autoset 0 #1 February 4, 2007 Hello guys, just a quick noob question, what are the basic differences between Square canopies and Round canopies? Apart from the obvious steering hability. Are there any important differences that makes one safer than the other? For example having a streamer malfunction, a round canopy would slow you down a lot more I suppose, things like that. Also RAM-Air canopies is the same thing as Square canopies?(Please attach a picture of each type of canopy if it's not much to ask) Sorry for asking such noob question but I'm from Europe and I want to learn the correct definitions in English too. Thank you & blue skies! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
waltappel 1 #2 February 4, 2007 QuoteHello guys, just a quick noob question, what are the basic differences between Square canopies and Round canopies? Apart from the obvious steering hability. Are there any important differences that makes one safer than the other? For example having a streamer malfunction, a round canopy would slow you down a lot more I suppose, things like that. Also RAM-Air canopies is the same thing as Square canopies?(Please attach a picture of each type of canopy if it's not much to ask) Sorry for asking such noob question but I'm from Europe and I want to learn the correct definitions in English too. Thank you & blue skies! This is a very odd question these days. Please post the *real* reason why you want to know. Walt Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,435 #3 February 4, 2007 Round canopies are . . . round, and work by generating a lot of drag. This slows your descent. Square canopies begin operating by drag, but quickly develop forward speed and start generating lift to move forward through the air. This makes them more versatile as they can glide long distances and their speed of descent can be increased (to get down faster) or decreased (for landing.) >Are there any important differences that makes one safer than the other? Rounds are simpler, and a round with anti-inversion netting and a free sleeve is almost bulletproof. Squares land you more softly and let you choose your landing area (an important safety consideration.) Both are 'safer' under different conditions. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
autoset 0 #4 February 4, 2007 Thanks for the info! Just one more thing, when you guys talk about 'taking the brakes' right after deployment, you mean lowering the toggles to start steering the canopy right? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Pulse 0 #5 February 4, 2007 I don't know if one is exactly 'safer' than the other. Like everything else, it depends what it's use is. There are still plenty of applications for round canopies."Any language where the unassuming word fly signifies an annoying insect, a means of travel, and a critical part of a gentleman's apparel is clearly asking to be mangled." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jakee 1,260 #6 February 4, 2007 QuoteThanks for the info! Just one more thing, when you guys talk about 'taking the brakes' right after deployment, you mean lowering the toggles to start steering the canopy right? The brake toggles are 'set' with a certain amount of input to aid the inflation of the canopy and help it behave. when you unstow the brakes the canopy can go into 'full flight' and you can start using the toggles for steering. All these questions would be answered much better with a visit to your local DZ. It is very difficult to describe specific gear functions to someone who has never been shown a rig close up, and you are doing yourself a disservice by asking us to do so.Do you want to have an ideagasm? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
michalm21 0 #7 February 5, 2007 QuoteQuoteIt is very difficult to describe specific gear functions to someone who has never been shown a rig close up yeah, he claims he finished aff a few days ago... go figure Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites dorbie 0 #8 February 5, 2007 Some estimate that rounds are safer by an order of magnitude, the malfunction rate on a round with an anti-inversion skirt is something like 1 in 10,000, the malfunction rate with ram-air parachutes is 10-20 times that rate. Other things can go wrong on a skydive for example higher descent rates on rounds mandate a good PLF, and ram-airs give you better control of where you land if you have the right skills within a larger envelope of distance & conditions. You do the math, it really depends what you mean by safer. It's not a decision you have to make, every sports jumper jumps ram-air designs, with a very rare jump of a round and those tend not to have the anti-inversion skirt the military use which probably levels the safety playing field anyway. Toggles = brakes, call them brake toggles if you want to be pedantic. A square canopy is a type of ram air canopy. Ram-air refers to a self inflating parafoil with holes in the nose to facilitate inflation into a functioning wing through the movement of air into the inlets, driven by the motion of the canopy through the air. Square canopies are ram-air designs which tend to be rectangular in planform with four right angled corners. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites autoset 0 #9 February 5, 2007 Thank you for the info! Yes I did finish my AFF a few days ago, and sorry for the stupid question but I want to have clear in my mind exactly what you call Ram-Air, Square, Round and Brakes in the English language, better look stupid than be death. Thanks again! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites michalm21 0 #10 February 9, 2007 I really don't want to bash you - shit I only have a few jumps and still learning, but look at all your posts, man. It is scary to read some things you write. It almost seems like yo are forcing yourself to overcome fear to continue the sport and it's not the way to go. Why can't you talk to your instructors? Edited to add: And go jump already!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Ms.sofaking 0 #11 February 9, 2007 [Quote I want to have clear in my mind exactly what you call Ram-Air, Square, Round and Brakes in the English language, better look stupid than be death. Do you think if you don't know what we call Ram-air, square, and brakes in the English language you will die?If so, those are the same words we use."I'm not sure how it's going to turn out, except I'll die in the end, she said. So what could really go wrong? -----Brian Andreas Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. Display as a link instead × Your previous content has been restored. Clear editor × You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL. Insert image from URL × Desktop Tablet Phone Submit Reply 0
dorbie 0 #8 February 5, 2007 Some estimate that rounds are safer by an order of magnitude, the malfunction rate on a round with an anti-inversion skirt is something like 1 in 10,000, the malfunction rate with ram-air parachutes is 10-20 times that rate. Other things can go wrong on a skydive for example higher descent rates on rounds mandate a good PLF, and ram-airs give you better control of where you land if you have the right skills within a larger envelope of distance & conditions. You do the math, it really depends what you mean by safer. It's not a decision you have to make, every sports jumper jumps ram-air designs, with a very rare jump of a round and those tend not to have the anti-inversion skirt the military use which probably levels the safety playing field anyway. Toggles = brakes, call them brake toggles if you want to be pedantic. A square canopy is a type of ram air canopy. Ram-air refers to a self inflating parafoil with holes in the nose to facilitate inflation into a functioning wing through the movement of air into the inlets, driven by the motion of the canopy through the air. Square canopies are ram-air designs which tend to be rectangular in planform with four right angled corners. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
autoset 0 #9 February 5, 2007 Thank you for the info! Yes I did finish my AFF a few days ago, and sorry for the stupid question but I want to have clear in my mind exactly what you call Ram-Air, Square, Round and Brakes in the English language, better look stupid than be death. Thanks again! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
michalm21 0 #10 February 9, 2007 I really don't want to bash you - shit I only have a few jumps and still learning, but look at all your posts, man. It is scary to read some things you write. It almost seems like yo are forcing yourself to overcome fear to continue the sport and it's not the way to go. Why can't you talk to your instructors? Edited to add: And go jump already!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ms.sofaking 0 #11 February 9, 2007 [Quote I want to have clear in my mind exactly what you call Ram-Air, Square, Round and Brakes in the English language, better look stupid than be death. Do you think if you don't know what we call Ram-air, square, and brakes in the English language you will die?If so, those are the same words we use."I'm not sure how it's going to turn out, except I'll die in the end, she said. So what could really go wrong? -----Brian Andreas Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
