect and leading posts. There are no little kids on there screaming about their grampa! Just one pissed little kid on this forum trying to get even for my tickle ploy on him. He is simply a TROLL getting his jollies playing his dumb game. He is a professional performer performing here because he can't get a gig. Look at his unimpressive list of lost leaders. He's begging for attention and you just suck it up. He is almost totally your fault. His purpose is to disrupt and flame other posters. Draw attention and take over the forum, like I have done. Except I had some directives with real intention. Now I know YOUR directive. Mac explained it. He said to leave you alone and let you handle it like you were supposed to. You are not doing a good job because you are leaving tells. I've learned everything I care to here. Thank those of you who were helpful. I'm taking a leave of absence so you can play with snookums there. See ya later.

"A 100 foot circle of uncertainty in pin pointing your position is HIGHLY unlikely, however flying along a VOR it's reasonable to assume a degree of accuracy required to get you from Point A to Point B." So, if you were flying a direct course on one heading for a signal from a known point, like a lighted pump station heading for that first signal, and were looking for a second known close signal from, say 90° west, you could hit within how far? 1000 feet? Less? 100 feet? With two VOR's.

"Just DO your thing - lies to cover up lies and you have buried yourself so deep you don't even know what the truth is anymore." I didn't send any pictures to anybody. I answered a couple posts from undescribed posters on a forum with truthful answers. I stand by what I said. Mac would never abandon any grandchildren. Jason is a TROLL and he can get to you. I know exactly what he is and get a tickle down my leg and into my sock from him. He is totally predicable. Went to Facebook to make his fame, but nobody came. No feed for the troll. So now he's back. Because you feed him. The more you feed him, the bolder he gets. He's your responsibility, you fed him. Ha-ha-ha. Tit for TAT.

Figures.

"But, back in 71, an NDB receiver, including the bearing display, would have been as big as a car battery. Plus it would need an antenna outside the plane." What did the Cooper plane have for radio capabilities? If you had known coordinates, could you fly to a spot in a blacked-out flight deck? This is what I understood they could do within a reasonable distance for jumping, in combination with lights from a very bright light station.

"This is actually quite funny. This response is exactly the type of response Jo gives when people get angry about something - always "reading" something else into it (e.g. some of her posts to Georger). Seeing as this thread is currently going nowhere in terms of Cooper, just Jo and Knoss fighting over whose version of Duane-was-Cooper is correct, we may as well pass around the popcorn...?" Thank you. I appreciate that very much. I try not to put you guys to sleep, keep you entertained and educate everyone at the same time. You are watching the clean-up 'crew' in action, and Ma's got the broom out after me. Mac. Mac. Mac. Mac. Mac. Mac............. Awk....Mac-Mac Aflac!

"Georger - Thank you for establishing that Jerry is ok. I didn't always agree with him, but I valued his input." Yes, me too. He may know who's obit I read, pictures and all. He is a very good friend of Rataczak's also. Should be a real interesting forum when we get to it. I'll see if I still have the copies of what I sent him, sure I do. See if he wants to re-read those messages on here. I'd be happy to post them. (No threat intended, just trying to be informative) Giving time to think over a good response...... Fair enough, no surprises.

"Finding out if there was actually a relationship between McCoy and Jerry Thomas doesn't seem out of order since Knoss is NOW shadowing McCoy's children." PROVE IT!! This goes way over the line here!! I demand an apology and a retraction on this one! Repeated lies and no foundation. Show your proof or get off the forum. You are accusing me of a crime here, and I will get real serious about this. Lier, lier, pants on fire is one thing, but this is criminal, Jo. You best back up real quick here! You don't have the time to cover this one. Cough it up, immediately, or I call for assistance.

"Sending this family pictures of a man you claim to be McCoy is going over the line." Never happened. Who told you this garbage? I want to confront who is feeding these lies. Karen? Not true. Way beyond me, that's downright cruel! Never! "When you contact children who where NOT even born in 1971 - telling them their grandfather did not die and that he was still alive..." Never happened. More garbage, Jo. Mention McCoy and you go off rail. Always! Now in red?? What is going on? It is like a shocker cushion in your chair. If I push the button, you light up! I smell a rat. Mac. Mac. Mac. Mac. Mac. Mac. Now watch yourself........

