pkasdorf

I'm one of those who would not jump without an AAD. Not jumping with a fully functional AAD is simply increasing the risk one takes by skydiving. This is absolutely non-controversial.

What is controversial is if everybody should jump with one and if it should be mandatory. I think it should but I accept the "freedom to choose" argument, particularly because in not having an AAD you do not put others in danger.

Concerning the hook knife for CRW, please correct me if I am wrong since I do not do CRW: Can you get into a situation where you get entangled with a partner and a hook knife could help liberating both?

If it is so it should be mandatory because you may be affecting others than yourself.

Having been married myself twice, I understand that kind of risky activity...

Cheers!!

OK, , I took the deep breath. But I still do not know if you consider it safer than other risky sports or not....

Good idea!

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Scotty's Vote = NO (not safe)
Tamie's Vote = NO (not safe)
I dare all of you as instructors or gonna be / wanna be instructors...those of you who want to make a living at this and to be held accountable for others to say "THIS IS A SAFE SPORT"!!! I double dare you! I want to hear how you answer an injured parties family when they ask "you told me it was safe go ahead and jump". Better have a GOOD Lawyer Get real people we are jumping out of airplanes!
Before every jump both of us (scotty and myself) understand its NOT a safe activity and we could quite possibly GO-IN.
Understanding and Respecting the fact that what we do is NOT safe is what makes us conscientious skydivers.
Respect what you doing and dont under estimate it!
The verbage and warning labels that are plastered on our gear is just there because its looks COOL too!
My (our) opinion for what its worth!

Scotty C = 12,000+ Jumps (and still learning) "HINT"
Tami C = 900+ Jumps (and still learning) "HINT"

Hey, Scotty and Tamie, may be because all this discussion going along between Ron, Elfanie, etc. you missed the point of the poll.

The question is not if skydiving is safe or not.
The question is if it is one of the safest risky sports or not.

Saying that it is one of the safest risky sports is not saying it is safe. May be you think it is not one of the safest risky sports. In that case your NO perfectly applies. But that does not come up from what you wrote above. Nor is there any post in which you can claim that I do not respect what I am doing!!! (search all my posts!)

Unfortunately discussion in this poll mostly veered to if it is safe or not. That discussion should belong to other polls and threads. This one is about safety comparing with other sports that put your life in danger. Is it safer than most of them? Is it not? That is the question, nothing more, nothing less!

Not worth the increased risk.

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Following the very interesting debate on whether skydiving is risky but safe I think that may be we could have consensus on this one.

i can see this leading back to the is it safer than driving debate... this is debated on soooo many occasions, and should really be layed to rest by now

Well, I never considered driving a risky sport, it doesn't fit in the definitions I set above!

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Ok, so maybe my choice would be not to get on a plane with a pilot who had just toked, but someone who is "a stoner" no problem. Definitely better than "a drunk" although not the best situation imaginable.

Hey, it's plain and simple! Any amount of alcohol or drug may impair your abilities, regardless of which situation is better or worse. Since you are riding into altitude with no other support than the plane and the pilot and you will jump to earth with no other support than your equipment, your skills and those of your fellow jumpers, definitely one should never knowingly jump exposed to drugs/alcohol in oneself, fellow jumpers or pilot (unless one wants to make it riskier but I don't see the added fun).

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Where's the both option?

I purposely left that option out as I knew it would generate the most votes.

Too bad, because that's what I always remember. The best and the worst.

100% with you MarkM! If most people remember both, like you and me, why must that option be excluded?

Started with Scuba (I'm also PADI advanced open water), then skydiving. In fact I skydive much more than scubadive because we don't have nice places to Scubadive in Uruguay so I do it when I travel. Both are great sports, essentially different but they must have something in common for so many skydivers to scubadive! May be it is the individual sense of accomplishment of defying nature and be immersed in such beautiful scenery in water and in air.

I think it is. If he gets his FAI certification in his country there can be no doubts.

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Skydiving is safer than sex with an unknown partner.

Hahahahaha, very good! I agree!! And I also agree on your other definitions! So maybe you voted YES...

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So, along that line, is skydiving one of the safest risky sports? I think so.

Compared to what other sports? It'll all depend on our different experiences and what sort of sports we've participated in (I think skydiving is more dangerous than rock climbing, but at least one other person disagrees with me). I don't think this poll is all the relevant until we have some sort of apples to apples comparison and that isn't likely to happen.

I thought I had made myself clear. Those sports that when you decide to practice them you know that death is a real possibility (like BASE jumping, one of yours). That should make apples to apples comparison possible.

You know (MarM, Elfanie, etc, etc, etc), I think it has been a very interesting discussion but it went out of focus. I mean, the purpose of the poll was to agree or dissagree and comment on the statement:

Skydiving is one of the safest risky sports

Quade asked for more precision on "risky" and I added "significantly potentially deadly" to exclude those sports in which you don't expect death as a real possibility. You might be dead because of an injury playing football but you don't think of it when you decide to play football. You might be dead because of an injury skydiving and you know that can happen when you decide to skydive. That is the line I draw.

