LloydDobbler

I'm voting for container #3 or #5 (I actually think I liked 3 better, but of all the choices, those two stood WAY out).

Hey, HydroGuy - I saw these options earlier this year at Elsinore, and to the best of my knowledge, the magnetic riser covers are just a small design improvement. The tuck tabs were pretty darn secure on their own...but the magnets offer a few distinctive advantages. 1. A slight bit quicker when packing. No biggie, but nice nonetheless, to have your riser covers pretty much pull themselves closed when you move them in the right direction. 2. In the instance that a tuck-tab riser cover comes open in freefall, it'll be open during the rest of the jump until deployment. With the magnetic covers, if a cover should come open, chances are the magnets will pull it back closed. (Sounded far-fetched to me when I was told this, but I hear that RWS has tested this sort of thing & found it to work that way...and after playing around with 'em a bit, I'm pretty convinced that it would work. They're pretty robust magnets, and if the wind blows the flaps close to each other, I imagine the attraction would be more than strong enough to pull the suckers shut.) 3. The magnetic covers provide for a more even release of the risers on deployment, because it's easier for the risers to pop open the riser covers. 4. They just look and feel cooler than standard tuck-tabs. Overall, I think this is just one of those non-essential upgrades that you can probably do without...tuck tabs have always worked well enough on their own for me. But at the same time, the magnets do improve on it a notch...and I guess that's how all our gear gets better in the long run, right? And hell, if you can afford the $25 extra (when buying your, ahem, $3000 Vector container), then why not go for a little extra bling?

Do you still have 2 jumps like your profile says? If so, I can understand your feeling that way. I felt the same way at 2 jumps, 5 jumps, etc. However, just to relate from my own personal experience, I've found that for myself & most people I talk to, their 'favorite' part of the skydive changes at different stages in their jumping career. Sure you might love the freefall above all else...but I imagine at some point you'll begin to see your canopy as less of an 'escalator' and more of something to really play with. (I only say that 'cause it happened to me, and 'cause I've heard the same thing from too many other skydvers who've been doing this a lot longer than I have.) Just be warned, though - I jump at Cal City, and it gets colder in the valleys than you'd like to think over the wintertime. Yeah, sure, still better than jumping in Minnesota in February...but if you're going to altitude, you'll want some gloves & a sweater underneath that suit. Or at least that's what my frostbitten fingers told me this year. Oh, one more thing - I believe MagicGuy's statement above that you need a hop n' pop from 5500' and from 3500' for the A license is inaccurate. I'm looking over the A License Proficiency Card from the back of this year's SIM Manual right now, and it only mentions 1 - under Exit and Freefall Skills: 5. Jump and deploy while stable within five seconds after exit from 3,500 feet AGL. So unless they've changed something, I'd say just get the 3500' one out of the way...unless you'd feel more comfortable doing one from 5500' just to get the feel.

Though I agree with a lot of the rest of your post, I've gotta contribute here: This last paragraph is a prime example of someone "making alot of statistics say exactly what you want them to say to an extent." The extent is the relative statistical ignorance of the person reading. In this case, the problem is that the only number we can use to compare the two (golf and skydiving) is a proportion. By that I mean, I imagine there are far more people in the UK playing golf every year than there are people skydiving. I'd also think there are far more games of golf played than there are skydives made, regardless of the number of people who do it. So in this case, saying that more people die playing golf means nothing. I'm sure a lot more people die walking their dogs across the world every day...but there are far more people who walk their dogs. However, this sort of comparison would mean something if I knew that I stood a better or worse chance of dying when I go out to play a round of golf than when I go out to make a single skydive. That's where the percentages come in (which is what the original poster was doing). Calculating a percent is pretty much the only way to equalize the variables (and even then, you can't fully equalize them, since golf has so many different conditions than skydiving, and since everyone's jumping habits are different). And yes, true, percentage-wise, you can't be 95% dead (Schroedinger's cat excluded)...but you can have a 95% chance of something bad happening. Again, doesn't mean it's going to happen every time...that's just the mean. Like the original poster said, you can definitely place yourself on the better side of that bell curve, however. Main thing is, if you collect enough data, you can tell how your chances stack up against the average golfer. If you're into that sort of thing. But ultimately, that's just chance. And obviously, chance is something we all bet against all the time. Like I said, though, I agree with a good deal of the rest of your post. Just hate it when omitted information gives the wrong impression - that's why so many people don't trust statistics, because most people throw numbers around so carelessly.

