masterrigger1

On 12/21/2021 at 1:23 PM, gowlerk said:

I have had the good fortune of having a Juki 1900 enter into my basement. A friend bought it from another rigger in FL who no longer needed it. It seems to be working after we assembled it. It appears to be the original 1900, not one of the revised versions and I do believe it has patterns by MEL installed as well as a NS plate and feet as spare parts. All good.

I do have a couple questions though. I have figured out that it takes common DPx5 needles. But it did not come with any spare bobbins. The bobbin looks like an ordinary class 15 bobbin, common as dirt. Can I use those? 

Also, I have always just used 304 stitches with E thread for installing lines. Someone told me that B thread is often used. I can find no references to where B thread is used. What is the correct thread size for suspension line finger trap bar tacks? And who is a good source for parts like a spare bobbin case?

Ken,

There should be two sets of marks on the needle bar. One set for a 135 X 7 Needle (DP X 5) and another set for a 135 X 17 needle. The machine comes setup for both sizes of needles from the factory.

As far as the Thread/Needles, run 18-20 sized needles for B thread and 19-21 for E thread.

Also, Use B thread on Sport canopy lines and E thread for Tandem canopy lines. Always use E thread for stab attachments for both Sport and Tandem canopies.

 

MEL

Text Sent...

MEL

I do not impose any age limit on reserves. If it is good with a thumb test, no stains, etc... It is good to go in my book.

MEL

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Going back through my experiences on DZs, I've been present on 2 occasions when hard openings caused fractured neck bones, and 2 times when the force seemed strong enough to cause injury, but luckily didn't. The lines involved were Spectra (almost new Pilot loaded at 1.2), Dacron (Lightning loaded at 1.3), Spectra (Silhouette loaded at 1.2), and Technora (xVX loaded at 2.2). Causes for 3 of those were attributed to packing techniques, and the Lightning one... Could be air speed, body position, packing, and canooy nature all mixed in.

So was the Lightning taken to terminal??

Also, the was questionable xVX a standard VX, a JVX, or a "converted VX" with a JVX line set installed?

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Very often I see damaged HMA and Vectran lines after 100-iah jumps on a new canopy

This is not normal wear and tear BTW unless the lines are not coated.

Technora is very wear resistant, but at the same time very supple and soft. It needs a coating to help prevent picking. It also is very easily damaged by UV. This is why we coat our lines.

The bottom line is this. If you are buying canopies with Technora that is tan in color (uncoated);expect a short life of the lines. They simply will not last as long as ones that are coated. This is a known fact.
...and yes there are two manufacturers that I know of using uncoated lines.

With regards to Vectran; it is a very wear prone medium but we know this up front. We coat the line in a clear polymer dip after manufacture to help bind the bundles together. This helps keep the grit out of the inside of the braid. It also adds to the life of the line material by being a "buffer" if you will. If the buffer takes a 100-200 jumps to wear off, this is 100-200 jumps that the material itself does not wear.

We coat the line in two methods. The first is a clear poly coating. The second is a combo of the same poly and also a UV inhibitor for the Technora.

Lifespan of both materials should be at least 400-700 jumps if properly coated.

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What would you say is a better line choice for low-experienced jumpers?

Well it depends on the canopy.
If it is a slow opening canopy - Vectran always.
If it is a small pocket rocket - Technora
If it is a bigger canopy Like a Navigator - 525-600 Dacron
If it is a Safire II or III, Crossfire II or III - 580 Vectran
...and etc...

Hope this helps,
MEL

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My suggestions for a main would be a Pilot or Sabre2. I'd request Spectra lines for either of those. HMA, Vectran, and ZLX are the lines that may need replacing soon.

Chris,
I hate to disagree with you on this; but unfortunately I do.

With all of my research on fatal, hard openings, 99 % of them were Spectra lined main canopies. The top five list goes like this from my accounts of the fatalities. BTW, all were Spectra lined canopies except for a Vectran lined tandem canopy.
1.Sabre II
2.Spectre
3.Triathlon
4.Sabre I
5.Stiletto
As we see more and more canopies lined with line mediums other than Spectra, the number of recorded hard openings is diminishing at a rapid rate.

Spectra in my opinion, is the worst line medium to ever be installed on main canopies period. My experience working with different line mediums for the last 20 plus years lead me to the above opinion. It is also why I brought "other" mediums to market as you know.

