ernokaikkonen

I know it's been discussed before, but I haven't seen a good explanation on why it happens. You go faster, yes, that much we know, but why doesn't the "less air to fill the canopy" offset the extra speed?

Any physics professors out there that would care to comment? With the math?

That should be KTS for knots. 130kts is 240km/h.

How about a bag with just the locking stows, and the rest of the lines in a pouch on top of the bag like on reserves?

The one thing about bags with inboard stows that hasn't been mentioned yet: It reduces the possibility of line dump(yes, this time I do mean line dump) since the weight of the lines between rubber bands is equal to the weight of the lines outboard of the rubber bands.

With outboard stows there is more weight between the rubber bands than on the outside. During deployment the lines want to keep going when the bag is lifted off, and with less weight on the outboard side of the rubber bands there is an increased possibility of the lines "falling out through the middle".

This shouldn't have a large effect on deployment as the bag still stays closed until line-stretch, but it might increase the chances of lines entangling with the main container.

Since outboard stows with tight rubber bands have worked fine for decades this is, of course, mostly academic.

So, what's worse:

1) Admitting that you've been DZ bumming for the past 3 years, all the while doing some part time work in your "real world" profession

or

2) Having a black hole in your resume for the past 3 years?

Quote

What it doesn't tell is is what is just outside the town. I'm thinking we could open a porn/boozes/condem store and actually make a lot of money

I was thinking of buying a house and dealing directly from there.

Quote

Just found out that anything I do after typing, ie going back and adding a smiley or bold or something, ends up after the entire text. Pretty annoying (but not annoying enough to go back to IE though)

I used to have the same problem with Opera. Latest version(8.52 for Mac) adds the tags in the middle of the text.

I seem to remember trying to write some code that had the same functionality, but the functions needed for it were not ECMA-script standard functions so FF doesn't implement them. I might be wrong, it was quite a while ago.

Inspired by another thread...

The cheapest regular*) jump tickets I know of are sold at my home DZ: 5EUR(6USD) for 800m(2700ft).


---
*) not boogie or special event prices, just regular operations

Quote

i have heard thailand is £20 a jump

I don't know about the boogies and such, but the only operating DZ in Thailand charges 1200 baht for 10.000ft in a C206. (1100 baht if you buy an annual membership)

1200baht = 31USD = 26EUR = 18GBP

Antigravity is still my number one favourite skydiving video. The combination of Passe's footage and the soundtrack just works so well.

Most of the songs are from various albums by Joe Satriani.

Does anyone know who performs the song that plays during the 8-way sequence? I heard it in a restaurant just a couple of days ago, but the CD that was playing was(surprise surprise) a home-burned compilation so no help there...

Quote

nb:
IMHO Aeordyne have got it right with the new Icon freebag.

I like that design myself. Of course, Parachutes de France has been using it on Atoms for a decade already.

Quote

This animal is considered neoteny which to me blows the whole evolution theory out of the water. If evolution were correct, why would an animal adapt backwards like the axolotil?

Neoteny refers to an animal that retains juvenile characteristics through to its adulthood. I'm not sure what you mean by "adapting backwards"? And how on earth does that blows the theory of evolution out of the water?

Wow. I just browsed through the Wikipedia talk-pages for "Anthropic principle" and "Fine tuned universe". It was really hard to concentrate though, because I kept hearing this really loud "whoosh" noise all the time.

Quote

no, why don't we let it die, everybody has expressed an opinion, we've all preached to people who can't/won't be converted, but hey! If y'all are having fun...........

Should we move the thread to Speakers Corner?

Quote

Also the parameters of the Universe seem to be tailored for life and the anthropic principle is not very appealing as an explanation.

Why not? It's always made sense to me.

Quote

It goes back to the early 90s when Sabres (and ZP3 in general) were first introduced. If I remember right, there was a rash of brutal opennings and even a fatality. I had a Sabre then and was told that tube stoes were verbotten because they caused line dump. I'm sure I read it.

Off topic again but:

I'm sure there were some hard openings when people first started to learn how to pack ZP. People not being able to control the slider during packing was probably how the Sabre got its undeserved reputation for hard openings. Tube stoes were introduced around the same time as the Sabre, were they not?

The combination of two new things at the same time may have caused some people to draw incorrect conclusions. I know that it's quite possible to pack good openings in a Sabre, regardless of the type of rubber bands used, as long as they're tight enough. I also know that if you let the slider slide down the lines during packing, you'll get a slammer regardless of the type of rubber bands used.

Oh, by the way, you can still get Sabre1s. I had the pleasure of packing some brand new Sabres last season...

Quote

My previous statement was factual.

We're talking about the same event here, and we agree that it's Very Bad(tm) when it happens. I just think that "line dump" isn't very descriptive, and may give the wrong impression. Therefore I prefer to use one of the alternative terms I mentioned.

Quote

Quote

The stowless designs do have problems of their own. Regular hard openings due to bag strip isn't one of them; I've spent two seasons packing those bags and they work just fine.

Would you like to tell me which of the two sentences is true, since they both can't be?

