Body Count for this Week's Episode of "Over There" 17AUG2005

[waltappel 1]

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>Killing in the name of Allah, God, or whoever the fuck is
>tantamount to terrorism in my opinion.

See if you can identify this little ditty:

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(edited to save space)
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Both sides in a war want to believe God is on their side, and their killing, if not in his name, is at least sanctioned by him. The winners get to say that that's OK.

I get your point, but let me take a shot at a version more correct for modern times:

Mine eyes have seen the glory of the coming of the buck;
In the form of land, oil or minerals we don't give a flying fuck;
We'll take it 'cuz we want it so you're just shit out of luck.
The truth is we don't care!
Glory! Glory! Hallelujah! Glory! Glory! Hallelujah!
Glory! Glory! Hallelujah! The truth is we don't care.

. . .

We took our sacred land using bullets, lies, and disease,
Wiped all the fuckers out from the Comanches to the Crees,
They either did what we said or we hung 'em from some trees,
Our greed is marching on.
Glory! Glory! Hallelujah! Glory! Glory! Hallelujah!
Glory! Glory! Hallelujah! The truth is we don't care.
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edited to add:
I don't hate this country. Quite the opposite. The people running it, on the other hand, disgust me with their greed and seemingly undending ability to believe that we should show the rest of the world how to run their own countries.

Sounds impossible, but I have a very close friend who is Muslim. He is Turkish. When we talk politics and religion, it gets ugly. One thing he is absolutely convinced of is that Bush is waging a war against Islam. He harps on some obscure quote from Bush using the word "crusade".

Naturally, I told him that anyone who actually believes that crap just doesn't understand the mentality of the people who run this country. It's all about greed and power. God has nothing to do with it.

I think the same is true of the Arab countries and just about any country that likes to do stupid shit in the name of God, or Allah, or whoever.

Walt

[JohnRich 4]

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However, why should the killing of terrorist shitheads be a "joke"? That's a good thing, which saves the lives of many innocent people.

You're not in favor of allowing terrorists to carry out their deadly attacks, are you? ***

I believe that most of the people that we're killing in Iraq are insurgents, not terrorists. Every muslim who picks up a gun to defend what he thinks is right is not a terrorist.

I wasn't talking about insurgents fighting for Iraqii independence from American influence. I was talking about terrorists who blow up innocent people. I hope that you don't think that blowing up innocent men, women and children is the "right" thing to do. It certainly doesn't further the cause of Iraqii independence. In fact, it worsens it. The more they do it, the longer we have to stay and fight.

[billvon 2,467]

>The more they do it, the longer we have to stay and fight.

Isn't that true of both terrorists and insurgents? Or do you forsee a day when we declare "most of the people we're figthing are insurgents, so it's time to leave?"

[Guest]

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However, why should the killing of terrorist shitheads be a "joke"? That's a good thing, which saves the lives of many innocent people.

You're not in favor of allowing terrorists to carry out their deadly attacks, are you? ***

I believe that most of the people that we're killing in Iraq are insurgents, not terrorists. Every muslim who picks up a gun to defend what he thinks is right is not a terrorist.

I wasn't talking about insurgents fighting for Iraqii independence from American influence. I was talking about terrorists who blow up innocent people. I hope that you don't think that blowing up innocent men, women and children is the "right" thing to do. It certainly doesn't further the cause of Iraqii independence. In fact, it worsens it. The more they do it, the longer we have to stay and fight.

From James F Dunnigan's Strategy Page on Iraq:

The bombers have their fans, but most Iraqis see the bombers and their paymasters as the last vestige as Saddam's hated government. Given a chance, most Iraqis, even Sunni Arabs, will turn on Saddam's killers, or al Qaeda terrorists. While foreign media likes to describe these guys as "freedom fighters," Iraqis know better (so do most of the foreign journalists, but that's another story.) Sunni Arab and al Qaeda terrorists aren't interested in freedom, but the restoration of tyranny in Iraq.

mh

.

"The mouse does not know life until it is in the mouth of the cat."

[AlexCrowley 0]

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[
I wasn't talking about insurgents fighting for Iraqii independence from American influence. .

Iraqi fighers are not insurgents. If they were rebelling against Saddam (if there had been no war), yes. Fighting against an occupying military force, no.

TV's got them images, TV's got them all, nothing's shocking.

[JohnRich 4]

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>The more they do it, the longer we have to stay and fight.

Isn't that true of both terrorists and insurgents? Or do you forsee a day when we declare "most of the people we're figthing are insurgents, so it's time to leave?"

I don't think our departure is dependent upon the proportions of each. It depends upon whenever the new Iraqii forces are able to handle the problems themselves, regardless of which type they are.

[Mikki_ZH 0]

I think this war is not justified and I think the war is absolutely wrong.
I think this war is a crime.
This war started because Bush told everyone that they have Weapons of mass destructions in Iraq (but everyone knows this already…)
The situation of the country is a lot worse now then before. The problem of Sadam should have been solved in a different way.
This war has made the world a much unsafer place to live.
Because of Bush, a nation now lives terror way stronger than before.
But on the other side I have great respect of the solders that fight there. They risk there lives everyday to serve there country (it is not there fault that they are the victims of bad politics). They are the bottom of the food chain and it saddens me that so many died and so many are still going to die.
When I hear Bush talking on CNN and saying that he is proud of the solders that die over there and how they contributed to this country, I ask myself what he does. Did he know only one solder personally. What does he think when he sees the pictures of a car bombing with 50 dead on CNN? Bush started something he (or anybody) can not end.
He has no strategy (maybe I’m wrong and somebody can explain me the strategy).
The only thing that can happen is that the US votes for another President who decides to pull of the troops, as it is happening in Europe. The big loosers then will be the Iraqi people and the US solders who have died already or are cripples. But maybe Bush will visit them and give them an iron cross or something…
And after his presidency period he can earn more money with Middle East Oil.

Bottom line, I hope that show stops some day near but I don’t think it is possible.

Michi (#1068)
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