Needless death

[freethefly 6]

This is not the first time a person with a realistic toy gun has been killed by police.
This shooting leaves a lot of questions to be answered.
Had anyone else, but a cop, shot this guy, they'd be sitting in a jail cell.

http://news.yahoo.com/man-toy-gun-shot-killed-police-fla-073336410.html

http://www.wsvn.com/news/articles/local/21005261341939/

http://blogs.miaminewtimes.com/riptide/2011/09/ernest_vassell_autistic_man_ki.php

http://miami.cbslocal.com/2011/08/31/n-miami-beach-police-officers-shot-rifle-wielding-man/

Children with toy guns killed by police:

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-chat/1855490/posts

http://articles.latimes.com/1985-03-04/local/me-24218_1_wrongful-death-suit

This one lived:
http://articles.latimes.com/2009/may/11/local/me-palmdale11

This one was damn lucky he wasn't shot:
http://www.kitsapsun.com/news/2009/jan/15/bremerton-boy-playing-with-toy-gun-draws-big/?partner=RSS

A fact sheet:
http://www.irol.com/avc/fact_sheet_about_toy_guns.html
Studies show that most children younger than eight can not reliably distinguish a toy gun from a real gun.

http://www.med.umich.edu/yourchild/topics/guns.htm
The U-M C.S. Mott Children's Hospital National Poll on Children's Health finds that over half of parents who don't own a gun have never talked with their children about gun safety.

Now, I am a gun lover. I love to shoot and really love hunting, but there are things that just bother me. Top of the list is needless death by people not paying attention. Add in realistic toy guns and things get bad for the person with the toy and the cop who has to live with the fact that he or she killed a child (or an adult) with a toy. Just needless death. All the more reason to teach children the difference between real and fake as well as when to sit the toy gun down. All the more reason for police to be able to identify a toy (orange tips?).

"...And once you're gone, you can't come back
When you're out of the blue and into the black."
Neil Young

[kelpdiver 2]

from the second story:
Vassell's family are now hoping for some answers. "We already have over 20 witnesses saying that they didn't see him with any gun," Leon said

As to your notion that a non cop would be in jail - not at all certain. If this really was a replica rifle and he was running around pointing it, self defense is a reasonable stance.

The family's claims that it was obvious he was disabled don't fly. Disabled with a rifle is as dangerous as anyone else.

[freethefly 6]

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Vassell's family are now hoping for some answers. "We already have over 20 witnesses saying that they didn't see him with any gun," Leon said

I would think the police would have video from their dash cameras. My nephew use several cameras while interacting with the public. If it is on video, it removes all doubt.

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As to your notion that a non cop would be in jail - not at all certain.

The public is held to a different standard than the police. But this is not the first time an autistic man has been killed by a police officer. The Steven Washington cases comes to mind. He was shot in the head from only a few feet away. The cop said he mistaken a cell phone for a gun. As far as I can tell, they got departmental disciplined. If I had shot the guy, claiming I thought his cell phone was a gun, I'd be sitting in a cell.

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The family's claims that it was obvious he was disabled don't fly. Disabled with a rifle is as dangerous as anyone else.

I can agree with that. Yet, I still think that so many of these cases could be handled differently.

And back to gun safety:
http://northcounty.fox2now.com/news/news/gun-safety-hot-topic-after-second-child-shoots-self-week/62184

Two kids dead in one week. One child, age 3, the son of a Maryland Heights, MO police officer accidentally shot himself in the chest. The other was a 3 year old girl whom shot herself in the head while playing with a gun.
From the article:
Both the doctor and the police chief say they’ve heard the argument that locking guns away defeats the purpose of having them for protection. Both agree it’s a choice that has to be made, and a choice that should be made in favor of child safety.
I've heard the same argument. Most of us have. My thought is, if you live in such an extremely dangerous neighborhood that you need a loaded weapon at arms reach at all time, maybe a gun isn't the answer to your safety... Maybe moving to a better area is.

"...And once you're gone, you can't come back
When you're out of the blue and into the black."
Neil Young

[kelpdiver 2]

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Both the doctor and the police chief say they’ve heard the argument that locking guns away defeats the purpose of having them for protection. Both agree it’s a choice that has to be made, and a choice that should be made in favor of child safety.

I've heard the same argument. Most of us have. My thought is, if you live in such an extremely dangerous neighborhood that you need a loaded weapon at arms reach at all time, maybe a gun isn't the answer to your safety... Maybe moving to a better area is.

Not always an option. Moving costs money and as much as 4 months rent upfront depending on local law.

As for locking up guns - it's a very different decision if you have children versus not. There are options that straddle both sides, like storing openly at the top of a closet rather than a shoebox at infant ground level.

[SkyDekker 1,150]

To me the equasion is one of risk vs reward and one of probability and possibility.

Depending on the area where I live I would have to decide if the risk (possibility and probability) of having an armed intruder in my house with lethal end result, is worth the risk of having guns in the house.

[JohnRich 4]

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As for locking up guns - it's a very different decision if you have children versus not. There are options that straddle both sides, like storing openly at the top of a closet rather than a shoebox at infant ground level.

You can do both: have a quickly available gun, as well as a gun that is safe from the reach of children.
Example: http://www.gunvault.com/handgun-safes/multi-vault-biometric.html

There are also cheaper ones that don't read fingerprints, but just have a combination lock that uses a sequence of finger depressions to open them. When my granddaughters were born, I bought their dad one, and insisted that he use it.

[freethefly 6]

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As for locking up guns - it's a very different decision if you have children versus not. There are options that straddle both sides, like storing openly at the top of a closet rather than a shoebox at infant ground level.

You can do both: have a quickly available gun, as well as a gun that is safe from the reach of children.
Example: http://www.gunvault.com/handgun-safes/multi-vault-biometric.html

There are also cheaper ones that don't read fingerprints, but just have a combination lock that uses a sequence of finger depressions to open them. When my granddaughters were born, I bought their dad one, and insisted that he use it.

That is money well spent.
I wish more people would be as safety conscious and realize that it is stupidity that kills people. Not guns, cars, motorcycles...,but people not paying attention.

"...And once you're gone, you can't come back
When you're out of the blue and into the black."
Neil Young