So, along that line, is skydiving one of the safest risky sports? I think so.

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There's a saying about aviation... it's not necessarily dangerous, but it is terribly unforgiving. The same might be said for skydiving.

Excellent definition!!

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There were several other answers that contradicted me, just want to know if I'm doing my job to your satisfaction as a National Director.

-

National Director in Botswana? Please mail me your waiver as an attachment!

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People die riding bicycles on city streets when cars run into them. Certainly the potential danger is always with them, but, would you consider that to be a "risky sport"?

If it is simply the "potentially deadly ones", where do you want to make that cut off?

Probably not in the set of "potentially deadly ones":
Golf, bowling, tennis, soccer . . .

Probably in the set of "potentially deadly ones":
Anything involving a potential fall of over 10 feet.
Anything with a closing rate of with the planet or another massive object of more than 20 mph.
Anything where you might be mistaken to be a part of the food chain.
Anything where if you do nothing for 6 seconds you'll probably die.

I dunno, I'm just trying to put some handles on your definition.

Is it because english is not my mother language? Or is there something else? I never thought I could confuse some people so much. When I say "significantly potentially deadly", there it is, the limits are set, I accept that not with surgical precision but they are set. You can get killed playing soccer, american football, tennis, baseball but the potential death risk is far from significant. You can get killed BASE jumping, bungee jumping, mountain climbing, trapeze acrobatics, Delta wing flying and in those sports the potential death risk is significant.

Don't ask me to list them all and I don't have a precise definition, I would say that common sense (was it Aristotle who said that it was the least common of senses?) guides you to identify what I mean. Sorry if I seem rude, it is not my intention.

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It's an unaswerable question because you didn't define what is and is not a "risky sport".

What constitutes the set of "risky sport"?

Well, I guess risky sport implies one in which you can get killed while practicing it. You could also include those in which you can get very seriously hurt but very rarely killed like american football for example but let's keep it to the significantly potentially deadly ones.

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May be we can have more consensus on this other statement which I think true:

SKYDIVING IS ONE OF THE SAFEST RISKY SPORTS

Ever notice that the folks that have been in the sport for a few years don't call skydiving "safe"? Its only the newer jumpers?

Think there is a reason why the old timers don't call it safe, but the newbies do?

OK Ron, got your point and fully agree. But as you know I never compared with eating sandwiches or being hit by meteors. And I am very serious about safety.

Some time ago I started a poll on if a skydiver who consistently practised the sport with risky behavior should be grounded, my opinion being that he should be talked to and if he (or she) did not change, ground him or her because it meant not only danger to himself but also to others. Of course somebody wrote about "canopy nazis", etc., etc. It was very interesting... I tell you this to state that I am very safety conscious.

But I thought that you would agree that skydiving is one of the safest risky sports.

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I am voting "no" on this one.
I have absolutely no data to back this up but I have a feeling that Formula 1 racing ( the stuff that Schumacher does) is safer.

Dave
Like who the hell is Michael Schumacher? - Kelel01

I just said one of the safest, not the safest.

Following the very interesting debate on whether skydiving is risky but safe I think that may be we could have consensus on this one.

May be we can have more consensus on this other statement which I think true:

SKYDIVING IS ONE OF THE SAFEST RISKY SPORTS

I'm starting a new poll on this one

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God I wish folks would quit acting like this is safe.

It can be done safely...but that does not make it safe.

It is not certainly me who acts like skydiving is safe nor is it implied in my statement.

If it is risky that means that if you don't act safely you may die.

I know that even if you act safely you may die but let's agree that it is an exception or nearly so (3% or less of all fatal incidents. The USPA reported average is 1 fatal incident for every 10.000 jumps. That means 1 fatal incident involving somebody acting safely for every 100.000-300.000 jumps).

But the important concept is that once one understands that skydiving is a risky sport, well, on that basis it is safe. Obviously it has nothing to do with meteors.

And skydiving certainly is one of the safest risky sports around.

I do read what I sign but I haven't had the chance to read this waiver since I do not jump in the US as you can see from my profile and from a previous post!!! Thank you anyway, DiveMaker...

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Not only is skydiving not safe, but it's also freekishly random.

A person rides a man/reserve entanglement all the way in, dusts himself off and walks away with no more than a bruise.

A person has a perfectly normal landing right until she trips over a gopher hole, her chest mounted altimeter catches her in the throat and she dies.

Also, nearly 100% is not 100%. Gear malfuntions happen and people die because of them. If you think otherwise, you're only fooling yourself.

I can assure you that I am not fooling myself! Of course near 100% is not 100%. I honestly think that the statement RISKY BUT SAFE implies exactly what skydiving is, a risky sport that you can enjoy in a safe manner, as safe as a risky sport can be. 100% safe does not exist in any risky activity.