USPA

Sorry... couldn't resist. Based on: http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=383591#383591 http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=410779#410779 The trouble with skydiving; If you stink at it and continue to jump, you'll die. If you're good at it and continue to jump, you'll see a lot of friends die...

What do you think of SBS6 (Dutch cheapo disaster lett spread out on tv-tv) saying: "Look here skydivers are preparing themselves for a team skydive, do get every1 out of the plane at the same moment, which is the hardest thing in skydiving there is, the do a count. (now the commentator translates for all the dutch dumbasses Ready-set-go, but says : Klaar-shit-gaan (which translates back-into "ready-shit-go" (as you may have guessed))) I fell of my chair at this time! The trouble with skydiving; If you stink at it and continue to jump, you'll die. If you're good at it and continue to jump, you'll see a lot of friends die...

You're tottally right... I updated the topic.... The trouble with skydiving; If you stink at it and continue to jump, you'll die. If you're good at it and continue to jump, you'll see a lot of friends die...

Ever noticed that every US (goverment) speach/comment has alot of "May god helps us" "In god we trust" "may our prayers" jadiejadiejadie bla bla bla god this god that in it? Islam fundamentalists Have alah this and alah that in it... I'm having more an more trouble separting the too... it seams just a simple christian fundamentalist against islamic fundamentalist war again... And of course oil.... US wants new, France and Russia have an interesting contract with this government. Both are wrong... (strange only a few people see there's (theoratically a 3th option (both wrong))... Ah wel... just another iraq thread.... The trouble with skydiving; If you stink at it and continue to jump, you'll die. If you're good at it and continue to jump, you'll see a lot of friends die...

When I was a young cable slave, I read the osmosis theory at rec.skydiving, which made me believe it for at least 6 months..... The trouble with skydiving; If you stink at it and continue to jump, you'll die. If you're good at it and continue to jump, you'll see a lot of friends die...

I'm not an experience camerajumper (have between 75-100 camerajumps (gues)). I have an RSL on my rig, but not connected, only reason is the camerajumps. On my normal jumps I'm always doubting, but I'm afraid I forget to unhook it when I do camerajumps and Mr Murphy is watching.... The trouble with skydiving; If you stink at it and continue to jump, you'll die. If you're good at it and continue to jump, you'll see a lot of friends die...

That would make no sense... The USPA is alligning it's licenses with the FAI, just as we (The Netherlands) have done 2 years back. As far as I can see, after the change the US license would mean the same as the Dutch license. Our operation somewhat looked the same, our previous "D" is now also a "C". Also everyone who had a "D" license and didn't have the full reguirements for a new "D", got an "C" license. Our instructors still require a new "D". (our instructors are also ST&A) The trouble with skydiving; If you stink at it and continue to jump, you'll die. If you're good at it and continue to jump, you'll see a lot of friends die...

I was thinking of the Sigma tandem setup, and it pretty obvious... feel like an idiot now... how could I mis it! Oh, btw, could you explain a little further why it's on the left side at "your" rig? The trouble with skydiving; If you stink at it and continue to jump, you'll die. If you're good at it and continue to jump, you'll see a lot of friends die...

Hi Bill, I was wondering: I currently jump without a RSL attached, because I do alot of camerajumps. I'm continues doubting if I wan't to attach the RSL for my non-camerajumps. The reason I chose not to do that is because I'm afraid to unhook it when I do camerajumps. Although I'm not in the market for at least 2 years for a new rig, how would you advice for a situation where you have the skyhook option installed, but not hooked up? (except that it can be spending money better used on jumps... ) The trouble with skydiving; If you stink at it and continue to jump, you'll die. If you're good at it and continue to jump, you'll see a lot of friends die...

cool... another one of those small things that are just bit better/ thought out on the vector... Well Bill, you just made me again more conviced I should have gotten a vector micron last year... (which was excatly predicted by RW's contactperson ) Ok... enough sucking up for now.... The trouble with skydiving; If you stink at it and continue to jump, you'll die. If you're good at it and continue to jump, you'll see a lot of friends die...

What do you mean? On Vector the RSL is standard right. I don't see a problem with a collins attached on a RSL on the left or the right side. The trouble with skydiving; If you stink at it and continue to jump, you'll die. If you're good at it and continue to jump, you'll see a lot of friends die...

True, but you now agree with me, that is was based on "what should be reasonable" instead of the exact text of the BVR! (which again is logical, cause the BVR isn't a law) The trouble with skydiving; If you stink at it and continue to jump, you'll die. If you're good at it and continue to jump, you'll see a lot of friends die...

Well, cause I was wondering about the length of your closing loop, I must confess I'm not sure about my own, but I have see quite some rigs with the reserve open, main still closed. (pull-out, learn to pack damn-it!) where the pin still had alot of tension on it (enough to need a tuck to open the container). The trouble with skydiving; If you stink at it and continue to jump, you'll die. If you're good at it and continue to jump, you'll see a lot of friends die...

Are you a lazy packer? (no flame intended) The trouble with skydiving; If you stink at it and continue to jump, you'll die. If you're good at it and continue to jump, you'll see a lot of friends die...

Don't start "can't" it's "won't" or "When I screw up" I do most jumps with AAD btw, and all my camerajumps with AAD. The latter because I see way more situations with a camerajump in which I can screw up. (I don't expect too, but I see opportunities... ) The trouble with skydiving; If you stink at it and continue to jump, you'll die. If you're good at it and continue to jump, you'll see a lot of friends die...