Hey, Kolla - were you out at Chicks Rock this year? I think I saw your rig (spacer foam and magnetic riser covers, right?) when I was over at the PD tent (if not you, it was someone else's). Anyway, if that was you, sweet! Ryan, definitely go check out the rig. I was already thinking of getting a Vector, just due to the Skyhook, etc...but the new bells & whistles really put me over the top. Seeing them in person (on a beautiful rig, no less) sold me. Just a matter of saving up a few more dollars...

Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong, but just to clarify, I was under the impression that the Skyventure Universal tunnel is in fact the 'Hollywood' tunnel (in spite of Universal being closer to Studio City than Hollywood, hey, if you're a tourist, you don't really know). 'SV Hollywood' just has more of a name to it than 'SV Universal'. And just for further speculation, I'll relay what I've heard (as others have done), that the Universal tunnel will be very touristy (obvious, given the location at Universal Citiwalk)...and as freakfly24 mentioned, the flight chamber is supposed to be visible to passers-by. Better for marketing, and such.

Not to be "that guy," but I was at the Chicks Rock! boogie this weekend, and wandered into Ground Zero at Elsinore to find - lo and behold - that they had 1 left. So I bought it. Still haven't jumped it yet - I like to know how my electronics work before I rely on them to save my life), so I can't yet give you a review...but I do know that its user interface is a lot less intuitive than the Neptunes that I've seen. (There's no menu system - you just have to remember the right sequence to press the three buttons in order to get to where you want to go - but that doesn't seem that much more complicated than, say, a digital watch. Again, only problem is, it's a bit tougher to get the hang of, at first, so you might plan on *gasp* reading the manual). Also, it comes with a *really* crappy wrist strap (we're talking "tie-the-Viso-to-the-velcro-strap-with-cable-ties" sorta-thing), so I'd order a 'Protektor,' too, if you're planning on getting a Viso. Nonetheless, the main reason for this post is to say that yeah, they're out there. I completely didn't expect to just stumble onto one, given all that I've heard on the forums and from places like Gravity Gear & Square 1 - but there it was. So yeah...sorry I can't give you a good tip on where to actually find one, but my best advice is to just keep your eyes peeled - it worked for me. They're bound to be coming in soon.

Hey, MySkyName. First off, you might want to fill out your new profile. Are you a skydiver? "Do you work for Skyride?" is another question that seems valid, as Skyride in the past has sent people to 'bait' and 'egg on' people on these forums (I assume in order to show in legal proceedings that they had made some sort of 'outreach' to the skydiving community, but I really don't know all the specifics)...regardless, it's a little suspicious that you speak as if you've been reading this topic for quite a while ("I can't take it any longer"), and yet this is your first post, having only registered today. I'll gladly have a discussion with you about the ins-and-outs of the legality of the Skyride operation, but not before I know you're not canvasing the board for something to use in court. Don't want to sound paranoid, but like I said, there's a precedent here...and I don't really want to discuss it with you too much if my words might be used to help Skyride (whose business practices indicate they'd have no problem quoting someone out-of-context for their own personal gain). Fill out the profile, let the board know what your background is (i.e., do you happen to work for ASC or Skyride?), and I'll be glad to discuss it (no 'reeming' going on here, just a good discussion).

D'oh!! You would think, after a while of reading the forums, I'd know the drill... Thanks for the reminder.

Hey, folks - Anyone have any good recommendation for some gloves for the winter? I've got a pair, but since my girlfriend is going through AFF up in Denver right now, I was thinking about getting her a pair of fleece-lined gloves (or some such things) to wear, now that it's getting a little colder. (I have gloves, but they're just standard Parasport skydiving gloves, and I know it gets just a *tiny* bit colder in Denver than it does in Southern Cal). Any suggestions/recommendations from personal experience? Thanks!

Question to those of you who are in the know (that might affect BelskyBlueEyes above): The last I remember hearing, ASC was under review by the USPA, their affiliation hanging in the balance. I know it's gotten yucky, gone into litigation, etc...but from a student's perspective, if ASC loses their USPA affiliation, will it make a difference? (in other words, if I was to do my AFF 1-7 at ASC, then go to another DZ to jump (before I had met the A-license requirements), would they accept my credentials?) I guess a better question is, if one goes through student training at a non-USPA-affiliated DZ, what does that mean for them in the long run? Anything? Will they be able to get their USPA A-license after 25 jumps? (It would just be a good thing for BelskyBlueEyes to know before she goes and begins her training. I'd hate for someone to wind up with a bunch of jumps, but nothing really to show for it.) Signatures are the new black.

