Kerry makes sense here

[Guest]

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More on that from Veterans for common sense

That site should be titled "Vietnam Veterans Against the Iraq War". Witness Daniel Ellsberg's call on this site for the Iraq version of his "Pentagon Papers". Talk about has-beens...

mh

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"The mouse does not know life until it is in the mouth of the cat."

[Ron 7]

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Please post a single link where Kerry, himself, called himself a war hero.

He didn't call himself a war hero...But

Here he sure is acting like it.

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A close associate hints: There's a secret compartment in Kerry's briefcase. He carries the black attaché everywhere. Asked about it on several occasions, Kerry brushed it aside. Finally, trapped in an interview, he exhaled and clicked open his case.

"Who told you?" he demanded as he reached inside. "My friends don't know about this."

The hat was a little mildewy. The green camouflage was fading, the seams fraying.

"My good luck hat," Kerry said, happy to see it. "Given to me by a CIA guy as we went in for a special mission in Cambodia."

Kerry put on the hat, pulling the brim over his forehead. His blue button-down shirt and tie clashed with the camouflage. He pointed his finger and raised his thumb, creating an imaginary gun.

Sounds like he is acting the part...

That line sounds like it was written for Rambo.

"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

[JohnRich 4]

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the number of our troops in Afghanistan has been decreasing. At this rate, there never WILL be an end date.

Eat your words:

"The Pentagon is moving elements of a supersecret commando unit from Iraq to the Afghanistan theater to step up the hunt for Osama bin Laden..."

Full Story

Can't be that supersecret now, can it? Sounds more like the PR machine in action.

The degree of secrecy is not the point. But we're used to you trying to deflect things from the true point...

And that true point was the irony of someone claiming that the effort in Afghanistan was being reduced, on the same day in which it was announced that it was being increased.

As for the "PR machine" comment; are you claiming that this story is a lie, and that these troops really aren't being transferred to Afghanistan?

[JohnRich 4]

Some claim President Bush shouldn't have started this war. They complain about his prosecution of it. One person recently claimed Bush was the worst president in U.S. history.

Let's clear up one point: We didn't start the war on terror. Try to remember. It was started by terrorists on 9/11. Let's look at the "worst" president and the mismanagement claims.

Franklin D. Roosevelt led us into World War II. Germany never attacked us... Japan did. From 1941-1945, 450,000 lives were lost, an average of 112,500 per year.

Harry S. Truman finished that war and started one in Korea. North Korea never attacked us. From 1950-1953, 55,000 lives were lost, an average of 18,333 per year.

John F. Kennedy started the Vietnam conflict in 1962. Vietnam never attacked us.

Lyndon B. Johnson turned Vietnam into a quagmire. From 1965-1975, 58,000 lives were lost, an average of 5,800 per year.

William J. Clinton went to war in Bosnia without UN or French consent. Bosnia never attacked us. Clinton went to war in Somalia without UN or French consent. Somalia never attacked us. He bombed an aspirin factory without UN or French consent. He was offered Osama bin Laden's head on a platter three times by Sudan and did nothing. Osama has attacked us on multiple occasions.

In the two years since terrorists attacked us, President Bush has liberated two countries, crushed the Taliban, crippled al-Qaeda, put nuclear inspectors in Lybia, Iran and North Korea without firing a shot, and captured a terrorist who slaughtered 300,000 of his own people. We have lost 500 soldiers, an average of 250 a year. George W. Bush did all this abroad while not allowing another terrorist attack at home.

I, for one, prefer it that way.

[PhillyKev 0]

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Let's clear up one point: We didn't start the war on terror. Try to remember. It was started by terrorists on 9/11.

**SIGH***

Once again...what does that have to do with Iraq?

[Ron 7]

Amen

"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

[PhillyKev 0]

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Franklin D. Roosevelt led us into World War II. Germany never attacked us... Japan did. From 1941-1945, 450,000 lives were lost, an average of 112,500 per year.

Germany declared war on us, they were also sinking our civilian merchant ships. They were also negotiating an invasion with Mexico.

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Harry S. Truman finished that war and started one in Korea. North Korea never attacked us. From 1950-1953, 55,000 lives were lost, an average of 18,333 per year.

We were supporting one of our allies. Just like Gulf War I was valid because we were doing the same thing there.

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Lyndon B. Johnson turned Vietnam into a quagmire. From 1965-1975, 58,000 lives were lost, an average of 5,800 per year.

LBJ was a freakin' moron....agree with you there.

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William J. Clinton went to war in Bosnia without UN or French consent. Bosnia never attacked us.

That was a NATO operation, we were required by int'l treaty to be involved with that. Instability in Bosnia directly effected the peace and security of our NATO allies.