FYI Let you law-student friend look up the verdict on 'the parents of a drowned student' vs 'The DZ in the far south west of the Netherlands'. The BSR's were quoted in that one - especially the fact that in the eyes of the court they were breached. I forgot to go into this, but I noticed you keep getting back on legal complications. I have the verdict in front of me and just read it again. (did it before, but wanted to be sure). I read the verdict as the BVR being a advice, it then uses the BVR as a guideline. Even more specific to this case: It also says the student couldn't be held acountable for breaking the rules because she was still in training. These new rules wont be broken by any1 on student status. The ruling therefore implies that when one is capable to know the rules (you have to learn rules for you A license!). The jumper him or herself in accountable. BTW I just looked at your profile... ROFLMAO.... licensing organisation : RLD.... Man you don't like the KNVvL at all do you! On a more serieus note... I saw you jumped a PISA canopy , because I wouldn't want to lose such a colourfull person in the Netherlands (critism keeps every1 on their toes ), did you check the slider stops? The trouble with skydiving; If you stink at it and continue to jump, you'll die. If you're good at it and continue to jump, you'll see a lot of friends die...

Ahh.. I'm probably and old fashioned netcitizen.... Still use netiquette, doing searches and stuff... There was a TROL alert going off at my pc.... The trouble with skydiving; If you stink at it and continue to jump, you'll die. If you're good at it and continue to jump, you'll see a lot of friends die...

And I would like to know if to use a pillow or normal silver for my reserve. And what about pull-out versus throw-out? uhm... oyeah... isn't it an Idea to make an AAD mandatory? You get the point.... The trouble with skydiving; If you stink at it and continue to jump, you'll die. If you're good at it and continue to jump, you'll see a lot of friends die...

No this isn't a misprint. The idea is that you want to prevent certain canopies to be used for the first jumps, which can be used after people have made the first 10 jumps. But sadly to say, DZ politics have played a major role here..... The trouble with skydiving; If you stink at it and continue to jump, you'll die. If you're good at it and continue to jump, you'll see a lot of friends die...

Sigh... I see a "Liemberg" discussion comming... Remember the old english wishdom? What is, isn't always what ought to be. It works the other way around too. (that goes for alot of suggestions/insights discussed here, if people were responsible, we wouldn't have the problem in the first place) You're missing the point. You shouldn't "ban" someone from your DZ, cause that's only transferring the problem to a DZ that isn't familiar with this "problem" (in the case the person=the problem) (In your words from an old rec.skydiving discussion: It doesn't have the "crater looking for an impact side" sticker on it). I personally find the Dutch system more flexible and gives a more guided downsizing then the swedish system, but then thats only my opinion (and to quote you again "It's mine alone, unless you share it, then it's yours also" ) those rules will be breached massively Now you lost me? First you say everyone at your DZ already has a canopy which fits this system, secondly you spend 2 alinea's telling me you have no problem staying in control? The trouble with skydiving; If you stink at it and continue to jump, you'll die. If you're good at it and continue to jump, you'll see a lot of friends die...

What someone wants to do, never dictates how I aproach safety in my book! Ok, your reply about dz rules is exactly our problem. First, I know of people who downsize to fast on small DZ's. (It may even be harder to stop them on an small DZ/club, because no1 is really in charge (PCA as an exexption off course)) Secondly... gues where are those people who are sent away at smaller DZ's are going too? And a new DZ hasn't got a clue about that persons past and skills... To be tottally honest, I think the rules (with exceptions of the "outcasts" described above) are most usefull on the smaller DZ, because now an instructor can hide behind the rules, without being afraid of "impopularity". But then again, I'm biased off course, and because I have to do my I-exams this year I'd best shut up now.... PS I didn't reply through ad edit, I just pushed the wrong button and continued writing the original... The trouble with skydiving; If you stink at it and continue to jump, you'll die. If you're good at it and continue to jump, you'll see a lot of friends die...

Whahahahahaha... Ok, I'll bite... Bottom flat???? Look again! The trouble with skydiving; If you stink at it and continue to jump, you'll die. If you're good at it and continue to jump, you'll see a lot of friends die...

Uhm, I might disagree with you with that... (along with others of the instruction group of Teuge) On another note... I've been talking to a law student about this, and she said the following. For the court of law it doesn't matter if it's regulations or not. The court only sees the BVR (BSR) as an advice (and not a law), therefor making it a guideline has technical the same status as making it regulation. (in the eye's of the court). Also, you may have been responisble in this matter, we have to look at the whole on the Netherlands. And general speaking (it's not only a Dutch problem I think) people are being flown by their canopies, instead of the other way around. I'm surprised by this discussion in total, cause almost no1 goes into that. People are not only dying of lowturns, also landingfatalities as a whole, landinginjuries, reserve which lead to fatalities and reserve's in general, all of them have a high percentage which can be atributed to fast/responisve canopies. Which doesn't make the canopies bad, but it has to be flown/packed by someone who knows what he is doing or at least has the experience the handle the shit he or she is facing. Also, cummon you and I both know that making it a guideline in The Netherlands mean shit. Everyone is an exception, especially on the big DZ's (Texel and Teuge) which are also a haven for people that are being "kicked off" their "home DZ". The trouble with skydiving; If you stink at it and continue to jump, you'll die. If you're good at it and continue to jump, you'll see a lot of friends die...

Comming Soon! www.waroniraq.com The trouble with skydiving; If you stink at it and continue to jump, you'll die. If you're good at it and continue to jump, you'll see a lot of friends die...

Ok, I'm gonna claim this one... (sorry) Just wanted to note that I printed the list here and translated it..... But you should thank the EC/TC comitee of the KNVvL in the Netherlands... their subcomitee made up the "dutch-bullseye" and according list...