Hey, Bill. Back to the suggestions for a new name...I'm only a year in the sport, but gotta say, 'The Uninsured Relative Workshop' is the name that stuck most in my head of all the rig manufacturers...followed closely by Sunpath. Maybe it was because of the demos on the Skyhook. Maybe it was beacuse of reading around here. Or (and this is where I think it really is) maybe it was because it's just a darn good name. Nonetheless, it did make me wonder if Vector's were freefly-friendly for a while, but that was just me being a bit green.

Spoke with SkyVenture a couple of weeks ago - they've had a few delays. Optimistically, they're hoping for around Thanksgiving, but realistically, they're thinking more like Christmas. In spite of delays, it'll be nice to have a tunnel closer to L.A. than Perris, eh?

I was down at Skydive San Diego this weekend, and met someone who had gotten one out of the first load L&B shipped out to dealers. Gotta say, the thing looks nice...and the guy jumping it (didn't get his name, it was on a load almost to altitude) gave it solid reviews over the past week. (As if that's all that great a review...but still, I've heard no complaints so far). Bonnie @ Gravity Gear got a few from L&B's initial shipment, and they were all already sold (she actually had one in stock when I was in, but sadly, it was spoken for). All of this is to say that at this point, it's probably a supply chain problem at L&B. Good news is that they're finally officially out there for sale, and the first batches have been shipping to dealers. So if you're already on a pre-order list, you'll get yours sooner than I will mine.

I was just thinking about this the other day... On a different note, for me, it's about awareness. I've been through enough that not a lot will faze me...and I often treat sticky situations by just pushing through them, knowing that I'll reflect on them later. Which is to say, in a sense, I tend to live in the past and future, and not a lot in the now. (I also run my own company, so I'm constantly having to be in four places at once. There's always something more to do, always another task to focus on). Skydiving forces me out of that pattern. It's very present-inducing. There's really no way for me to do it without being right there, in "the now," focused on it and only it, pushing the rest of the world out of the way. And that's a great thing. It's an escape like no other. (That may just be me, but that's how I see it.) It's also a challenge - but one I do on my own terms. There's always something to get better at, something to move towards - but I choose my own course. It's as much of a personal sport as it is a team sport...as much a mind game as it is physical. All that...and there's nothing like that feeling of completing a great jump, just the way you were supposed to, then coming in for a darn-near perfect landing and sharing a beer with your friends who were flying with ya.

Okay. I posted something a second ago which I now need to modify. On a whim, I just went and looked over the posting guidelines FAQ, and I suppose my original post could be construed as 'advertising.' (For those of you who read the post). My bad. (Don't want to flaunt the forum guidelines - the FAQ is somewhat loosely-worded at first on the issue of soliciting for help, and when I looked it over before, I skimmed right over it.) So I've deleted my original post - I still, however, have a question for you more-experienced web programmer types: I'm building an e-commerce site based around the osCommerce CRE-Loaded shopping cart software...and while I know my HTML & CSS, I know very little about PHP. So I'm currently looking for a programmer-type who can do the PHP heavy-lifting while I go about readying the rest of the business. I've already designed the site in XHTML & CSS - I just need someone to take my design and plug it into the software and configure it accordingly. My problem is this: I don't know anyone right offhand who does this sort of thing. So I've hung out an ad on craigslist...what I'm really wondering, though, is how much should I be looking at paying for a service like this? (I feel kind-of like a guy who knows nothing about auto repair going into a shady car mechanic...I could be a sitting duck, if I don't know what I'm doing).

I don't have my own experiences to quote on this one...but a friend of mine did a high altitude dive from - heck, I can't even remember, upwards of 25,000. He always speaks very highly of it. (And not so highly of pie).

In addition to echoing what everyone else has said about hot tandem mistresses...it's really a personal preference thing. I didn't think much of my tandem, until I had done my first AFF. Now I recommend people do a tandem first, only because you get more of a chance to hang out, get the feel for freefall...and just look around! Like Chris from Ottawa said, in AFF-1 freefall you'll be so focused, you'll barely notice where you are. The 'taking stock and soaking in the freefall' doesn't really come in until you graduate AFF and get to go do a 'no-pressure' jump all by yourself...then it feels like you're in the air [I]forever[/I]! But it all comes down to you. Either way, tandem or AFF, you'll have a blast! (& what a great friend you have, inviting you to go & buying it for you! I want to hang out with you people! Oh, yeah - as for 'flaring', it essentially means to 'apply the brakes.' They'll teach you all of that in AFF ground school. Listen to your instructors. Signatures are the new black.

