ReBirth 0 #26 November 3, 2005 You have valid points, from the point of view of someone who doesn't think in racial terms. However, there are a whole lot of people who do and a whole lot of people that are subjected to racism. Until that's elliminated you can't ignore the fact that there is a division, real or imaginary, mainly created by those that judge others based on race. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rehmwa 2 #27 November 3, 2005 QuoteYou have valid points, from the point of view of someone who doesn't think in racial terms. However, there are a whole lot of people who do and a whole lot of people that are subjected to racism. Until that's elliminated you can't ignore the fact that there is a division, real or imaginary, mainly created by those that judge others based on race. You and I can only control how we choose to feel and act, not everybody else. And hopefully set an example. Anything else is wasted energy, impotent rage that causes more damage than good. As I said to Darius, you can say a "whole lotta people", but what does that really mean other than you see a real or perceived problem? That's futile until you can walk up to an individual and say to their face what you think of them - when that happens, it doesn't matter what you think of the 'general' population, what only matters is what that single individual is all about and whether you are right or not. When you meet a brand new stranger, hell, let's be specific, a brand new american skydiver walks into your DZ, do you shake their hand and think - GOD, WHAT A RACIST, and then treat them that way until they prove differently? Or even worse, only with the (insert race identifier) skydivers? Are we all innocent until proven guilty? guilty until innocent? or judged based on some cosmetic preconceptions? (and this is an individually based question, not a generalization) Edit: It's funny how this can be called 'nit picking' when it doesn't fit into someone's little preconceived notion of how we should act. I like to think that big subjective problems are just a waste, we make (real) change by acting one on one with the others around us. We make ineffective gestures (read laws) by trying to make sweeping changes. It takes longer, but it's real, accepted (not resented), and lasts. ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Darius11 12 #28 November 3, 2005 (I'm serious about everyone just checking off Other - what a horrible thing to put on any questionaire not in the medical field.) Quote I always do. They don't have Persian anywhere QuoteWhat's with you throwing out random PC rhetoric? Trying to join a health club somewhere and want to fit in? No dude I am used to you making detailed posts and focusing on the issue, I am not used to you pointing out BS like the true definition of race or spelling and grammar mistakes.I'd rather be hated for who I am, than loved for who I am not." - Kurt Cobain Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites rehmwa 2 #29 November 3, 2005 QuoteThey don't have Persian anywhere still don't consider "Persian" a race. Met a nice Persian girl in Singapore at the beach. She was good volleyball player. ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Darius11 12 #30 November 3, 2005 Was she hot? Did she put a Jihad on your penis?I'd rather be hated for who I am, than loved for who I am not." - Kurt Cobain Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites KiwiQ 0 #31 November 3, 2005 I can't say that I wouldn't be put off if I were one of them. And hearing the incessant questioning on different talk stations of "C'mon now, do they REALLY pray 5 times a day?" just makes me want to pull my hair out. Yes, it was an inconvenience I'm sure. And chances are pretty good that if it was a group of young white males it would not have drawn so much suspicion. However, it's more an issue of profiling than it is racism. Some might beg to differ, arguing that there is no difference between the two. However, please take time to play devil's advocate. If they HAD been terrorists and people in the stadium had been killed, how many people would be jumping on stadium security calling them dumbasses for not being suspicious of a group of Muslims congregating near the air system for the stadium during the middle of a game? Profiling sucks, no doubt about it. But you've got to weigh that against you and your family's safety. Maybe I wouldn't say this so easily if it really were the case. But think about it. If a handful of young white females who fit my description were going around bombing subway stations, and I happened to look suspicious upon attempting to get on the subway and I was stopped for questioning...I would hope that, despite the inconvenience, I would be cooperative in light of the situation. Also, let's not forget that these men were not thrown in jail or brutalized or blah blah blah. In fact, the lot of them were even offered tremendous seats as an apology from the stadium. Twist and spin my words as you please, now. I expect it."...I'm going to feed your fingers to the wolverines..." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites ReBirth 0 #32 November 3, 2005 I agree with your post completely. The only issue I had was people saying that people doing what normal muslims do is "cultish" and "bizarre". Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites AlexCrowley 0 #33 November 3, 2005 Urm. While I dont want to get into this subject too much.... Racism isnt profiling, never will be. Profiling is about developing a description that not only gives a high positive match rate but also reduces "false positives" (such as assuming a bunch of people praying are a threat). Placing faith in profiling dramatically increases the chance of 'false negatives', in this case missing the terrorists who performed the Oklahoma and Olympic bombings. TV's got them images, TV's got them all, nothing's shocking. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites billvon 2,435 #34 November 3, 2005 >If a handful of young white females who fit my description were >going around bombing subway stations, and I happened to look > suspicious upon attempting to get on the subway and I was stopped > for questioning...I would hope that, despite the inconvenience, I > would be cooperative in light of the situation. And let's say that happened in an airport, and those young white females blew up the plane a friend of yours was on while they were questioning you. Might that change your outlook? Because that's what did happen a few years back, when two 30ish year old Chechen women blew up two Russian airliners. "Hey, they're white women; it's not like they're Arabs." That's the downside of profiling. Profiling gives terrorists an easy in. Want to get a bomb on a plane? Get a white woman and four male arabs age 18-34, and give the woman the bomb. Pick an airport where they profile heavily (for safety's sake, of course.) Send them all through at the same time. Which one is going to make it through? If stopping terrorism is the goal, the only thing that makes sense is to pick a level of scrutiny you would apply to a 'suspicious' person - an then apply that level of scrutiny to everyone. Don't give terrorists an easy way to get around the system. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites rhino 0 #35 November 3, 2005 QuoteWhere's the racism? I agree.. They were the ones crying profiling.... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites TypicalFish 0 #36 November 3, 2005 QuoteWas she hot? Did she put a Jihad on your penis? I think the correct usage is "make jihad on your penis"...."I gargle no man's balls..." ussfpa on SOCNET Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites ReBirth 0 #37 November 3, 2005 That sounds like something you get from an Arabian tunnel bunny. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites rehmwa 2 #38 November 3, 2005 QuoteWas she hot? Did she put a Jihad on your penis? 1 - She was gorgeous, young, fit and stacked. And from a good family. Seriously. 2 - I'm not a 'regional bachelor' though I know a few that are. I'm actually loyal to my wife and family no matter where I am. That really sucks, international travel would be a lot more fun without those kinds of morals. ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Wopelao 0 #39 November 3, 2005 And what happened to your "standards"? Is there any room for you to lower them? 3.1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites RhondaLea 3 #40 November 3, 2005 QuoteQuote...They are just going to have to accept the racism. .... Where's the racism? "...a group of gentlemen gathering in an area not normally used by the public right near the main air intake duct for the stadium, and a food preparation facility," Siegel said. "It was where they were, not what they were doing." The site is now fenced off and is no longer accessible to fans." Playing the race card is not appropriate in this case. Forgetting about semantics completely (what constitutes "race" and such), my question is: if "it was where they were, not what they were doing," then why wasn't the area fenced off to begin with? I mean, if it was such a sensitive area, that would only make sense, right? We can deny until we're blue that this had nothing to do with these men being Muslim, but on the face of it, that's certainly how it seems to me. Do terrorists usually go out of their way to make such spectacles of themselves prior to the singular spectacle of the act of terror they commit? rlIf you don't know where you're going, you should know where you came from. Gullah Proverb Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites waltappel 1 #41 November 3, 2005 QuoteWow...the basic activities of the largest religion in the world are apparently cultish and fanatical. Maybe not racist, but definitely shows a lack of understanding and fear of anything different from you. [yawn] In your opinion it does, but don't let facts get in the way of your conclusions. I import goods from Turkey. I went there twice last year and went all over the country. It's a great place with great people. It's also, by most accounts, at least 95% Muslim. If you think I don't understand religious people, though, you are right. The whole concept of a deity seems quite absurd to me and I don't understand how people can claim the existence of a supreme being and keep a straight face. I doubt I will ever understand it. I have the same feelings toward every organized religion I have had exposure to. Do I fear them because