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Clinton went to war in Somalia without UN or French consent. Somalia never attacked us.

That was a UN peace keeping operation that got out of control. Yep, huge mistake on his part.

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He was offered Osama bin Laden's head on a platter three times by Sudan and did nothing.

I hear that one liner all the time, have never seen any evidence of it being true (Although it may be).

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In the two years since terrorists attacked us, President Bush has liberated two countries,

I wouldn't call either of these completed tasks

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crushed the Taliban

They have been reforming and growing stronger over the past year.

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crippled al-Qaeda,

A message from Al-queda was televised today stating that attacks on the US are imminent.

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put nuclear inspectors in Lybia, Iran and North Korea without firing a shot,

You mean the UN inspectors? Thought they were impotent?

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We have lost 500 soldiers, an average of 250 a year.

500 soldiers have been killed. Somewhere between 11,000 and 22,000, depending on who's numbers you believe, have been lost due to wounds.

[Ron 7]

BillVon...Phillykev...got nothing to say about This?

You said you wanted proof he was acting like a war hero...Now you are both strangely quiet about it???

Thats funny.

"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

[PhillyKev 0]

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BillVon...Phillykev...got nothing to say about This?

You said you wanted proof he was acting like a war hero...Now you are both strangely quiet about it???

Thats funny.

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Asked about it on several occasions, Kerry brushed it aside. Finally, trapped in an interview,

Sounds to me like he was trying to be modest, but when pressed on the issue, was honest.

[Kennedy 0]

I had to take a deep breath before answering this.

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Germany declared war on us, they were also sinking our civilian merchant ships. They were also negotiating an invasion with Mexico.

FDR was shipping war maretiel on those ships. He was also demanding safe passage rights never granted in the naval warfare history before or since.

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Just like Gulf War I was valid because we were doing the same thing there.

So blood for oil is ok then, but not now? [yes, that is intentionally antagonistic and meant to be ironic]

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That was a NATO operation, we were required by int'l treaty to be involved with that. Instability in Bosnia directly effected the peace and security of our NATO allies.

Well, they never finished there, so why are you complaining about Dubya not being done in Afghanistan already? Did anyone from the former Yugoslav area ever really threaten a NATO ally? [honest quesiton, I've never heard about it but know it's possible]

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Clinton went to war in Somalia without UN or French consent. Somalia never attacked us.

That was a UN peace keeping operation that got out of control. Yep, huge mistake on his part.

No, his mistake was refusing to support the troops there, or allow big bore support. [see his refusal of tanks and artillery]

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offered bin Laden's head on a platter

I hear that one liner all the time, have never seen any evidence of it being true (Although it may be).

I don't have the link, but the Sudanese made the offer more than once, but it would've required backbone on Clinton's part. No polls will replace a spine. Hence the biggest financeer of terrorsm on the planet roams free.

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In the two years since terrorists attacked us, President Bush has liberated two countries

I wouldn't call either of these completed tasks

I would. He has removed the ruling bodies and begun providing and rebuilding. Just because we're not out yet doesn't mean we haven't removed the despots.

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A message from Al-queda was televised today stating that attacks on the US are imminent.

What else is new? Are republicans and democrats trading insults too?

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put nuclear inspectors in Lybia, Iran and North Korea without firing a shot,

You mean the UN inspectors? Thought they were impotent?

It helps when noncompliance carries a penalty.

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We have lost 500 soldiers, an average of 250 a year.

500 soldiers have been killed. Somewhere between 11,000 and 22,000, depending on who's numbers you believe, have been lost due to wounds.

Those are called casualties. I expect better from you Kev. You have any idea how large those nubmers are for the other conflicts listed here?

witty subliminal message
Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards.
1*

[Kennedy 0]

Kev, do you really believe he is not campaigning on the "I served, I'm a Vet, you have to love me" bit?

[edit]

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John Kerry: Hunter, Dreamer, Realist
Complexity Infuses Senator's Ambition

Sounds to me like the article couldn't have been more flattering if it tried. He was "trapped" could easily be "he had a plant in the crowd to bring it out when he wanted to." How many time did he supposedly brush it off? Now suddenly he wants a boost and bingo, lets pull out the camouflage.

witty subliminal message
Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards.
1*

[kallend 1,651]

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Some claim President Bush shouldn't have started this war. They complain about his prosecution of it. One person recently claimed Bush was the worst president in U.S. history.

Let's clear up one point: We didn't start the war on terror. Try to remember. It was started by terrorists on 9/11. Let's look at the "worst" president and the mismanagement claims.

