pek771

Dan, not being a pilot, I assume you speak of the ball the pilots look at which tells what the aircraft is doing relative to the horizon? Like, banking, diving, etc? So, what does lost 3 or 4 on the ADI mean? I suppose it has to be more obvious for me.

Thank you, Farflung. That was easier to manipulate than SkyVector. A few things are puzzling to me (well, to almost everyone, actually): Why have no remnants been found, except for some money and the stair placard? If one considers the deployed but died theory, then someone would have found his body, or some remnants. This would be a hard secret to keep for 40 years. If DBC were a no pull and went into a body of water or soft ground, then there is a possibility the evidence may still remain buried...see dredging ops on the Columbia. Hard to imagine that nothing would have floated to a surface and not been noticed. Suppose DBC bailed in the flatlands on the southern end of V-23 before the turn to port towards Reno? After reading so much of this thread, it seems to me that EVERYONE is convinced DBC went out at the point of the pressure bump. The entire scenario of going out up in the back country near the Columbia is predicated on the popping of the flight engineers ears during the simulation and sled drop tests. If the aircraft was unpressurized, and the stairs suddenly closed, why should that have such an effect...this effect is analogous to using a toilet plunger, with the aft stair as the plunger. I have trouble with this from a fluid mechanics standpoint. And, the stairs were DOWN when 305 landed, correct? So, why couldn't have DBC left near Red Bluff? No one saw anything. He walks away with the money, and no one finds anything because everyone is looking in the wrong spot. And the copilot seemed to want to shake DBC from the aircraft with a vengance. He did indeed want to kill Cooper.

Its not that you dont know these answers. Its that you dont know that you know. Donald Rumsfeld! Where have you been? Anyone know if 305 took V-23 all the way to Reno?

377: Read Einstein's Clocks and Poincare's Maps: Empires of Time. I would never knock the great minds of science. I only mention the Conjecture as it is somewhat analogous to DBC case...there is a solution, just not very obvious. I can't remember the five bridges puzzle. Your wife probably knows it.

Mr. Elf: Thoughtful postings on your part. You are to be commended. Sincerely. Some of us come here for the entertainment: a case with zero facts, other than a man gets cash and chutes and exits aircraft unseen. No useful evidence to the solution of the crime. Opinions, suspects, common sense distorted by all but a few. How can this be anything but entertaining? At least more entertaining than, say, Poincare's Conjecture.

The "pressure bump" is the sole determining factor of where Cooper jumped, in the estimation of practically everyone. FBI tests with the sled "verified" this to the FBI. So, my question is thus: Does pressure bump equal bailout point? For those skeptics, Cooper could have jumped on the way into Reno at a lower altitude, for all we know.

Somewhere a while back I mentioned something about the seeming co-inky-dink of Marla's coming out and Gray's book release. On the evening Cooper pirated NWA 305, we were in NYC watching the J. Geils Band. In one of their songs, released much later, is the infamous line, "say Don, there sure is something familiar about that bowling ball". Much like the latest psychic to grace these pages.

Jerry, are you saying the FBI is throwing in the towel? Did they just realize there is no evidence, and any evidence that does exist is refutable? Somewhere, Cooper laughs.

I sure hope some recorded $20 bills show up at the Ariel gathering. Wouldn't that be something?

Travel on a bus? Leave zero evidence? Ted Kaczynski!!

Farflung, you are extremely reasonable. I think the physical match, either DNA or fingerprints, are still trumped by a $20. DNA can still cast a shadow of doubt (see Orenthal James Simpson), and the eyewitness testimony needs to be very solid upon recollection to carry weight. It would still not resolve all controversy, nor render absolute judgement in the court of public opinion. The bearer of a $20, with almost any accompanying story, would make that story real and tangible. My guess is that at least one $20 still exists, somewhere.

hangdiver, you are absolutely spot on with that. I've had MRI's and CT scans, after which the technicians say "you know, you have this little piece of metal in your hand". I still have one old fatigue shirt in the closet, and I'll bet it has a chip somewhere!