they are different from me? Hardly. I view religion mainly as a control mechanism for the masses (brainwashing) and, to a lesser extent, a crutch for individuals who have some inner need for it. Let's take the case of a Muslim who pulls out the good ol' prayer rug and does the Mecca-facing aerobics thing 5 times a day. In my view, that person is very controlled/brainwashed or has some serious inner needs to take care of. Let me put it a little differently. If, instead of Allah, they worshiped the Easter Bunny, your views of Muslims might change, but mine wouldn't. I view both as being equally silly. Praying to any deity or combination of deities just strikes me as quirky behavior. Harmless, but quirky. Frequent quirky behavior rises to a level of oddity that I consider to be downright strangeness, hence my views on Muslims. I don't argue their right to think or do whatever the hell they want, but do I take their beliefs seriously? Nope. Do I take Christianity or any other organized religion seriously? No. The fact is that NOBODY really knows what the real truth is. I take that a step further. I don't know and I don't care because I seriously doubt that my feeble human mind is really capable of truly comprehending the origins and inner workings of the universe. I tend to think that deep down, most people know that they really don't know what the Truth is. They just go along with the program to either "hedge their bets" in case their really is some kind of Heaven and/or Hell, paths to ultimate enlightenment, or whatever, or they are bowing down to social pressures, or maybe see it as a way to score chicks, or something. So give me credit for being honest about my views instead of just dumping your smug politically-correct snobbery on me. Walt Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites ReBirth 0 #42 November 3, 2005 Hey...I'm with you on the whole religion thing. It's the "not taking their beliefs seriously" part. What's really wrong with being pc? It's not much more than being considerate of the opinions and sensitivities of others. I feel that's a good thing. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites waltappel 1 #43 November 4, 2005 QuoteHey...I'm with you on the whole religion thing. It's the "not taking their beliefs seriously" part. What's really wrong with being pc? It's not much more than being considerate of the opinions and sensitivities of others. I feel that's a good thing. I'm a believer in being considerate--I don't go out of my way to insult anyone's religious beliefs but in any discussion on religion, I will generally state my views honestly. If someone tells me their religious views, I'll listen to what they have to say because despite the way my words sometimes come across, I respect people as individuals. If they ask my views or if the topic comes up, I'll tell them. What I will not do is try and deny their right to think and do as they please. Nor will I tell someone their religious beliefs are wrong. I have no clue whether anyone's religious views are right or wrong and neither do they. As far as I am concerned people have every right to be as religious or as non-religious as they want to be; as conservative or liberal as they want to be; as racist or non-racist as they want to me. People can have any belief system they want or no belief system at all and I will not try and interfere. How's that for a tolerant attitude? By comparison, I find people who push political correctness to be rather intolerant and quite blind to their own hipocracy of preaching tolerance while at the same time being intolerant of people who they consider to be intolerant. I'd rather be around people who say what's on their mind. Tact is a good thing, but I'll take rough-edged honesty over tactful bullshit anytime. I think we're pretty much on the same page but we're dealing with a communication medium where much is left to interpretation and that interpretation is filled with uncertainty. I regularly get accused of all sorts of vile personality traits here, but I would wager that I would enjoy the company of just about anyone who posts here (including those who think I'm a real jerk) and they would probably enjoy hanging out with me. I saw a posting in SC recently where the guy said that SC is a real waste. I disagree. There's definitely some silly crap to wade through, but there is also a lot of intelligent thought posted here and I enjoy the variety of views expressed. I also enjoy the fact that there are a lot of cultural differences in the world. I wouldn't want everybody to be like me. That would be a boring world. I'm not sure I would want *anybody* to be like me. Enough rambling. Walt Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites ReBirth 0 #44 November 4, 2005 good post. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites artistcalledian 0 #45 November 4, 2005 QuoteI regularly get accused of all sorts of vile personality traits here, but I would wager that I would enjoy the company of just about anyone who posts here (including those who think I'm a real jerk) and they would probably enjoy hanging out with me. i agree with your post 100% AND i think this is spot on too, this is exactly how i think. People jump up and down on here about my posts, it's as if they take every bit of shit on here seriously. I'm just a normal bloke who laughs at normal things. I'd be the first to stand at the bar and buy ANYBODY on here a beer, some people need to get their heads out of their internet arses occasionally________________________________________ drive it like you stole it and f*ck the police Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites popsjumper 2 #46 November 4, 2005 Quote...my question is: if "it was where they were, not what they were doing," then why wasn't the area fenced off to begin with? I mean, if it was such a sensitive area, that would only make sense, right? Yep. If it was a sensitive area, then somebody screwed up by not fencing it off in the first place.My reality and yours are quite different. I think we're all Bozos on this bus. Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites RhondaLea 3 #47 November 4, 2005 QuoteQuote...my question is: if "it was where they were, not what they were doing," then why wasn't the area fenced off to begin with? I mean, if it was such a sensitive area, that would only make sense, right? Yep. If it was a sensitive area, then somebody screwed up by not fencing it off in the first place. In which case, the usual and appropriate response would've been "nothing to see here, move along, move along." Right? rlIf you don't know where you're going, you should know where you came from. Gullah Proverb Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites waltappel 1 #48 November 4, 2005 QuoteGetting funky with the dropzone (or any other place) 5 or 6 times a day IMO takes an activity beyond the "keeping on an even keel" thing. On one hand, I respect the dedication and apparently sincerity. On the other hand, it seems very cultish and weird to me. A few years back I worked with a bunch of really nice guys who were devout skydivers. They would disappear for short periods throughout the day to go jump. (BTW, this was well before 9/11.) Even though I liked them as co-workers and as people, I always felt a little uncomfortable with all the jumping because it seemed fanatical to me and I'm generally not very fond of being around fanatics of any stripe. Jumping once on Sunday is enough for anyone. rl Rhonda Lea, on my very best days I have a mastery of the obvious, but this is not one of those days. What exactly is your point--that one person's fanatacism is another person's hobby? Or that judging another culture's norms with respect to my culture's norms is a waste? Or that I'm full of shit? I could easily agree with any of the above, but how about saying it directly! Walt Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites waltappel 1 #49 November 4, 2005 Quote I'd be the first to stand at the bar and buy ANYBODY on here a beer, some people need to get their heads out of their internet arses occasionally I like to think that nearly everyone who posts in SC feels the same way, but it's nice to see someone saying it loudly and clearly every once in a while. Thanks for doing so! Walt Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites RhondaLea 3 #50 November 4, 2005 QuoteRhonda Lea, on my very best days I have a mastery of the obvious, but this is not one of those days. You're one of the smartest people I know. Were you drinking last night? QuoteWhat exactly is your point--that one person's fanatacism is another person's hobby? Or that judging another culture's norms with respect to my culture's norms is a waste? Or that I'm full of shit? The one in the middle. And now that I think of it, the first one too. I've never thought you're full of shit. The prime directive is "my right to swing stops at the end of your nose." As to the incident, these guys weren't swinging. I have no answer to the bigger problem. There's just no changing ingrained attitudes: "If you're not like me, you must be bad." QuoteI could easily agree with any of the above, but how about saying it directly! I had a lot more fun making that post. Thanks for the opportunity, m'love. rlIf you don't know where you're going, you should know where you came from. Gullah Proverb Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Prev 1 2 3 Next Page 2 of 3 Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. 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rehmwa 2 #29 November 3, 2005 QuoteThey don't have Persian anywhere still don't consider "Persian" a race. Met a nice Persian girl in Singapore at the beach. She was good volleyball player. ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Darius11 12 #30 November 3, 2005 Was she hot? Did she put a Jihad on your penis?I'd rather be hated for who I am, than loved for who I am not." - Kurt Cobain Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
