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Sorry Dom - Elsinore is a smoke free DZ!!!! Note, ths is "smoke free" not "Booze Free" S.

Doctor or no - he still owes several cases of Beer for "beer line" violations last weekend. The regulars expect that those will be in tow this weekend or Alloy will be suspended from the SSL and forced to relinquish the CUP. Steve GT

yeah, but the "so-called" jinx only applies when GT and its traveling team members blow a bunch of air fare only to show up and be weathered out. Just me doesn't count. Steve.

No divewerkz? They always show up. Whatta matter with Gordo??? He's not broken is he??? Video guys goin down like nobody's business out here in cali this year. Edited to add: Ok, found out Gordo isn't broken. So - can't deal with one world champ on the team, had to go find a second??????. I don't know, Lemming might not have enough experience!!!! S.

or a GT training day.

Must have read my mind dom - was just about to ask the same question. GT, sans PC (well, he'll be doing video) will be there. Directe will also be there and I believe Fasttrax Select will be there. Assuming Element will attend, looks like there is a lady's competition to be had. Have heard that Fury will not be there but that Christy might have a PC team in AA. What about Storm and Helion? Are the rocket guys comin? Can confirm Gravity will be there as well. No word on Vengeance from up North. Looks like an Advanced and intermediate Class bonanza. "Can't exit, can't exit, can't exit . . . . . . . ." Oh, Mish - that would be the "new" Equinox. Steve GT

For all of those who where there this weekend - I think we can all vouch for the fact that Elsinore "had" a wind tunnel. How 'bout that weather - Good afternoon ladies and gentlemen and welcome to Lake Wales. Felt like Ms. Nature got her Coasts confused. Whoever poured her that last martini on Friday night has some questions to answer. S.

Actually not an unusual question. People often think that red wine has caffine because of the head aches that it causes in people. Not "hang-over" headaches, but headaches 15 mins to an hour after drinking as little as one glass. This reaction is similar to reactions that caffine sensitive people get from drinking Coke for example. In wine, this is often a result of the sulfates that are added druing the wine making process. S.

They ended up in the pool, simulating a water landing in the lake. Another valuable tool. We have it all. S.

C'mon - this coulda been fun. Sure looks like a wind tunnel to me.

Awwwwwwww, now why'd ya have to go an do that!!!

Its about time and open before Eloy. The fans look pretty fast. No need for a baggy jumpsuit as you can tell and its right next to the landing/packing/boarding area. Very convenient. Steve.

ok - so, who is on Kachina?? I'd heard it was a PC team. Is this correct? Steve

Who are the members of Kachina. They had some nice rounds. Steve.

For Nationals - I consider that GOOD. Perris was bad in 1997 and 2000, Lake Wales had almost a full day washed out, Perris last year was very nice and chicago was nice for 4 way and 8 way, but terrible for the AE's. Weather is always an issue at this time of year and will always be a wild card. Losing one day - I'd call that a success. Maybe this is just a distinction between "good" and "perfect". With mother nature, perfect is rarely going to happen. Any Neutral Sites in Hawaii that are available? S.

I think all of the Athletes agree with a rotation as well. Taking over a neutral site could be nice but would still favor whoever is local. Chicago ran a great meet (at least for RW), Eloy is always good, Lake wales was fine. As long as the minimum criteria are thought through, this should work. Is it really any different than what we have now aside from the recent 2 year thing?

No doubt October. Thats what they have done in the past. Anything else would be like going to Sebastian in Hurricane season. Oh, was that my outside voice???? S.

Straight from Comp. Comm chair - no 4-way rule changes. Steve.

Ron - I think my point with respect to Women's 4-way is being taken a bit out of context in your response and perhaps by Douva's use of it in his response to you. The points you raise are correct, which you know that I already know. BUT - I stand by the analogy. I raised that issue by way of the USPA sanctioning a team for an IPC event and the precedent that removing Skysurf could set with respect to that. I also stand by my point that in Open, there were not a lot of all women's teams. Given USPA's thinking I can very much see them using the new 4 team rule to apply to "sanctioning". As you and I both know, the women have been fighting a tough battle as well, a battle which they are deservedly winning. I simply did not want to provide any additional ammo to USPA in that regard. With respect to why Skysurfers leave the sport - its hard to draw a comparision. As has been debated in this thread, there are very few skysurfers in comparision to other disciplines. It just so happens that with respect to the more experienced ones, I know (or can reasonable guess) why they quit. That said - when people retire from 4 way or from skydiving in general, why do they quit? Are their answers any different? I suspect across the board, they are basically the same. Steve

yep - already new about the skysurf stuff. Was more curious about all of the PC, defend your title stuff. I've heard rumor that nothing was changed. Well - I like eloy - but I understand the not wanting to travel. Neither do I. Eloy also has limited lodging, but, they run a great meet, always have. At least it will be a longer season. Eloy in September is unthinkable. For that matter - Perris in September is unthinkable. It was 107 this weekend. Steve.

Can't we all just get along??? I must say, having made a skysurf (which scared the *&% out of me while Kathee was sit flying next to me laughing her butt off - I never did successfully stand up on that damn thing), having filmed it in some very bad situations and having done 4way where collisions can get people hurt (see bobo broken arm), Skysurf is more dangerous. The board adds a factor that does not exist in other events. Is that why people quit doing it - you'd have to ask those that retired. Personally - I'd speculate that younger skysurfers stop early because its hard to do and/or they had one or two good scares. Cutting away the board is enough to get your heart pumping (No, I did not have to cut it away!!!!). Experienced Skysurfers - the "danger" is likely not why they stopped. Injury in some cases, frustration in others and just plain "moving on to other things" in most. I do agree with Ron's post above regarding new skysurfers. The rules have been set and they are fair given the universal application. Lets focus the energy in the direction of bringing the sport back to life. Steve

Any word on the meeting?

Go USA - Looks like Pilch is on his game. JT - kick some butt buddy. Steve GT

Not so sure about the "not submitting". I know Larry is out getting shots a lot at Elsinore. Not sure if Joel is submitting the shots or not. Joel submitted our shots in 2003 and we got the cover. That was nice!!! BUT - this thread digresses. Its about Nationals. Perhaps another thread should be started to discuss how to increase participation in the sport. Steve.

Most recent high profile skysurf picture was parachutist cover in Sept. or Oct. 2003. Great shot, but I'm biased. As to the funds issue - First womens and First men's teams are entitled to their fair share of USPA Team Trust fund money. Keebe's issues that year went well beyond those cited above, but those are best explained by Keith. FYI - last I heard, he was on the East Coast. ANother good coach. Steve Boardwalk.