You might note that I pointed out just "mains" and not reserves.
This is because reserve canopies are best suited for Spectra because:

1. It speeds up the openings compared to the other mediums.
2. The number of jumps on a reserve line set will not even be a factor in regards to line trim.

MEL

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Is it true that Mike Furry was the main designer, or is that just talk that I've heard?

Mike Fury was the designer and Lloyd "Red" Payne (who now owns Flight Concepts International) was a co-designer that worked for Mike.

Mike started SunPath in late 1986-early 1987 as I recall and yes they had Velcro riser covers. Replacing the Velcro was pretty easy on those containers. We still have a couple that we use for student packing in DeWolf's course.

Great Rigs BTW...
MEL

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NZ linesets for Icarus come ready for 2-6, 6-2 or 1-6. In case you want to use the single brake option, you attach the 6 uppers skipping 4 and 8 line attachment points.

There are actually five configurations possible.
2 X 6 - with Primary and Secondary lower control lines going to two sets of toggles - Secondary toggle (Student) goes to #1 and #2, the other 6 go to the Primary toggle.

6 X 2 - with Primary and Secondary lower control lines going to two sets of toggles - Secondary toggle (Student) goes to #1,#2, #3,#4. #5,and #6, the other 2 go to the Primary toggle

4 X 4 - with Primary and Secondary lower control lines going to two sets of toggles - Secondary toggle (Student) goes to #1,#2, #3, and #4, the other 4 go to the Primary toggle
This is not a standard NZ set up BTW; but is used at some DZ's.

8 X 1 - Uses one Primary lower control line and uses all 8 USTs.

The fifth option is very simple and is used by several dzs. If you have a setup that has both a Primary and Secondary lower control line, you simply route both lower control lines to the primary toggle on each side. Both control lines go through the same guide ring like a Strong rig does.
This takes zero modification to the steering line configuration.

I also like it better than the 8 X 1 set up.It is not as hard to pull for some odd reason.

MEL

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I do think having a controlled line dispersement will have more positive results every day of the week.

Postive results of what????
Slower openings for sure. Maybe not by much but definitively slower than a two stow freebag because each stow causes a bit of deceleration during its release.

All the other manufacturers use the 2 stow freebag without any issues and use the safety stow to its fullest advantage. This advantage is completely removed when using a Speed Bag.

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Oh and if you want to include videos of people dumping into a rats nest and expecting a great result thats probably the worst outcome for any manufacturer to try to get out of.

I put these videos up because it shows the advantage of a two stow bag with the possibility of getting the canopy out of the bag if you do have that scenario over your head. This is real life stuff because it happens more than one would think. That possibility goes away when you use a Speed Bag.

I task you to show me one video of a Speed Bag in the same set of circumstances that also has the same outcome.

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But there are MANY out there who have never put their hands on our system much less have been even close to educated about or system that have a very LARGE opinion about our system.

I know this leaves me out of the MANY because I am very educated on the Racer and the Speed Bag. I might not personally pack them for use but I do get my hands on them while training riggers.
Also,I started educating myself with Racers in 1990, helped test drop/jump the Racer Tandem in 1992, and have owned many Racers in the past.

I have 11 or 12 reserve rides on a Racer, but they all had the two stow freebag. I stopped jumping and packing them when the Speed Bag came out.
This is where I get a LARGE opinion..from lots of experience.

With that said, I would still pack them today if they had the old two stow bag.

MEL
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mel with all due respect, and i agree with your other 'no goes' (Optimum reserves and Wings containers) but if you are going to dump a reserve into a spinning main you cannot blame the reserve bag line stow configuration. you are simply rolling the dice.

Rob,

First let me say I respect your opinion and thanks for the comments.

You are absolutely correct with regards to rolling the dice.But here is the difference when you roll that dice.

The normal two stow freebag has a bungee that has a 50% greater chance of NOT having a bag lock. If one stow is captured and locked down and the second one is released, the bungee will pull out with the locked down stow and you will have canopy out of the bag.

With a Speed Bag you have to remove all of the locking stows to get the canopy out of the bag, If the bag is spinning around up in the mess, I think you would agree that mathematically it is less likely to happen. All it takes is one stow to get caught up and its over.

