FrEaK_aCcIdEnT 0 #1 February 12, 2010 I know that someone likes to stall canopies as much as I do...I'm looking to do at least a hop-n-pop this weekend at my home DZ on my new Pilot 140. How does the Pilot compare to the Sabre 2 when stalled. I'm talking bow-tie, holding it, rocking back and riding it for a bit. Is it as stable? more stable? Or less stable? I know... only one way to find out, but I am wanting others first hand views as well. Any input is much appreciated!!! ExPeCt ThE uNeXpEcTeD! DoNt MiNd ThE tYpOs, Im LaZy On CoRrEcTiOnS! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mjosparky 3 #2 February 12, 2010 No canopy is stable when it is stalled to the point of folding up. It is no longer flying it is a bait ball. Make sure to do it up high. While it “bow tied” the pilot chute might just end up where you don’t want it. SparkyMy idea of a fair fight is clubbing baby seals Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
FrEaK_aCcIdEnT 0 #3 February 12, 2010 I never stall below my decision altitude. I understand that getting the canopy to stall is a unstable thing. But once you have rocked back under it and descend straight down it is for the most part stable as long as you hold it. True it isn't flying in the sense that there isn't any control over direction. The wind takes you like a round. My question was more on the lines of...... During the initial stalling, and recovery phases of the stall, is the Pilot more or less stable than a Sabre2? Thank you for making me aware of the pilot chute issue. I haven't encountered it before, but I will keep an eye out for it! Edit: Wanted to add that if I am missing something else that you can think, of or anyone else can think of, let me know. I appreciate all the input I can get. ExPeCt ThE uNeXpEcTeD! DoNt MiNd ThE tYpOs, Im LaZy On CoRrEcTiOnS! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rstanley0312 0 #4 February 12, 2010 Quote I never stall below my decision altitude. I understand that getting the canopy to stall is a unstable thing. But once you have rocked back under it and descend straight down it is for the most part stable as long as you hold it. True it isn't flying in the sense that there isn't any control over direction. The wind takes you like a round. My question was more on the lines of...... During the initial stalling, and recovery phases of the stall, is the Pilot more or less stable than a Sabre2? Thank you for making me aware of the pilot chute issue. I haven't encountered it before, but I will keep an eye out for it! Edit: Wanted to add that if I am missing something else that you can think, of or anyone else can think of, let me know. I appreciate all the input I can get. I think it is a good idea to know your stall point and to practice it up high at the same time.... BE CAREFUL. You may just induce a situation that requires a chop. Life is all about ass....either you're kicking it, kissing it, working it off, or trying to get a piece of it. Muff Brother #4382 Dudeist Skydiver #000 www.fundraiseadventure.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
davelepka 4 #5 February 12, 2010 As long as you enter and depart from stalls with smooth inputs, balanced from a left/right perspective, you should be fine. It's an imbalance in inputs, or sudden 'panic' inputs that will get you in trouble. As far as making a comparison, there is none. If your new canopy is smaller, it will stall at a higher speed, and the stall will break and recover faster than your old one. This should be common sense, however, because a smaller canopy will do everything faster then a larger one, that's the whole point of a smaller canopy. Much like anything with a new canopy, explore the performance in a slow and methodical manner. Don't just honk down on the toggles and garbage the canopy the first time out, work the stall point and see how the canopy flies just at/over the limit. Work your way up to a full bow tie. In addition to watching your altitude during stall manuvers, check your airspace. Not in front of you but below and behind. You'll be going more or less straight down, and right into the path of a jumper flying below and behind you. Also keep in mind that you will be dumping altitude like crazy, so you need to check several hundred feet below and behind before you begin. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rstanley0312 0 #6 February 12, 2010 Quote As long as you enter and depart from stalls with smooth inputs, balanced from a left/right perspective, you should be fine. It's an imbalance in inputs, or sudden 'panic' inputs that will get you in trouble. As far as making a comparison, there is none. If your new canopy is smaller, it will stall at a higher speed, and the stall will break and recover faster than your old one. This should be common sense, however, because a smaller canopy will do everything faster then a larger one, that's the whole point of a smaller canopy. Much like anything with a new canopy, explore the performance in a slow and methodical manner. Don't just honk down on the toggles and garbage the canopy the first time out, work the stall point and see how the canopy flies just at/over the limit. Work your way up to a full bow tie. In addition to watching your altitude during stall manuvers, check your airspace. Not in front of you but below and behind. You'll be going more or less straight down, and right into the path of a jumper flying below and behind you. Also keep in mind that you will be dumping altitude like crazy, so you need to check several hundred feet below and behind before you begin. Good stuff Dave!Life is all about ass....either you're kicking it, kissing it, working it off, or trying to get a piece of it. Muff Brother #4382 Dudeist Skydiver #000 www.fundraiseadventure.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
FrEaK_aCcIdEnT 0 #7 February 12, 2010 Thanks for the input! i will explore the canopy before I start getting to full bow-tie! Always looking before performing maneuvers is common sense that you would hope people would know, but never hurts to make sure! Great Stuff! ExPeCt ThE uNeXpEcTeD! DoNt MiNd ThE tYpOs, Im LaZy On CoRrEcTiOnS! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kkeenan 13 #8 February 12, 2010 While you're up there, try some rear riser stalls. This gives a little different stall entry than steering lines, and seems more stable if you hold it in the stall. Also good for getting a feel in case you are making a rear riser landing for some reason. Definitely do it at an altitude you wouldn't mind cutting away at.Kevin K. _____________________________________ Dude, you are so awesome... Can I be on your ash jump ? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