"What do you mean by "radio vectoring"? Can you be more specific?" I did fly in a Mooney owned by a NW pilot friend of Rataczack's. He showed me how it works and we came down right on top of the Devil's Lake, ND, airport tower, dead nuts from fully overcast fog. Don't ask me to set the radios, but ask me how accurate it is? 100 feet. Zones in on any broadcast and you can triangulate any known location given two known signals, two radios. Especially if you had gone out and recorded the desired location in the bright clear sunshiny daytime before hand. That is how it works. Wouldn't any pilot know how to do that? Think so.

"so why is Knoss confronting family that HAD absolutely nothing to do with what their father or grandfather did?" Total lies again, Jo. I never even TRIED to talk to any relatives except a related business client, and that was coincidental not intentional. Total falsehoods on your part. Were do you get this crop? And I contacted all the parties! Hoey! There are a lot of people I never contacted. You are the harrasser here, like Jason says. You called Karen, I NEVER have. I suspect an alterior motive. What is it? Were you threatened too? Your reactions are over the top. WAY over the top. Methinks thee protesteth too much. What's up, Doc? What's the game play here? Call the FBI? Hell, I'll go with you! No problemo. You are frantically trying to cover up all the facts about McCoy, then you call Karen????? Everything is the opposite of what it seems. The whole project works that way. THAT is the key to Project Norjak. Right? "Once there was one, now there are three, find my wife and you will find me." Hi Mac!! Enter in, guy! You said to go ahead and do it, but you didn't think I would be able to, did you? Surprise!! Tit for TAT!

"Unfortunately, Jerry passed away. You knew that." I read an obit. If it wasn't him, which longtime Cooper sleuth who roamed the woods was it?

Please pursue this connection, review my posts and accept my apologies for taking over your forum, but this is where I can get off and let you ride your own rollacoaster. Seems my task would be accomplished in part, if your eyes are finally opened. I was wondering how long it would take to get through that obstanate, stubborn skull. Looks like we might have made it, huh? Best wishes. The rest of you might want to copy some of your rediculous posts and frame them on your wall to remind yourselves to be more considerate of the other point of view. You and the guy (gal) in the mirror ain't the end-all in fact determination.

[BLUE]JERRY KNEW MC COY - NOW THIS OPENS A WHOLE CAN OF WORMS![/BLUE] I know this to be true. Very true. I know the Jerry Thomas connection and who the primary connections were at the other end. You are speaking of the ultimate authorities, the king-pin, the trainer himself (not Thomas, but his co-op). Ain't no can of worms. It was THE source. Best friends with McCoy, whole families, buddies to the death! Been there, done that. I doubt that we would have gotten the truth, though. That would confirm everything I've said about McCoy and THEN some! You want facts, that is where the truth AND the fiction lies (lays?). To verify, his email address was something like, [email protected] Right? That aught to be all the proof you need. Unfortunately, Jerry passed away. You knew that. The trainer does not use a computer.

"What possible purpose could a "fake" hijacking serve that would need to remain classified this late in the game?" Been there, done that 'til I'm blue in the face. The FBI used the name, "Project Norjack," referring to this Cooper incident in the winter of 1968 and we are still using it today. Does that give you any hints as to who organized what?? I believe Cap initiated it with the FAA Task Force, McCoy consulted with the FBI, based on who knew who, where the power was, and what the chain of command was at the time. It was a pilot's power play, orchestrated by pilots, for pilots, using an expendable guinea pig on an experimental rear stairs jump. The purpose was to provide a classroom example of the total lack of airline safety, the exposure to subversive takeover, and the obvious defenselessness of the people aboard a flying bomb. Way ahead of the curve and an argument that had become a squeeze play against the Airline Companies. Northwest was onboard with the changes, the rest baulked. Enter Project Norjack. I was accused of threatening my draftboard and was subjected to hypnotism by the Minnesota Commander. The doctor that induced me was part of the "Blue Bird" program. I was hypnotized and interrogated about what I had done. I was found guilty and sentenced to 4 years at Leavenworth. The Commander suspended that sentence provided I assist Sgt. Richard Floyd McCoy, Jr. (who was right there during my trial) in the FBI/FAA Project Norjack. I signed papers agreeing to that participation. They didn't set up shop just for me. There must have been a number of others that got this treatment, including Duane Weber. The Legal System looks on this project as a crime. The Executive branch looked on it as a legal necessity, and the public looks on it as an icon hero worship. The law enforcement groups, the old FBI, did the Hoover thing, then buried it. The new FBI can't prove anything without evidence or perhaps just goes along to protect an 'approved' project from a technical injustice. The whole thing has become a stalemate, and in that, a lucrative game to play, almost tongue-in-cheek. It makes me sick. The reason it keeps dragging on, in my opinion, is it's popularity, players using the incident's popularity for profit, and determination on both sides of the stalemate to solve or bury the case. It feeds itself. Just keeps getting bigger all the time. It is a Classified National Security Secret. What a damned joke! It is time to pardon and declassify.