Drill press is another option. I was a machinist when I was a GI, and my experience was the drill presses tend to make those more stringy looking chips with less curl to them. But, regardless of the actual machine, I agree completely...WTF is a guy with a tie doing in a machine shop? I still to this day, years after being a machinist, wear no jewlery. But, I'm sure there were guys in the 60's that used to wear those ties in the shops. I suppose they were likely the engineers or the QC guys. If Coopers tie indeed had this chip attached to it, it definitely came from a machine shop somewhere. Wait, he was an engineer at Boeing, got laid off from the 727 program, and said "I'll show them!" And, he left the tie behind as a calling card! We have all been duped for 40 years!

That was probably made by cutting round stock on a lathe. It is a very common looking chip. Al-Mg is a common aircraft alloy. Of course, the relative amounts of the alloying elements will determine its final use. It is also a common alloy in VW engine cases and transaxle housings, and earlier Porsche engine and transaxles. These applications are likely the 5xxx series alloys, which are wrought. Strong, durable and lightweight and relatively inexpensive. Not as good as titanium. It may have been made by a milling machine, which is the only other possibility. Once upon a time, men wore shirts and ties to golf in. Imagine that. Double Windsor knot.

Yes, and ladies can be further impressed when you tell them you have titanium balls! As in golf balls. Seems there is a very small amount used in the binding agents which hold those elastic-y little buggers together. Possibly no more than 20 ATOMS per ball. But, it's Titanium, direct from the Space Age. If we could do cancer research as well as we market, tumors would be a thing of the past. When I tell people I have some 7075 T-6 in the garage, their legs get rubbery. The mere mention of Inconel-X causes sweating.

I would ask Stubby Kaye. Silently. Two syllables. Sounds like... Anyone machining titanium is making exotic aircraft parts. That is the worst stuff to work with. Hellish to machine. Mr. F, I would go with your original instinct; Death Knot, although I have only seen that used with thinner material, like dental floss (unwaxed, of course).

I clearly saw the image of Evel Kinevel in that chute. DNA will include or exclude persons, period. If a sample of LD Cooper DNA is brought for matching, it is supposedly not a full or partial match. If a sample of Tom Kaye is brought forward, he may be a match, depending on the integrity of the sample. If Tom Kaye is not a match, then the sample must be concluded to be inconclusive. But, in the perfect Crimestoppers world, Tom Kaye could be DB Cooper. In fact, any person known to have touched those lines should be a positive match. So, could Tom Kaye be convicted of the crime? Probably not, as he doesn't fit the eyewitness description. Thus, DNA cannot be the sole determinant of Cooper identity. But, the DNA is valuable. Maybe that's why Carr wore latex gloves?

From Wikipedia...sources unverified In the 1980 presidential election, PATCO (along with the Teamsters and the Air Line Pilots Association) refused to back President Jimmy Carter, instead endorsing Republican Party candidate Ronald Reagan. PATCO's refusal to endorse the Democratic Party stemmed in large part from poor labor relations with the FAA (the employer of PATCO members) under the Carter administration and Ronald Reagan's endorsement of the union and its struggle for better conditions during the 1980 election campaign.[4][5] http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qlbEn6KPMN0

Takes only one passenger to say "Enough. I am getting off now." And, then head for the exit, and follow the instructions printed in big red letters regarding emergency egress.

You can't fight in here. This is the War Room!

I read most of the many pages as was suggested. There are very few facts, no prints, no DNA. Raleigh butts are missing. The only evidence is some money dredged up in the Columbia. It really could have been anyone. Providing no "new" old evidence shows up, the only thing that will satisfy the masses curiosity is some more of the money. Just one twenty will do.

Bruce, Looks like you answered your question here. Good work at it, BTW!

It is really not important to the overall case. It has provided countless numbers of posts on this forum regarding the specifics of the chutes. It is important, IMO, that this information is being rehashed due to stuff Gray seems to have sole access to. It seems that lately, many "new" things have appeared right around the time Gray's book has come out...such as the parachutes, Marla Cooper, previously unheard of FBI material...Gray is either a well connected researcher, or a very clever marketer. Speaking of which, how are his book sales?

Bruce, the point of my prior post was that there seems to be ambiguous information from Cossey. This is because Gray seemingly has dredged up "previously unreleased" information regarding Cossey's original statements. I may certainly be wrong about this, but there seems to be no public knowledge of exactly what Cossey told the FBI in his first interview.

I agrre with you Bruce. Rather than say, "I think", I am going to look around and see if I can find just what was said by Cossey to the FBI. Since there seems to be an ongoing discussion of the parachutes, the seeming answer is no one, even Cossey knows what they were.