FREE First Aid course specific to skydiving/PG - Feb 28, 2016; Newburyport, MA

[Anachronist 2]

Dopamine_Junkie

We carry basically that on ambulances. Big "trauma pads" that are just sterile absorbant pads to put pressure on the wounds. Things may have changed in the 3 years since I went to nursing so I can only speak from my past 21 years of experience as a medic. Over that time things changed rapidly and constantly, the reason we have continuing education requirements.

As for the person above you, I understand the scientific method and peer reviewed articles. After all I have Cell and Molecular Biology and Biochemistry degrees on top of the rest of my education. Were you in the US military and were you a medic? I work with several nurses that were army medics and navy corpman. You would be surprised at what they use in the field that is basically experimental. A significant portion of what paramedics use in the field today came from the military and their research because they deal with trauma like gunshot wounds on a regular basis. I could go several months without a GSW just because calls are random. We did not place anything in a wound forever. Then we tried some quick clot type interventions but the surgeons didn't approve because they have to dig it out of the wound trying to repair a bleed. Anyway, you keep steering this thread way off topic. None of this matters for a first aid class for people with no medical training. I mean do people get shot a lot at your DZ or something? This seems to be a case of you being insitent you are right because you searched for peer reviewed data. That's fine with me, I don't care. Go back to the topic.

Bone picking time, if you have 3 BS degrees and are working as a medic getting $12hr you sir are the most altruistic person I've ever met or a complete idiot.

I outlined my experience in detail for the purpose of allowing people to understand my perception and limitations, please read the preceding threads before commenting.

Thirdly, I am right, because scientific data is the only thing that can be presented as "evidence." "I talked to a bunch of people," hell even "I've done this for 40 years" is worthless. A single person's experience is absolutely irrelevant. If you don't understand the statistical implications of that then you need to go back to school. Thats why I sparingly mention my personal experience and refer to established training and scientific literature. I don't care if you have a PhD in every biological science, without scientific literature to back it up, your opinion is worthless. You should know that if you have 3 BS degrees.

Fourthly, sorry, I went straight to tampon because maxi-pad seemed so blatantly obvious that I never considered it part of the question. It is like asking "so you can break a window with a rock, can you also break a window with a stone, or perhaps a brick?" Yes, you can use whatever you want to try and stop bleeding via the direct pressure route, cleaner is better.

Lastly, this is on topic because someone asked if you could use "women's sanitary products" which I wrongly interpreted as tampons, to stop bleeding. There is a massive misnomer that this is a great idea among the general public. I felt it necessary to dispel that with the most authoritative and complete means possible, scientific literature. You also made an incredibly inaccurate assumption about the effectiveness of XStat, which you don't seem to appreciate, though you should if you have the education you claim and it is not horribly outdated.

[Dopamine_Junkie 0]

Well, medics never got paid $12 bucks an hour anywhere I worked. I made $27 an hour when I first started. The last 5 years I was a medic in the field I was a flight paramedic and made substantially more. If you read my posts you would see where I said I am an ICU nurse and I also work in the ER when I get floated, due to my experience. Imagine that. I make even more now. I work in a level 1 trauma center in one of the biggest cities in this country so I have the experience to back up what I said. If you can't find the research it is because you are not looking in the right place. The thing I don't think you get is the last step for FDA approval of anything is testing it on humans, in the field in the case of emergency medical equipment. For instance, I used the King Airway in the field for at least a year before it was approved for use in the US.

And look, I won't put up with your little backhanded comments, such as the $12 an hour bullshit insult about paramedics. I am a licensed paramedic in my state and that requires a 4 year degree for a reason. It only took 2 years to bridge to RN and get my BSN so why not do it. It's a lot more money and a lot safer. And it lead to me starting CRNA school this fall. Call me an idiot to my face over a trivial discussion about first aid and you are going to get bitch slapped. So you can question what I said all you like thinking that googling for research somehow overrides the real life experience of people in the medical field. Sometimes I work through an agency at a very well respected research hospital. I think you would be surprised at how much goes on there that hasn't been published yet because they are still doing research and collecting data. You can try to dismiss what those of us that actually work in the medical field have been exposed to, but you aren't right. And that seems to be what this is really about. You have some childish need to be "right" constantly. I bet you are a real pleasure to deal with in real life.