...and remember: the scariest part is probably going to be right before you exit the plane. Not only because it's not exactly the most natural thing to be standing in a doorway 12,500' up - but more importantly because you're standing in that doorway, facing the [I]unknown[/I] (which can be pretty darn scary, if you let it). It's really a mind game. (And its bark is much worse than its bite - once you get out in the air, you'll see). So best to just concentrate on your jump sequence, prep your exit, and jump...and know that once you get in the air, you'll be over the toughest part. It all gets easier after that. Have a great jump!

Too true. And to be honest, I look at all the money spent as a necessary evil. On my 27th jump, another new jumper (32 jumps) & I managed to dock with at around 8000' after exiting about 3 seconds apart. I'm told that's pretty good (but I have no point of reference. Seems like a relatively simple thing). But lord knows, without the coaching we'd received, I don't know that either of us would have been able to get anywhere near that, at that point. So while the cost barrier to entry is pretty crazy...on the flipside, if what people are telling me is true, it does seem like it'll ultimately help me out in the long run.

Of course, to be a skydiver in general takes lots and lots of money (says the guy who just paid a bit over $3000 to get his A license, and now needs gear...and $ for food). But having to travel obviously adds onto cost for swoopers...and as you said, a public venue is expensive, esp. with less sponsors. But I think it's up to us to build it...then the sponsors will come. (Sponsors are always ambulance-chasers...gotta face it). One question - what does the USPA do as far as Public Relations go? My only experience with the organization as a whole is that of reading the SIM manual & sending off my license app...so I really have no idea. But it seems like actively promoting the sport would fall under their umbrella. Going to the USPA website, however, & looking through the directory, I can't tell who's in charge of handling public awareness of skydiving. The nearest categories would be 'Marketing' and 'Media Inquiries'...but as we've pointed out, the media isn't going to come to us. We need to be taking it to their front door. I'm just curious if there isn't some way to organize the USPA membership into better knocking on doors, getting it in the face of the media. And shouldn't the USPA have a full-time PR person who's out shaking down trees? Seems a logical expense to me... (and maybe they do - I just can't find anyone listed on the website, who a member might contact to discuss ways to get involved and get it out there). Anyone know how the USPA works on this front? If the USPA could secure some media attention, I don't think you'd need to shell out the bucks for the swooping Nationals. I mean, the only place I ever hear about Nationals is in skydiving publications. Do we advertise these events to the non-skydiving public? I get the sense that if we start to get some of the general public there (and get media attention), I would think that more people would come the next time around, provided we keep it interesting... Oh, one other little PR thing: We need a 'Flying Tomato' of skydiving. We could really use a poster-boy/girl, who'll make the sport seem more human. Any takers?

To clarify, I think Ms. A was including all the costs of getting to an A license...which, in this day and age, means the cost of AFF levels 1-7, plus jump tickets & coaching fees (when you choose to jump with a coach - which, I've gotta say, is ultimately a good thing, because you can only do so many 'no-pressure' jumps as a student by yourself before it gets kinda boring) & gear rental for the jumps after AFF. Not to mention it now goes to 25 jumps before the 'A', as opposed to the former 20. If you're paying for gear and a coach, that's an extra $500 right there. I checked at the DZ's around the Los Angeles area, and an AFF approach to the 'A' license, including AFF jumps, student jumps, coaching (when you want it), & gear rental all seems to run about the same price. And then you have to start looking for your own rig... Signatures are the new black.