If you look at the videos I posted, both jumpers hand pulled the lines out of the freebag along with the two locking stows. This is what got the reserve out of the bag and into the air stream.

To simple things up a bit, let's say you have a cutaway, tumbled and got the reserve P/C wrapped around your foot. The system is now in a horseshoed configuration. Which system would you rather have; a standard freebag with two stows and a line free stow pouch or one with 10-12 rubber bands???

I personally am going to rest my chances with the standard 2 stow freebag every time.


MEL

No problems with the standard bag.

The new Freebag was geared to the head down people.

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Can you provide a link to an incident report or something about that Speed Bag Incident? I have been jumping Racers (with all sorts of reserve bags) for 25 years and have never heard of a Speed Bag contributing to a fatality.

Talk to Dave DeWolf about it. He investigated it for the DZ as I recall.

MEL

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Looks like his rig was an Aerodyne - elongated middle ring.

Both rigs in the videos were other than Racer rigs.Thank goodness! They probably would be dead if they had a Speed Bag instead of a standard type freebag.

MEL

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Like you, I'd love to hear from someone who won't pack them, and their reason why (other than the Canadian rigger who posted that 2-pin reserves are a separate rating that he doesn't have, and wouldn't be worth getting).

If it has a speed bag instead of a standard freebag...No I will not pack it.

The Speed Bag uses rubberbands instead of a stow pouch. This means that is is more prone to a freebag lock than the standard freebag simply because it has more locking stows.

It was not long after the release of the Speed bag that a girl died using one in NJ which attributed to the death according to the investigator on site.

If you end up with a mess like this, the last thing you want is a bunch of locking stows to have to pull out before you can get the canopy out of the bag.....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3FJp0Ku-6gg

or this one:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aFSivezl80E


I used to train riggers on the finer points of the Racer. No longer since they went solely to the Speed Bag.


MEL

Terry,
So you caught it during inspection before packing... correct.

Do you know of any reserve canopy that failed during use that was not affected by a SB or AD?

I do not recall any during use.

MEL

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Do you have a reserve age limit after which you won't repack the reserve, even if it's in excellent condition and inspected and re-certified by the manufacturer?

No. My reasoning is simple.

I treat every canopy the same no matter how old it is by inspecting it thoroughly myself.

Now add that to the fact that I have never known a reserve parachute to fail from normal use and/or old age. At least not any that did not have known issues like acid mesh. That is again never to my knowledge..ever.

MEL

Ray,
First let me state that I do not use servo motors for my bigger sewing machines.You simply cannot beat the flywheel inertia physics for the bigger sewing machines IMHO.

But if you still want to go that route,here are a couple of links to some bigger motors:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/GOLDSTAR-GBSM-34-750-Industrial-Sewing-Machine-Brushless-Servo-Motor-750-Watt/282617334784?hash=item41cd4e4c00:g:EHkAAOSwaB5XwIkq


https://www.ebay.com/itm/SEW-LINE-SLS-1000-ENERGY-SAVING-SERVO-110V-MOTOR-FOR-INDUSTRIAL-SEWING-MACHINE/322852921855?epid=1854479962&hash=item4b2b88a1ff:g:vOcAAOSw~gRVurDi


You can also change the pulley size on the motors that you now have on hand.There are Pro's and Con's when doing this though.

MEL

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Back on topic,

Micheal,
While the tread may have a slight drift, it was still on topic; Line material...

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...PD refers to it "HMA"

Exactly my point!
Just because PD calls it that does not make it correct.

MEL

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I'll throw the blame at the manufacturers who never want to tell us what they're actually using especially when it is new to us.

Absolutely correct. They want to sell you a "new" Kool-Aid;call it something different while still using the same product as before.

For example, PD calls their standard suspension line "Microline". They are the only ones that use that name in the industry.It is merely the same stuff all of the other manufacturers use..Spectra.
Another twist is that they also call it 825 lb line material. It is in fact only 725 lb material, not 825 lb. But 825 sounds better..right?

MEL

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But, after reading your post I get a feeling like I said something untrue. But I didn't, you only told more detailed story (as I was to lazy to do so) ;).

Sorry, my post was not meant to be demeaning. It was meant to be more of a public announcement if you will.

But at the same time, by stating Technora will last longer than Vectran; that is not always a true statement. If people like yourself state this all of the time, people will start to believe that is the absolute truth.

