Gary73

Dave, That looks like a 6" bubble. Thanks for the info! "Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence." - Carl Sagan

I want to replace the pilot-side window on my 182 and would appreciate hearing from any pilots out there who have experience with bubble windows on 182s, 206s, etc. Are they worth the money? If so, what depth do you recommend? (The company I found, GLAP, makes 2", 4", and 6" bubbles.) Also, are there any problems I should be aware of? Thanks! "Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence." - Carl Sagan

When an AAD is sitting at the DZ, it checks altitude about once a second. Once it detects a change, it assumes that it's in a jump plane and starts checking altitude about thirty times a second. That significantly increases battery drain. If a rig is going to stay at the DZ at the end of the day, leave it on. If it's going to leave the DZ, turn it off first, especially if there are any elevation changes between the DZ and home. Hadn't heard that "push the button frequently" approach for a CYPRES that won't turn off. I'll give that a try next time. Thanks! "Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence." - Carl Sagan

Unfortunately you're right: Most container manufacturers keep the reserve container sized in proportion to the main container, which forces jumpers who want a small main to have a small reserve. I see a fair number of jumpers using reserves which are loaded well beyond the manufacturer's recommended maximum weight. Not a good idea for many reasons. The only container manufacturer that I know of which sizes the main and reserve containers pretty much independently is UPT (Vector and Micron). Are there others? The other approach is to use a low-bulk reserve like the Optimum or Speed 2000. In some cases both approaches may be necessary to get a combination that makes for an exciting main and a truly safe reserve. "Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence." - Carl Sagan

Cheesybake! Cheesybake! Any requests to go with Cheesybake! ?? More Cheesybake! "Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence." - Carl Sagan

Cheesybake! Cheesybake! "Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence." - Carl Sagan

It's not widely known, but the farce "Airplane!" was based on a serious movie called "Zero Hour", which TCM has scheduled for August 22 at 2:30 PM. Surely you don't want to miss it! "Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence." - Carl Sagan

The recession isn't over by any means, but the recovery has definitely begun. The stock market is up 25% since it hit bottom, housing starts are up, new-car sales are up, etc., so there's good reason to be optimistic. As for the long-term effects, that's going to be a problem. Ever since the 1930s, Congress has never seen a tax dollar that it didn't want to spend - twice! Government spending is so far out of control that it's bound to cause a major trauma eventually. The only question is when. "Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence." - Carl Sagan

Another load of crap propagated by Fox "News": http://www.snopes.com/computer/internet/clunkers.asp "Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence." - Carl Sagan

Hoax, intentionally propagated by our friends at Fox News: http://www.snopes.com/computer/internet/clunkers.asp "Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence." - Carl Sagan

No assumption, just fact, that the vast majority of the members of every religion are born into that religion. They are raised from birth in an environment which treats that religion as being so obviously true that it isn't even questionable. When bad guys do that to prisoners it's called brainwashing and considered to be a crime, but when parents and societies do it to defenseless children it's okay. Go figure. Divinely appointed? That's funny! Interesting that you assume that people only "stray" from the Church for selfish, decadent reasons. For me it was an intellectual journey, looking at many different philosophies before the evidence finally required that I reject the existence of the supernatural in all its forms. When I finally accepted that I was genuinely surprised at the way that everything finally made sense. But yes, different people do find comfort in different things, but comfort does not imply correctness. I know (too) many people who take comfort in deeply racist beliefs because it makes them feel better about their own pathetic selves. Personally I'd rather know the truth, no matter how uncomfortable it makes me feel. Interesting the way you phrased that: as if the Earth IS the Universe, instead of being a tiny speck that is only significant to its occupants. At any event, you are demonstrating a truly profound level of ignorance of physics, geology, chemistry, astronomy, biology, and a few other subjects. ALL the hard evidence points toward the Universe being billions of years old, and denying the facts in order to keep believing in a myth invented by illlterate peasants is just sad. But hey, if that's what floats your ark, go for it. You can even raise your children that way and preach your beliefs to others, Just don't try to turn your beliefs into laws that everyone else must follow and we can co-exist just fine. "Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence." - Carl Sagan

And, to what purpose? To open your understanding, or to poke someone with a stick, because you already consider them a fool? Unlike some of the "Christians" who have posted on this thread, I don't consider Literalists to be either stupid or insane, just mistaken. That's quite understandable, since most "educational institutions" and all churches devote themselves to trying to teach us what to think instead of how to think. If I can get a few people to think objectively about the things they were told to believe before they were old enough to realize that they had a choice in the matter, then that would be worth the effort. If not, maybe it'll get me closer to understanding why people hold onto beliefs even when they're shown that they can't possibly be true. "Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence." - Carl Sagan

All very interesting, folks (well, a little bit interesting, anyway), but by way of heading back toward the original question: I spoke with a friend yesterday who happens to be a Fundamentalist preacher. I asked him what is the proper term for a person who believes that the Bible should be taken literally from cover to cover. Without hesitation, he answered "Christian.". So, bad news for all you folks who consider parts of the Bible to be allegory or poetry or something: apparently you're not Christians after all. Sorry. "Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence." - Carl Sagan

Royd - My purpose was to ask Literalists to think about the question and get their answers. Still waiting. "Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence." - Carl Sagan

Sea Kittens - mmmm, taste great with ketchup! "Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence." - Carl Sagan