It really blows my mind that you think you are an expert on the subject of gunshot wounds yet you are absolutely clueless as to why you would want to use a product like XSTAT on a wound in the groin or armpit. I mean there are just major vessels that run through those areas and you can bleed out in minutes. There is not a good reason to use it on the core of the body. Why? Well you aren't going to stick it in the chest where the lungs are. That has an entirely different treatment of placing an occlusive dressing to reinflate the lung. If you develop a tension pneumo with that dressing in place you just release one side and you have a nice flutter valve. Or you can decompress the chest with a needle if there is no wound in the case of blunt force trauma. You get a nice new chest tube when you hit the ER. You aren't going to stick it in the major vessels of the core anyway for reasons that should be obvious to anyone with any medical training. You get hit dead center chest you are dead. Hit in the heart is fatal. Hit in the aorta, fatal. You arent going to stick it in the abdomen because it's a cavity that just fills up with blood. There is not any tissue that could adequately hold the material in this device in place and create pressure as it expands. And guess who the first people where that used XSTAT. The military. And you probably won't find any peer reviewed papers about anything the military does that is otherwise unapproved for the civilian population.

So you keep looking for research so that you can tell everyone how right you are while we are wrong even though we use these items. I know in nursing our theory changes when direct observation of patients dictates that we make a change in the best interest of all patients. We will keep saving lives in the field and in hospitals with devices that you want to argue about on a skydiving forum. FFS.

http://www.fda.gov/NewsEvents/Newsroom/PressAnnouncements/ucm475810.htm

http://www.emsworld.com/press_release/12147852/revmedx-announces-fda-clearance-for-xstat-for-use-on-civilian-population

And by the way snopes says you are wrong about tampon use in the military. It may not be used today, but it has been used in the past. I agree it is a bad idea, but you can't argue with medics and soldiers that actually used them in combat. You could us a pad alone to put pressure on a wound if you had nothing else.

http://www.snopes.com/military/tampon.asp
Tampons have been used by U.S. Army medics as emergency wound care dressings: True.

It's funny that you think you are "authoritatively" stamping down "misinformation" when you are completely and absolutely wrong. Just imagine you are a Marine patrolling the hellhole that Afghanistan is and you get shot. You might have a medic close by with an XSTAT that saves you from bleeding out waiting on the medivac. Or you may not have a medic anywhere near you. Without a doubt I would stick a tampon in the wound if I had one instead of just deciding to bleed to death waiting for help.

Edited for spelling.

[riggerrob 558]

Please edit out the phrase about "bitch-slapping" your poorly-informed corespondent.

Otherwise an excellent update for "our friend."
Thanks for providing historical perspective on how tampons were once fashionable for marines fighting in Afghanistan. Based on your anecdote, I still think it is a good habit to carry a few spare tampons and sanitary napkins in any first aid kit, because they are dual-use bandages. Tampons being most valuable for puncture wounds (e.g. gunshot) while sanitary napkins are good for applying pressure to shallow wounds.

I especially enjoyed your brief explanation of the "field trials" of new medical procedures.

[riggerrob 558]

Bump!
How do modern first widgets handle asthma attacks, allergy attacks, panic attacks and other breathing disorders?

[DrDom 0]

Asthma: hopefully someone has their inhaler with them. Certainly this should be a "prevention" issue otherwise its keep them calm, keep them comfortable, and get an ambulance.

Good news is we have more and more interest over time! Looks like this will be a great showing.

if anyone else interested message me! Feel free to share it, we will make it fun!

You are not the contents of your wallet.