Franklin D. Roosevelt led us into World War II. Germany never attacked us... Japan did. From 1941-1945, 450,000 lives were lost, an average of 112,500 per year.

.

Hitler declared war on the USA, December 12, 1941 in a speech to the Reichstag. Roosevelt did NOT declare war on Germany (neither did Congress).

You should stop believing those right wing web sites.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[Kennedy 0]

And you should know better than to act like FDR wasn't doing everything in his power to involve the US on the side of the Brits.

witty subliminal message
Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards.
1*

[PhillyKev 0]

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Kev, do you really believe he is not campaigning on the "I served, I'm a Vet, you have to love me" bit?

I believe that he has brought up his military service to appeal to those that it would appeal too. Not unlike GWB riding shot gun during a carrier landing in a flight suit.

Is that the crux or even a major part of his campaign? Not in the least.

[Kennedy 0]

So he's playing the war hero card. That only took about a dozen posts to bring out.

witty subliminal message
Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards.
1*

[SkydiverRick 0]

Sounds to me like he was trying to be modest, but when pressed on the issue, was honest.

[Kennedy 0]

So what is he, a sadist? He likes carrying around a reminder of "a very difficult and painful period in our nation's history?" [his words]

witty subliminal message
Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards.
1*

[PhillyKev 0]

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So what is he, a sadist? He likes carrying around a reminder of "a very difficult and painful period in our nation's history?" [his words]

I've heard Catholics like to wear crucifixes, too.

[panzwami 0]

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And not only that - HE VOTED FOR THE IRAQ WAR.

A little simplistic, don't you think? He voted to allow the president to use the military against Iraq as a last resort if UN inspections failed. Unfortunately, he, and the rest of those who voted for that (all but 2) believed Bush would actually live up to his end of the agreement and allow the UN to do its job.

Interesting position, but I think you may be mistaken. The resolution authorized the President to use force after *he* determined it was necessary. There is no stipluation that the President get approval to act; rather, it expressly said that he is the one who will determine when force becomes necessary.

(source: http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/z?d107:HJ00114:@@@L&summ2=m&)

kerry voted FOR this resolution, knowing full well how it was written. Either he was too stupid to read the bill before voting for it, or he agreed with what it said. For him now to stand up and criticize how the President used the authority that kerry himself allowed him to have, in my opinion, is sorely hypocritical. If he wants to stand on a pulpit and ramble about how badly he thinks Bush has handled things, he must first stand on the same pulpit and admit his own guilt.

Matt
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[Kennedy 0]

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So what is he, a sadist? He likes carrying around a reminder of "a very difficult and painful period in our nation's history?" [his words]

I've heard Catholics like to wear crucifixes, too.

Yeah, but you won't see too many Jews wearing them. [roman soldiers are just as good an example, but don't exist anymore]

Just remember he was the one talking about openning painful memories. [and you were the one saying he wasn't playing the war hero card]

witty subliminal message
Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards.
1*

[SkydiverRick 0]

Just remember he was the one talking about openning painful memories. [and you were the one saying he wasn't playing the war hero card]

[PhillyKev 0]

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[and you were the one saying he wasn't playing the war hero card]

Actually, what I said was I'd like to see where he's going around saying "I'm a war hero" since I've seen so many people on here quote him as saying that. I still don't see how this single incident, where someone pressured him to answer a question that he avoided in previous interviews is the same thing.

Edit to add....

And either way, I could give a rats ass. Ooohh.. I'm Kerry I was in Vietnam....ooohhhh, I'm Bush, I was a military pilot.

Honestly....couldn't give a shit either way. It's all campaign crap. I have no great love for Kerry, in fact, I'll probably be voting for Edwards in the primary. No great love for him either. Much hate for GWB, though. I hate everything he stands for, everything he's done, and everything he promises to do. I will vote for Satan before Bush.

[JohnRich 4]

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You should stop believing those right wing web sites.

You should stop presuming to know where my information came from, jumping to conclusions based upon those presumptions, and then trying to denigrate my reputation based upon your false assumptions.

[JohnRich 4]

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Yeah right...a war protester caring around a token of the good old days in Nam, burning villages and killing babies. Quite touching.

Isn't that quaint of the liberal democrats?

The same people that spit upon Vietnam Vets as they returned home, and branded them baby killers, now suddenly think that it's a wonderful thing that one of their own is a Vietnam Vet.

Go figure...

[PhillyKev 0]

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Isn't that quaint of the liberal democrats?

The same people that spit upon Vietnam Vets as they returned home, and branded them baby killers, now suddenly think that it's a wonderful thing that one of their own is a Vietnam Vet.

I was 2 years old...wasn't spitting on anyone.