Toggle grip for rear riser input

[chachi 0]

you are missing my point. i was not talking about myself personally. i was saying we tend to shy away from encouraging people to explore their canopies in general. in fact, you seem to think that rear rise flight is only for someone "performing an aggressive diving manuever from 700 ft + and landing on rears."

that is what i meant. i encourage canopy pilots to explore all flight, especially after watching guys with low jump number come flying in on rears, transfering to toggle and making amazing landings on stuff like triathalon 170, heatwave 150, etc....

my post has no attitude, it is just the realities of things i have seen. although you may be right and most guys out there are amazing and love to pass the knowledge, a lot push people away from rear saying it is only for "expert canopy pilots" - i disagree.

[chachi 0]

i believe you forgot to include the part of my post that was the most important.

[frost 1]

The traditions of rec.skydiving live on...

SoFPiDaRF - School of Fast Progress in Downsizing and Radical Flying. Because nobody knows your skills better than you.

[Spizzzarko 0]

Do not...

[frost 1]

Do too

SoFPiDaRF - School of Fast Progress in Downsizing and Radical Flying. Because nobody knows your skills better than you.

[Spizzzarko 0]

Ahhh helll you just don't know... Rec. does not continue here.

[Cacophony 0]

Quote

that is what i meant. i encourage canopy pilots to explore all flight, especially after watching guys with low jump number come flying in on rears, transfering to toggle and making amazing landings on stuff like triathalon 170, heatwave 150, etc..

The benefit of rears on a lightly loaded large canopy to someone who is just coming straight in is worthless. All its doing is throwing another variable into the mix. Why screw it up?

[chachi 0]

^ because some day they may need the skill? NOT EVERYONE wants to be a swooper.

[YISkyDive 0]

Quote

The benefit of rears on a lightly loaded large canopy to someone who is just coming straight in is worthless.

This is not infact true. If you open- go too unstow your brakes and now have a toggle in your hand that is not connect too your steering line for what ever reason, you can A) cut it away, or if you know how to land on rears B) make that decision too do so.

At 200 jumps I started landing on rears too toggles and got my ass ripped. Everyone on the DZ was livid- yet I wasnt doing anything low, I wasnt pile driving into the ground, and I wasnt a danger too anyone.

I learned soo much about landing rears on a diablo @ 1.2 too one that when I did it on a nitro at 1.4 too I had a very nice surf out of a harness turn.

Shit- landing on rears is on the downsizing checklist. Im not advocating that a jumper with 56 jumps should be (without proper assitance) be learning this- but do you want them to learn rears on something that inducing a highspeed stall could kill them?

On a diablo- if you blew a rears landing, you got an -ugly- surf and where forced to a toggle switch to stand up the landing. Im sure that if you rear riser stall a Xaos, crossifre, or other performance machine standing up the landing will be the last thing on your mind.

Saying not too learning stuff on a lightly loaded canopy is so wrong its not even funny. Sure they may not get 300Ft swoops out of a 270- but there is a progression all should follow. And every time someone asks to down size too swoop the #1 comment I see is "learn everything you can on your current canopy." Now 270s on a 1.1 triathlon or what ever they case maybe may not be acceptable(and hopefully he person will be explained this as i was when i thought it was brite)- but before downsizing learning rears is something that is useful. Rears too toggles- its an additional step, but one that on a lightly loaded canopy has little affect- but does help muscle memory and understanding of whats going on.

Unfortunetly this is not something you can do up high- because you cant tell what is happeneing too the foot. I did 50 rear riser landings in a row over the course of 3 or 4 weeks too learn what was really going.

[LearningTOfly 0]

On the note of the whole "good idea/ bad idea" conversation which this has turned into (not that I mind, there was some very good souding information in a few of the initial posts):

I really appreciate the helpfulness of people like chachi, robap and YI... I made this post intially to gain insight into a detail of a skill I hope to learn in the future- these people have been very helpful by putting themselves in a position of a mentor, and giving a brief but very helpful tidbit of information to the public in this thread. Who knows, maybe other jumpers will wander by and pick up some insight from this that's going to reduce the risk of them dropping a toggle in the future.

Back to the GI/ BI... I asked this question because yes, I am going to try landing with rear riser input- yes I do have low jump numbers, but I'm comfortable with the idea, and that's my call- I won't defend myself any more. Anyways, I've seen in a number of places on the forum where a low time jumper asks a question only to be responded to with a barrage of "you shouldn't be asking"s or "why don't you know that by now"s... I think that these sort of responses are not only not helpful, but will deter the next guy from asking a question they're interested in because they don't want to be berated for asking a simple question.

Once again, my thanks to those who added their two cents...