Take the name "HMA" that people are using everyday incorrectly. The real name is Technora. People have been saying HMA so long most people do not know the true/real trade name like they do for the other line mediums.

For example:

Dacron- Polyester
Spectra - Polypropylene
Vectran- Liquid-Crystal Polymer
Technora - High Modulus Aramid


MEL

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Why don't you try HMA Technora lines instead? It is trim stable, lasts bit longer than vectran and it is not so abrasive to slider grommets,...

Technora is actually the name of the High Modulus Aramid that we use today in most applications. Stating "H.M.A." like saying "plastic" when they are so many different types of plastic.....

There are three basic types of "HMA":
Kevlar (type 49), Technora, and Twaron

Also, not actually true that it always lasts longer than Vectran. It depends on a lot of different factors like DZ environment, sunlight (UV), and packing area. Technora is very UV sensitive BTW.
Both Fibers are equally dimensionally stable and since the Sabre II has SS grommets, the use of Vectran would not be an issue.


MEL

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As I said, they are in business to sell units.

Very well understood beforehand. But that does not prevent someone from creating a syllabus and procedure of re-certification with a re-branded name.
You could say that you are just using parts from the original device.

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No one has properly investigated expired units,

I would have to disagree with that thought process. People in other parts of the world have been Beta testing them for several years by default.

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the company has successfully pushed the line that they will no longer function.

...which we all know is not true, They still will and do work.

If Airtec was a FAA approved vendor/supplier/manufacturer I could see a problem with going against their claims that the unit should die at 12.5 years.
Since they are not either of the above, the FAA does not give a rip either way.
If a company were to re-claim and re-brand name the units, they then become the manufacturer that dictates user instructions.

This I already know because I asked....

MEL

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ACME AAD Repairs.......

Nah...

AAD Recycling Company,LLC
or
Money For Nothing AAD Repair,LLC

You must have watched an lot of cartoons way back when....:)

But honestly this is something that I have thought about. So called "expired" Cypres' have been used in other parts of the world for several years now without any known issues. At least none that I am personally aware of.

I do think that you do have to draw the line somewhere on age, but it is clear that 12 years is not the real number. I am thinking more like 20-25 years.I have several boxes of Cypres units made from the early 1990's and later that still function perfectly. One of them is 26 years old. It still works just fine if you put a battery in it.

Question:
Has anyone heard of or personally experienced a problem with an "expired" AAD in other parts of the world?

MEL

Simple.
Create a certified repair shop and company that re-certifies the expired units.

That would not be any different most other components in the aviation world.
Simple to do.....

MEL

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(So who does NZ Aerosports sales & service these days in N. America?)

I do both sales and service at my loft.

MEL

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Icarus (Spain) is still there, at icaruscanopies.aero as usual.

(Not icaruscanopies.com that has long redirected to NZ Aerosports.)

I'm guessing Icarus World is somehow the US marketing arm, possibly collaborating on future projects, but the relationship wasn't clear in the press release.

Icarusworld.net appears to be essentially a copy or mirror of icaruscanopies.aero. Both say they are copyright Icarus Canopies S.L., which would be the Spanish company.

You can't have enough Icaruses!

Let me get you guys straight on this subject.

NZ Aerosports in NZ (read Jyro here) started Icarus Canopies as a world wide company that would lease his designs out to other well known and already established parachute manufacturers. One in the USA (Precision Aerodynamics) and the other one in Spain (CIMSA).

Precision Aerodynamics stopped producing Icarus Canopies in 2001.

CIMSA had their agreement pulled about two years ago by Jyro. This was after they started re-designing Jyro's canopies and making their own designs and changes, but still using the Icarus logo/name brand.

So CIMSA (Spain) has come up with the Icarus World thing with Bill Legard. Basically Bill is going to warehouse ready built stock here in the USA and offer service for their canopies.

Fernando (who owns CIMSA) also owns BRS emergency parachutes that is located in Pinehurst, NC IIRC.This location will be a service center of sorts as I was told.

So to clarify, NZ Aerosports is the mother company that owns both Icarus Canopies and Dadielus Project. They are both located in Auckland, NZ and have nothing to do with Icarus World.

CIMSA (Icarus World) used to build Icarus Canopies under a License agreement, but no more and has come up with the Icarus World company to sell their canopies.

Clear as mud..right?

Cheers,
MEL