BMAC615

People can express it however they want regardless of what you think.

Call UPT and give them the model# and they should be able to assist you with pack volume estimate.

It was clear. I tried to shut it down at Post #28 and again at #39, but, I’ll stand by my point that the issue is bigger than just @nwt and storing lines.

LOL - You haven’t.

Okay.

Hook knife the offending steering line and land w/ rears is an option. I know during BASE canopy skills progression, landing w/ one toggle and one rear is a must-have skill. Having all these skills (and more) in your toolbox before moving to high performance canopies may save your life. Had he followed @billvon’s checklist on EACH canopy that he flew during his progression, the outcome could have been different. That’s not even the issue here. The issue is he’s flying a high performance canopy at a WL of 1.35 and has never landed on rears - regardless of whether he would have done it in this case - it highlighted the fact that maybe his “canopy progression” outstripped his “piloting progression.” “Safety & Training Advisors spend a considerable amount of time telling people they shouldn’t be loading their canopies so heavily. But 90 percent of the time, jumpers don’t listen. Skydivers can have a bit of an ego, and many simply hear, “I think you’re a crappy canopy pilot who can’t handle a smaller wing.” So they downsize anyway and break their legs, backs and pelvises with some regularity.” I like this story that’s in the original post, but, not in the article: “A few years back I met up with Brett, one of the people I'd been lecturing to whle I was an S+TA. He told me that he wished he'd listened to me back then. He had broken his femur during a botched landing, been out of the sport for a while, and then came back and really learned to fly his canopy. He took a canopy control course and actually upsized to get more performance out of his canopy. He ended up coming in first in one of the events at the PST that year.“

This is exactly the point of my bringing it up: You are not willing to recognize that this $2,500 mistake could have been avoided had you followed a different path during your “Canopy Progression.” Instead, you are blaming an oversight of the way your toggle was stowed. There sort of is a canopy downsizing handbook and @billvon wrote it. Pay special attention to #7. The downsizing checklist in short The short version of the list is below. Before people downsize they should be able to: Flat turn 90 degrees at 50 feet Flare turn at least 45 degrees Land crosswind and in no wind Land reliably within a 10-meter circle Initiate a high-performance landing with double front risers and front riser turn to landing Land on slight uphills and downhills Land with rear risers https://uspa.org/Portals/0/files/misc_downsizechecklist.pdf

I’m certainly not the only one who believes landing on rears as an emergency procedure is an important skill to develop - and that you should develop this skill on a beginner canopy w/ a low WL. Please recognize I’m not throwing anything in your face and if it feels like that, please know it is not my intention. I started this discussion with saying I recognize the timing and how this might be interpreted and that my intent is to help you gain some broader understanding. If you are suggesting I’m criticizing you for making certain financial decisions over your safety decisions, that is not the case. Please understand that none of what I have written has been with the intent to criticize, but, to help you understand what you could have done differently so you might not wind up in the same situation in the future and/or so you can better advise others to not make the same mistakes you have.

I mean ignore a learning moment and lacking self-awareness. You ordered a new container based on an aggressive downsizing schedule. You then asked lots of experienced people what their opinion on what size reserve you should put in it and several very experienced people said stick with the OP 143. You decided to sell your OP 143 and buy a used PDR 126 so you could take the difference and buy an AAD. Not a bad decision, but, you also rationalized the decision by saying you planned to rent a PDR 126 and jump it as a main to get used to it before flying it. You didn’t. Those decisions you made a long time ago contributed to you cutting away at such a high altitude (you wrote that you wanted to get comfortable with the 126). You then downsized from a Katana 150 to a Katana 135 without really learning everything that that parachute can do. You don’t believe your decisions were in conflict with what Shannon Pilcher said in the video beginning at 1:20, “people who are watching you on the ground should see you land and think ... he can do anything that that parachute is capable of doing ... [that] should be the litmus test whether or not I should be considering downsizing or switching models or not.” You didn’t. Your decision to downsize, again, without ever landing using only rears contributed to you cutting away. I seriously doubt Curt has an opinion that deviates very far from Shannon and Jason Moledzki, What I’m suggesting is your $2,500 mistake wasn’t just pulling on your toggle without noticing the excess line looping around. That cutaway started with your decision to be on an aggressive downsizing schedule. Regardless of Curt’s opinion or your opinion, the fact is your decisions during the months or years leading up to that moment to cut away contributed.

Okay, you do you.

This is something I hadn’t thought of: taking a couple wraps and landing with rears. Obviously cheaper than replacing a line. I had considered practicing leaving a brake stowed and landing one rear and one toggle. I might practice you method in good conditions as well - thanks!

I’m just suggesting that the outcome is the end result of a series of decisions you made long before the toggle got pulled through the excess line. Here’s what Shannon Pilcher says and I’m pretty sure Curt has a similar opinion. Again, you did the right thing in that particular situation based on the circumstances you faced. I’m just trying to drive home the idea that REALLY dialing in your skills on a lower performance canopy w/ a WL < 1.1 is something I highly recommend.

Are you suggesting Curt Bartholomew believes flying a reserve no smaller than a canopy size you are highly proficient in landing AND becoming highly proficient on a canopy w/ a WL no higher than 1.1 - including learning to land on rears - is unstable and dangerous and that downsizing to a WL >1.1 before learning high performance landing techniques is a bad idea?

So, uh, I recognize that this may not be the best time to bring this up, and how it’s going to be interpreted, but, uh, may I suggest that this $2,500 mistake started when you bought a Katana 135? Like, had you stayed on a lower WL for your main and reserve longer and really learned how to fly a larger canopy, including learning to land on rears, this could have been a different outcome? Also, I recall discussing choosing a reserve size. I’m only bringing this up because it’s sort of a thing that we’ve discussed in the past. Not to rub salt in the wound, but, to help you understand why I have the viewpoint that I have.

Different enough to be dangerous to land with one cut and one not cut? (Provided the pilot has experience landing with rears only)

You landed safely, so, you did the right thing :-)

Would a hook knife to the locked steering line and landing with both rears have been an option?

Okay, cool - that’s right in line what my thinking. I just needed a little confirmation bias :)

I know you didn’t ask this, but, I highly recommend you reconsider using a 9-cell for wingsuit jumps. They are fine when everything goes right and not fine when everything goes wrong. If you’re going to buy a new canopy, might as well get the right tool for the job.

I decided to change a little bit of the audio related to Angle Jumps to better clarify an appropriate progression: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4ZqKeQDnSg

Yes, I referenced it in post #28 as an article in Parachutist. Thanks!

And, maybe you’re right. I’ve been wrong in the past and I’ll be wrong in the future, so, the chances of my being wrong right now is pretty high.

I wouldn’t mind seeing someone begin doing proximity flying and straight in front riser approaches and even 60-90* carving front riser turns to fronts on a Silhouette or Pulse @ a WL of 1 before moving to a Sabre @ 1.

@faulknerwn and/or @wmw999 What’s your recommended progression path for someone wanting to get into CRW? I looked at the threads in CRW Forum, but, they are a little old. What canopy do you start with and what WL? When do you move them to a WL of 1.3? Let’s say they show up to their FJC and the AFFI says, “Why are you here?” And the student says, “I saw a video of people doing canopy formations and I want to do that.” What would you tell them to expect to do from jump zero all the way to being able to be on some CRW Big Ways (9-way diamonds+).