Rstanley0312 - You might want to re-read your last post. You say that you don't think that people who disagree with you are insane, then you come right out and admit that you have done exactly that. (Not very Christian of you, BTW.) WRT my use of the term Fundamentalist, I may have been incorrect there. Apparently there are people who refer to themselves as such who don't believe in an absolutely literal interpretation of the Bible. I offerred the term Literalist, but that seems unacceptable also. By what label should we refer to such people? Oh, I mentioned the 1 + 1 = 2 example for a reason: Most folks would see the "truth" to that statement and not even imagine that there could be any room for discussion, but mathematicians will occasionally admit that "truth" in their field is really just what the preponderance of mathematicians agree it is, and that there is no absolute way of determining it. There may be a lesson there for the rest of us. "Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence." - Carl Sagan

Hey Max! Yes, after thinking about this and related subjects for nearly fifty years, I have come to a number of conclusions. One is that the Bible should not be taken literally from cover to cover. Therefore, I would like to understand the thinking of those who do, and, if possible, get a few of them to think beyond what they've been taught to believe. This story seemed like a good place to start, since it seems to be clear that it can't possibly be literally true. WRT your interpretation, yes, that's how most Christians and Jews see it. WRT the Nazis (it's an Internet discussion, so they had to be mentioned eventually, right?), as I understand it, they believed in God, (Gods?), but they interpreted things differently than most Christians do, and their interpretation allowed them to do things that most of us consider to be abominable. On the other hand, no one should ever forget that with their church's blessing, Christians have engaged in slavery, genocide, torture, kidnapping, murder, and so on throughout history. And once again, they believed that they were doing Right by God every bit as much as you and I believe that they were not. So how do we know what constitutes right action? That's a discussion for another thread. "Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence." - Carl Sagan

Rstanley0312 - I didn't mean to imply that most Christians use a dartboard to choose which parts they take literally, just that they do make a choice. You seem to believe that your choices were made based on scholarly study; either yours or that of people you trust. You seem to believe that the issues are so clear that you didn't even really make a choice; that it's as plain as 1 + 1 = 2*. That's fine, but the fact remains that there are Christians around the world who disagree with your conclusions, including some who sincerely believe that the entire Bible (KJV, usually) should be taken literally, and they believe in their interpretation every bit as much as you do. Again, those are the people I'd like to hear from. BTW, I think that I do get what you're saying: that anyone who disagrees with you is insane or an idiot, maybe both. (Your words, not mine!) * Again getting off topic, but mathematicians don't find 1 + 1 = 2 to be all that obvious. It apparently takes 150 pages of proofs to define the number 1, then another 100 to define arithmatic. "Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence." - Carl Sagan

Quade - Not to get too far off topic, but I had a friend years ago who honestly believed that the State of Georgia sends gravel trucks out to drop rocks onto the road so they'd be kicked up and break headlights so that the State could collect sales tax on the replacements. He also believed that Rock music was a communist plot to destroy the minds of our young people. Guess how many guns that guy owned! "Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence." - Carl Sagan

Rstanley0312 - Like most Christians, you seem to want to choose which portions of the Bible to take literally and which ones to interpret in other ways. That's fine with me, especially since you basically seem to be agreeing with me that the Tower of Babel story can't be literally true. My original question was addressed to the hard-core Fundamentalists (Would "Literalists" be a better term?) who really do believe that every passage in the Bible must be taken as literally true. We haven't heard from any of them yet. Any takers? "Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence." - Carl Sagan

RonD1120 - So God wants us to ignore our ability to understand the Universe and spend all our time praising him? That's pretty depressing for both sides of the relationship. Kind of like an Instructor keeping a student on static line forever, no matter how well he does, just so the instructor can get paid to jump. Sorry, I can't buy that one. Any God who loves us would want us to reach our full potential, just like a skydiving Instructor, a parent, or even a pet owner. "Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence." - Carl Sagan

Where does it say anything about it being a waste? "...and now nothing will be restrained from them..." makes it pretty clear that He believed that they'd make it. The King James Version was written by the leading Biblical scholars of the time, based on their translations of Greek, Aramaic, Hebrew, etc. documents. But if you have an original Greek source, that would be interesting to see. "Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence." - Carl Sagan

That doesn't make any sense. 11:6 states clearly that God thought the tower was doable. "Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence." - Carl Sagan

Specifically those who believe that the Bible is the literal word of God, true in every detail. How do you explain the story of the tower of Babel from Genesis? 11:3 And they said one to another, Go to, let us make brick, and burn them thoroughly. And they had brick for stone, and slime (tar) had they for mortar. 11:4 And they said, Go to, let us build us a city and a tower, whose top may reach unto heaven; and let us make us a name, lest we be scattered abroad upon the face of the whole earth. 11:5 And the LORD came down to see the city and the tower, which the children of men builded. 11:6 And the LORD said, Behold, the people is one, and they have all one language; and this they begin to do: and now nothing will be restrained from them, which they have imagined to do. In other words, this passage states that God himself believed that it was possible for people to build a tower high enough to allow them to physically enter heaven, which would therefore have to be a physical place in the sky, and no more than about 500 feet up, since that's about the highest that it's possible to build a tower using bricks and tar. We now know beyond any possible doubt that if Heaven exists at all, it most definitely is not a physical place that's 500 feet above the ground. Any God worthy of the name would also know this, of course, but Bronze Age peasants wouldn't have, so it seems pretty clear that this story was invented by peasants, not related by any type of God. And if there's even a single story in the Bible that's not the literal word of God, then the entire document is open to question, right? So my question to Fundamentalists is: How do you explain all of this? "Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence." - Carl Sagan