KiwiQ 0 #31 November 3, 2005 I can't say that I wouldn't be put off if I were one of them. And hearing the incessant questioning on different talk stations of "C'mon now, do they REALLY pray 5 times a day?" just makes me want to pull my hair out. Yes, it was an inconvenience I'm sure. And chances are pretty good that if it was a group of young white males it would not have drawn so much suspicion. However, it's more an issue of profiling than it is racism. Some might beg to differ, arguing that there is no difference between the two. However, please take time to play devil's advocate. If they HAD been terrorists and people in the stadium had been killed, how many people would be jumping on stadium security calling them dumbasses for not being suspicious of a group of Muslims congregating near the air system for the stadium during the middle of a game? Profiling sucks, no doubt about it. But you've got to weigh that against you and your family's safety. Maybe I wouldn't say this so easily if it really were the case. But think about it. If a handful of young white females who fit my description were going around bombing subway stations, and I happened to look suspicious upon attempting to get on the subway and I was stopped for questioning...I would hope that, despite the inconvenience, I would be cooperative in light of the situation. Also, let's not forget that these men were not thrown in jail or brutalized or blah blah blah. In fact, the lot of them were even offered tremendous seats as an apology from the stadium. Twist and spin my words as you please, now. I expect it."...I'm going to feed your fingers to the wolverines..." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ReBirth 0 #32 November 3, 2005 I agree with your post completely. The only issue I had was people saying that people doing what normal muslims do is "cultish" and "bizarre". Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AlexCrowley 0 #33 November 3, 2005 Urm. While I dont want to get into this subject too much.... Racism isnt profiling, never will be. Profiling is about developing a description that not only gives a high positive match rate but also reduces "false positives" (such as assuming a bunch of people praying are a threat). Placing faith in profiling dramatically increases the chance of 'false negatives', in this case missing the terrorists who performed the Oklahoma and Olympic bombings. TV's got them images, TV's got them all, nothing's shocking. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,435 #34 November 3, 2005 >If a handful of young white females who fit my description were >going around bombing subway stations, and I happened to look > suspicious upon attempting to get on the subway and I was stopped > for questioning...I would hope that, despite the inconvenience, I > would be cooperative in light of the situation. And let's say that happened in an airport, and those young white females blew up the plane a friend of yours was on while they were questioning you. Might that change your outlook? Because that's what did happen a few years back, when two 30ish year old Chechen women blew up two Russian airliners. "Hey, they're white women; it's not like they're Arabs." That's the downside of profiling. Profiling gives terrorists an easy in. Want to get a bomb on a plane? Get a white woman and four male arabs age 18-34, and give the woman the bomb. Pick an airport where they profile heavily (for safety's sake, of course.) Send them all through at the same time. Which one is going to make it through? If stopping terrorism is the goal, the only thing that makes sense is to pick a level of scrutiny you would apply to a 'suspicious' person - an then apply that level of scrutiny to everyone. Don't give terrorists an easy way to get around the system. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rhino 0 #35 November 3, 2005 QuoteWhere's the racism? I agree.. They were the ones crying profiling.... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TypicalFish 0 #36 November 3, 2005 QuoteWas she hot? Did she put a Jihad on your penis? I think the correct usage is "make jihad on your penis"...."I gargle no man's balls..." ussfpa on SOCNET Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ReBirth 0 #37 November 3, 2005 That sounds like something you get from an Arabian tunnel bunny. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rehmwa 2 #38 November 3, 2005 QuoteWas she hot? Did she put a Jihad on your penis? 1 - She was gorgeous, young, fit and stacked. And from a good family. Seriously. 2 - I'm not a 'regional bachelor' though I know a few that are. I'm actually loyal to my wife and family no matter where I am. That really sucks, international travel would be a lot more fun without those kinds of morals. ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Wopelao 0 #39 November 3, 2005 And what happened to your "standards"? Is there any room for you to lower them? 3.1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RhondaLea 3 #40 November 3, 2005 QuoteQuote...They are just going to have to accept the racism. .... Where's the racism? "...a group of gentlemen gathering in an area not normally used by the public right near the main air intake duct for the stadium, and a food preparation facility," Siegel said. "It was where they were, not what they were doing." The site is now fenced off and is no longer accessible to fans." Playing the race card is not appropriate in this case. Forgetting about semantics completely (what constitutes "race" and such), my question is: if "it was where they were, not what they were doing," then why wasn't the area fenced off to begin with? I mean, if it was such a sensitive area, that would only make sense, right? We can deny until we're blue that this had nothing to do with these men being Muslim, but on the face of it, that's certainly how it seems to me. Do terrorists usually go out of their way to make such spectacles of themselves prior to the singular spectacle of the act of terror they commit? rlIf you don't know where you're going, you should know where you came from. Gullah Proverb Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