Go to any popular ski resort and see what going main stream has done for them. The operators make more money and the skiers wait in line. Growth for the sake of growth usually screws up a good thing. (Bear with me, folks. I had a long convo with a much more-experienced skydiver about this topic the other day, and I have a lot to say on the matter. Apologies for being wordy - I was an English major ). Growth is most-definitely a double-edged sword. Seriously. As mjosparky correctly pointed out, with growth comes growing pains. And if we want growth in the sport, we have to accept that, and prepare for it. That being said, I think that the benefits of growing our sport far outweigh the detriments. I'll take the advantages of having more people interested and doing more things in the air over the disadvantages of shrinking membership, less gear suppliers, etc. So what is the overall problem, then? I haven't been around long enough to speak for the baby boomers getting out of the sport, so I'll file that under 'possibility'. I know that cost is a HUGE barrier to entry for most people, myself included. Ms. A (above) & I both paid about the same amount to get our A license. And now we're looking at acquiring & renting gear, etc...in addition to the regular tickets to 12,500'. It scares a lot of people away...if they get far enough into the sport to consider doing it regularly. Back to the thoughts of what happened with skiing and snowboarding going mainstream, think how much cheaper it is to pay for a day on the mountain and renting a pair of skis than it is to do, say, an AFF-Level 7. You can buy a snowboard for less than you pay for 2 AFF jumps. So cost is most definitely a factor in people continuing on after doing their first tandem. But I don't think that's the full problem. I think the full problem comes even before that: it's the problem of public mindset. People don't know what the possibilities of skydiving are. I hate to say it, but it seems to me it's gone out of the social consciousness as a 'cool' sport that anyone can do (& that pushes the envelope enough to attract the teenagers & mid-twenties types). Think of it - how many people do you know who find out you're a skydiver who say, "Oh, cool! I've always wanted to do that!", but never have? I myself was one of those who said I was gonna do it when I was 18...and just didn't get around to it until I was 27. Why? Who knows? It wasn't enough of a thing to do. It wasn't a high enough priority for me. It sounded cool...but I had no idea of what I'd be getting myself into, and thus I had no imperative to go out and do it. People in the advertising industry say you have to see a logo at least 4-5 times before you really remember it. Hence the reason a company puts up 30 billboards, instead of just 1. Now, applying the same logic to our sport: how often does skydiving make it into the popular media? Back to skiing & snowboarding, let's hear it for the Winter X-Games!! They've done a HUGE thing for snowboarding (which is gaining more people snowboarding than skiing is these days...and I think that's mostly due to young people wanting to do what's the current "cool" thing. Hell, I've never even lived near snow, and I've snowboarded). We now have snowboarding 'stars' like Shaun White giving interviews on the network news. It's at the forefront of the public mind. By comparison, how many times have you seen skydiving on ESPN lately (besides a fatality report)? How many feature news stories are done on our sport anymore? I think the key to increasing the number of people who want to jump out of airplanes is to put it in their face and make it 'cool' again. Which presents another big problem: the fact that no matter how rad it is to us when we see a freefly team working some serious magic...to those who haven't skydived, there's no real concept. They can't see it up close - only via camera. Which really kinda deflates the whole proposition (not saying it isn't rad as hell now when I see a great skydiving video - just saying that when I used to watch skysurfing on the X-Games, I had no idea how difficult the things that were being done were. Watching skateboarding, on the other hand, I could understand a bit more: you could see how high they were off the ramp when they threw their 720's). Our sport is not really one for spectators. ...or is it? Okay, I know I'm horribly long-winded, but here's the ultimate conclusion we reached in our discussion of this the other day: Swooping may be the way to get people back in the door. It's really the only way that someone can watch one of the more exciting disciplines of skydiving live & in-person. Which gives the possibility of network TV coverage, spectators, fans...all of which translates into higher awareness from the public. (And the kids think it's pretty wicked). Granted, the idea of swooping scares the sh** out of me at this point in my skydiving experience...and we don't want to encourage hot-headed people to get into skydiving who might downsize far too rapidly & injure themselves (& others)...but that's always the risk with a sport like skydiving. And hopefully good training will help them respect a little better how unforgiving the sport can be. (Not to mention that once people start to experience all the things you can do in freefall, they often get sidetracked. See my above comment about my not knowing what I was getting myself into). However we do it, point is, I think we need to find ways to bring our sport back into the public eye (besides raising the amount of fatalities each year). And I think right now pond-swooping is the best-positioned skydiving discipline to get people to turn their heads and take notice. Again, apologies for the longwinded-ness...but I think this is a serious question for the future of our sport, and it deserves some serious thought.

Hey, guys & gals - thanks for the replies! SunDevil - just what I like to hear.

What's up, folks? I'm finally getting off student status, purchasing my first RW suit. Wanting it to look kinda different from the standard "off-the-shelf" suit. You know how it goes. Anyway, I'm trying to figure out some things about grippers - I know a lot of companies use Cordura as grip material...but I was curious if anyone has had any experience with Poly/Cotton grips, or any other material. Did it hold up? How long did it last before you had to replace it? Was it double-layered? I know grip fabric isn't as crucial to fall rate as the overall body fabric is...so what I'm mainly concerned with is durability. If I have a heavy Poly/Cotton fabric with a cool print I'd like to use as my grip fabric (it'll be secured to the suit with Nylon grip trim/tape, which should add to the durability...), would you say I should go ahead and go with it? For this particular suit, I know Cordura is an option...but it doesn't have the cool print I want. (And though I generally put function over form, well...I'm spending enough money on this suit to want it to look pretty badass, if it won't cause too dramatic a change in function). So I guess my question to you, Skydivers-Who-Have-Been-There-Done-That, is if anyone's had experience with Poly/Cotton grips before, and if so, would you say I'd be okay with them? Or should I say "to hell with this wanting to look cool stuff," and go for the Cordura? Thoughts? Thanks!