"Hey Bob, care to explain the photo? Who is it?" My hero. "To Hell and Back." Another Richard McCoy. AUDY MURPHY, a look-alike with admirable character. Typical Jason response. So predicable. Perfect fodder for the 'crew'.

"A very simple question that other jumpers have asked and you have failed to address." As stated, I am not the trainer. You will have to ask the trainer as he did not train me, he trained Duane Weber. I don't know a harness from a saddle, so there is no way I could be expected to answer your loaded question. You must know before asking it that I am not the expert with that information. So you ask it to discredit me. You only display your bias. You offer an explanation. You are the expert here, show some of that vast knowledge. I KNOW what was said. You know the various equipment, but we are not sure you are talking about what was used. He said "You COULD use it on the back, but you'd have to reach..." Now, what might that refer too, Georger? Please don't flame any more, if that is what this is. It is not constructive.

"You cannot be absolute about anything that Duane / Dan / McCoy / Christiansen / Mickey Mouse, et al did or didn't do that night if you were not there to witness it at the time of the occurrence. And as I think you've also argued yourself --- some might say there are no absolutes when it comes to eyewitness anything." Absolute about exact action and words the night of the incident, no, you are right. As a documentation of the exercise as reported by McCoy, yes, it is as I state. Did Duane have sour or seven-up? Couldn't be absolute, but I would rely on Jo's speculation for an opinion. Since it is immaterial to the bottom line. Does not matter where he landed or how the money got to Tena Bar or how far the engineers moved or buried the money. The basic fact is that Duane Weber was trained specifically for every minor detail of this hyjacking, he carried it out precisely according to his instructions, and lost the damned money. Jo Weber's story will varify the portion she was exposed to. I'll tell what I was exposed to. Take it or not, it all boils down to the same common denominator. Nobody can prove a damned thing. Nobody will listen if you could. It is mute. So, I am yelling it at the top of my lungs. Doesn't matter. 'I absolutely know' is more positive than 'I think" and I am a whole bunch more certain than, "You bet your *&@#% arse!" And I apologize for that.

"You state that Duane absolutely jumped with the chute marked with an X. Other comments you have made here and on Facebook about actual events that occurred on Nov 24 1971 are strong, declarative, absolute statements,..." Yes, I know. Bluebird was involved. Training was steady and frequent, and extremely detailed. His directions were specific, precise and certain. The inconsequential evidence on the plane is in exact parallel to the training. The chute with the X was packed by his trainer who Duane had total confidence in. Every detail reported is consistent with the instruction. The debriefing reported that everything went as planned with a couple exceptions. This was a mock hyjacking carried out to the letter of the book of regulations from bomb description on. Duane would never have used a different chute. That one was special, and sewn so he could prove nobody fouled it. The chute could have already been fitted to the harness in the configuration the trainer specified. That would be logical, but logic is not in evidence. Any prosecutorial evidence in this case is totally contaminated by agents. You can not depend on any pertanent evidence claims. I have no doubts about what the Project Norjak team did, and you will concur when he releases his book postmortum and you realize the magnatude. This all worked because it was done according to a well worked out plan and control from the would-be 'gotcha boys.' They made films to teach FBI students. This was a precision training exercise, a political leverage for the FAA. I worked for the FAA guy as well. All pilots except Duane and me as far as I know. Jumpers were involved here. U12? Hope that helps some.

"With all due respect if you know so little about jumping, the hardware or how to mount this on that then you don't know enough to verify if the trainer was one of the best riggers in the business or just full of shit." If you can't fathom who the trainer was by now you probably never will. If you knew, you wouldn't be so quick with the smart answers. I think your comments are not constructive at all and only attempt to pester. I understand. You do not. That's fine. He knows and watches. You don't get the rigging jobs he had without being Number One.