waltappel 1 #41 November 3, 2005 QuoteWow...the basic activities of the largest religion in the world are apparently cultish and fanatical. Maybe not racist, but definitely shows a lack of understanding and fear of anything different from you. [yawn] In your opinion it does, but don't let facts get in the way of your conclusions. I import goods from Turkey. I went there twice last year and went all over the country. It's a great place with great people. It's also, by most accounts, at least 95% Muslim. If you think I don't understand religious people, though, you are right. The whole concept of a deity seems quite absurd to me and I don't understand how people can claim the existence of a supreme being and keep a straight face. I doubt I will ever understand it. I have the same feelings toward every organized religion I have had exposure to. Do I fear them because they are different from me? Hardly. I view religion mainly as a control mechanism for the masses (brainwashing) and, to a lesser extent, a crutch for individuals who have some inner need for it. Let's take the case of a Muslim who pulls out the good ol' prayer rug and does the Mecca-facing aerobics thing 5 times a day. In my view, that person is very controlled/brainwashed or has some serious inner needs to take care of. Let me put it a little differently. If, instead of Allah, they worshiped the Easter Bunny, your views of Muslims might change, but mine wouldn't. I view both as being equally silly. Praying to any deity or combination of deities just strikes me as quirky behavior. Harmless, but quirky. Frequent quirky behavior rises to a level of oddity that I consider to be downright strangeness, hence my views on Muslims. I don't argue their right to think or do whatever the hell they want, but do I take their beliefs seriously? Nope. Do I take Christianity or any other organized religion seriously? No. The fact is that NOBODY really knows what the real truth is. I take that a step further. I don't know and I don't care because I seriously doubt that my feeble human mind is really capable of truly comprehending the origins and inner workings of the universe. I tend to think that deep down, most people know that they really don't know what the Truth is. They just go along with the program to either "hedge their bets" in case their really is some kind of Heaven and/or Hell, paths to ultimate enlightenment, or whatever, or they are bowing down to social pressures, or maybe see it as a way to score chicks, or something. So give me credit for being honest about my views instead of just dumping your smug politically-correct snobbery on me. Walt Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ReBirth 0 #42 November 3, 2005 Hey...I'm with you on the whole religion thing. It's the "not taking their beliefs seriously" part. What's really wrong with being pc? It's not much more than being considerate of the opinions and sensitivities of others. I feel that's a good thing. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
waltappel 1 #43 November 4, 2005 QuoteHey...I'm with you on the whole religion thing. It's the "not taking their beliefs seriously" part. What's really wrong with being pc? It's not much more than being considerate of the opinions and sensitivities of others. I feel that's a good thing. I'm a believer in being considerate--I don't go out of my way to insult anyone's religious beliefs but in any discussion on religion, I will generally state my views honestly. If someone tells me their religious views, I'll listen to what they have to say because despite the way my words sometimes come across, I respect people as individuals. If they ask my views or if the topic comes up, I'll tell them. What I will not do is try and deny their right to think and do as they please. Nor will I tell someone their religious beliefs are wrong. I have no clue whether anyone's religious views are right or wrong and neither do they. As far as I am concerned people have every right to be as religious or as non-religious as they want to be; as conservative or liberal as they want to be; as racist or non-racist as they want to me. People can have any belief system they want or no belief system at all and I will not try and interfere. How's that for a tolerant attitude? By comparison, I find people who push political correctness to be rather intolerant and quite blind to their own hipocracy of preaching tolerance while at the same time being intolerant of people who they consider to be intolerant. I'd rather be around people who say what's on their mind. Tact is a good thing, but I'll take rough-edged honesty over tactful bullshit anytime. I think we're pretty much on the same page but we're dealing with a communication medium where much is left to interpretation and that interpretation is filled with uncertainty. I regularly get accused of all sorts of vile personality traits here, but I would wager that I would enjoy the company of just about anyone who posts here (including those who think I'm a real jerk) and they would probably enjoy hanging out with me. I saw a posting in SC recently where the guy said that SC is a real waste. I disagree. There's definitely some silly crap to wade through, but there is also a lot of intelligent thought posted here and I enjoy the variety of views expressed. I also enjoy the fact that there are a lot of cultural differences in the world. I wouldn't want everybody to be like me. That would be a boring world. I'm not sure I would want *anybody* to be like me. Enough rambling. Walt Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