Both sentences are true. I could expand on on the second one by adding: (...)they work just fine, as long as a canopy with the correct pack volume is correctly packed into the bag.

The first problem is that the bags I packed were very critical of the size of the canopy packed into it; it was more or less 'one bag, one canopy'.

The second problem was that it was quite easy to pack a baglock if you didn't know what you were doing; when properly packed, they worked just fine.

I didn't intend to go to this in much detail, as stowless bags are a topic for another thread.

Quote

Well, if you remember PDs experience with Tube stoes and their ban from fatally hard openings, you'll realize that a stoe can come undone as the bag lifts off you back.

I don't remember anything of the sort. Are you saying that PD recommends against using Tube stoes? Can you refer me to a source where this is stated?

I just downloaded "How to Prevent Hard Openings" from PD's website. Here is a quote from that document:

Quote

If you use Tube Stoes, look at the instructions that were included with them. Follow the instructions labeled "For tighter Tube Stoes". Rubber bands can be tightened in the same way. Replace Tube Stoes or rubber bands that appear worn.

It doesn't seem to me that PD has banned the use of Tube stoes. Maybe I misunderstood your post?

Quote

Then why are two other manufactures using a speedbag version of their own design. And why is one of the top military canopy/container manufactures using a speedbag type design?

Could you name these manufacturers? I'd like to learn more about these designs, is there anything available on the Net?

Quote

Quote

Line dump is a misnomer, otherwise every base opening would explode the canopy.

Dam, PD, RWS etc. are wrong again.

"Line dump" is a misnomer! Simultaneous deployment of all lines doesn't matter as long as the canopy doesn't start deploying before line stretch. "Canopy dump" *) or "bag strip" **) would be better names. They all describe the same event though.

*) canopy is dumped from the bag/released from the locking stow before line stretch
**) bag is stripped off the canopy before line stretch

Quote

Quote

Furthermore, how is it that people are using bags with (gasp), no stows. Search berger bag or stowless bag to learn more.

And why have there been problems with them? And using your statements above why haven't all of the other manufacturers jumped on the wagon?

The stowless designs do have problems of their own. Regular hard openings due to bag strip isn't one of them; I've spent two seasons packing those bags and they work just fine.

And do these apply to both canopy and harness-container tests?

Quote

The guy that started this post is a perfect example of why some people want the old style. There alot of riggers out there who are too busy preaching thier opinion that they don't have the time to listen. If there is proof that they are wrong, then the fault lies in the proof, not thier opinion.

You can't teach a student who refuses to learn.

Ouch! The reason I started the thread*) was described in the first line of my post; "I don't get it". I started by describing my personal opinion and observations of the Speedbag. Since then, I've read many informative posts on the subject. Riggerrob's and Nancy's posts about the Mil-spec rubber bands were especially valuable, since as a new rigger I have very little experience with rubber bands in the reserve. So, I'm now convinced that Mil-spec rubber bands that have not been sitting on a shelf in sunshine for months can be safely used in reserves, as long as they don't come in contact with brass.

As to the Speedbag design, I haven't seen anyone explain koppel's concerns over the seemingly bag locked reserves that he pulled out for a repack. As long as this can not be re-created, we don't even know what causes it, and can't look out for the mistake that makes it happen.

I'm also not convinced that there is a need for a new design; while I agree that there can be problems with safety stows, I maintain that these are most likely caused by worn-out shock cord, broken shock cord, safety stows that are too large, safety stows that are too small, or line bights that are too large or small.

All manufacturers, Jump Shack included, have been able to do all the necessary tests with regular freebags. I don't know what the speeds and weights for these tests are, but if they are not close to freefly speeds, maybe some additional high speed testing of the traditional freebag would be in order? Apparently the traditional design has been tested to freefly speeds.

---
*) and maybe I just wanted to stir some shit.

Quote

Recent student harness failures are the direct result of line strip openings.

Can you refer to an incident investigation report that agrees with that?

Quote

How do these manufactures deal with the requirments of AS8015-B sections 2.1.2, 4.3.4, 4.3.4.2, and 5.1?

Can you elaborate on what these sections say? Few people here have access to all the documents...

Quote

The Eclipse sport and tandem rig was tested with a standard freebag every single time.

Nancy was refering to canopy manufacturers.

Quote

Are you talking about in the United States? That is so clearly unconstitutional I can't believe it has been attempted. That is a clear prohibition on the free exercise of religion.

Is it?

i don't know how these places work, but I assume someone owns a lot of land, builds a lot of houses there, and then decides who to sell the houses to. What's wrong with that?

Quote

Why is that the oldest of the 3 religions Judaism have the least amount of members?

Around 30AD Judaism was already an old religion, probably a bit stale and not spreading much. Then this whole new sect of that religion popped up around a Palestinian anarchist. This new religion put a strong emphasis on missionary work and spreading the word. Furthermore, the teachings were simpler and made a lot more sense than the old Jewish teachings. They just couldn't lose.

Islam spread to the east from Middle-East, towards areas that are still today largely undeveloped. That's always good ground for religion.