artistcalledian 0 #45 November 4, 2005 QuoteI regularly get accused of all sorts of vile personality traits here, but I would wager that I would enjoy the company of just about anyone who posts here (including those who think I'm a real jerk) and they would probably enjoy hanging out with me. i agree with your post 100% AND i think this is spot on too, this is exactly how i think. People jump up and down on here about my posts, it's as if they take every bit of shit on here seriously. I'm just a normal bloke who laughs at normal things. I'd be the first to stand at the bar and buy ANYBODY on here a beer, some people need to get their heads out of their internet arses occasionally________________________________________ drive it like you stole it and f*ck the police Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
popsjumper 2 #46 November 4, 2005 Quote...my question is: if "it was where they were, not what they were doing," then why wasn't the area fenced off to begin with? I mean, if it was such a sensitive area, that would only make sense, right? Yep. If it was a sensitive area, then somebody screwed up by not fencing it off in the first place.My reality and yours are quite different. I think we're all Bozos on this bus. Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RhondaLea 3 #47 November 4, 2005 QuoteQuote...my question is: if "it was where they were, not what they were doing," then why wasn't the area fenced off to begin with? I mean, if it was such a sensitive area, that would only make sense, right? Yep. If it was a sensitive area, then somebody screwed up by not fencing it off in the first place. In which case, the usual and appropriate response would've been "nothing to see here, move along, move along." Right? rlIf you don't know where you're going, you should know where you came from. Gullah Proverb Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
waltappel 1 #48 November 4, 2005 QuoteGetting funky with the dropzone (or any other place) 5 or 6 times a day IMO takes an activity beyond the "keeping on an even keel" thing. On one hand, I respect the dedication and apparently sincerity. On the other hand, it seems very cultish and weird to me. A few years back I worked with a bunch of really nice guys who were devout skydivers. They would disappear for short periods throughout the day to go jump. (BTW, this was well before 9/11.) Even though I liked them as co-workers and as people, I always felt a little uncomfortable with all the jumping because it seemed fanatical to me and I'm generally not very fond of being around fanatics of any stripe. Jumping once on Sunday is enough for anyone. rl Rhonda Lea, on my very best days I have a mastery of the obvious, but this is not one of those days. What exactly is your point--that one person's fanatacism is another person's hobby? Or that judging another culture's norms with respect to my culture's norms is a waste? Or that I'm full of shit? I could easily agree with any of the above, but how about saying it directly! Walt Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
waltappel 1 #49 November 4, 2005 Quote I'd be the first to stand at the bar and buy ANYBODY on here a beer, some people need to get their heads out of their internet arses occasionally I like to think that nearly everyone who posts in SC feels the same way, but it's nice to see someone saying it loudly and clearly every once in a while. Thanks for doing so! Walt Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RhondaLea 3 #50 November 4, 2005 QuoteRhonda Lea, on my very best days I have a mastery of the obvious, but this is not one of those days. You're one of the smartest people I know. Were you drinking last night? QuoteWhat exactly is your point--that one person's fanatacism is another person's hobby? Or that judging another culture's norms with respect to my culture's norms is a waste? Or that I'm full of shit? The one in the middle. And now that I think of it, the first one too. I've never thought you're full of shit. The prime directive is "my right to swing stops at the end of your nose." As to the incident, these guys weren't swinging. I have no answer to the bigger problem. There's just no changing ingrained attitudes: "If you're not like me, you must be bad." QuoteI could easily agree with any of the above, but how about saying it directly! I had a lot more fun making that post. Thanks for the opportunity, m'love. rlIf you don't know where you're going, you should know where you came from. Gullah Proverb Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
