topdocker

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Everything posted by topdocker

  1. The flip side of that coin, is that it could be construed that the USPA approves of such behavior. Obviously, they do! You don't get to be Chairman of Safety and Training by pissing off the President of USPA, you get there by being in the same camp. That hasn't changed, just a little inconvenient for a while. It's about politics and money, not about members and safety. top Jump more, post less!
  2. It's guesswork to speculate about others' state of mind, especially a group of others. That being said, assuming Rich wasn't performing his jump on behalf of the USPA or in the course of his duties with the USPA (and despite the old canard that anyone can try to sue anyone for anything), I see no basis for any liability claim at all against the USPA arising out of this incident. No, but a public statement from USPA with some sort of punitive action would surely be a great asset in a lawsuit against the jumper. So, if you want to protect your friend... You are the only person that gets it. Amazing really. I read this WHOLE thread and the only one that gets what is really happening is Remi. Care custody and control. Andy should get it but maybe he doesn't want to chime in and feed the sharks but this is about CYA. If he was disciplined he would be served up on a silver platter to the sharks which he still may very well be. A spectator isn't beholden to any "waiver" and they don't cover gross negligence which is what it would be considering he was/is the head of Safety for the whole sum of skydiving in the US let alone a DZO which puts him in care,custody and control. I don't have a law degree and would be able to walk in and win this in 10 minutes if he was found guilty and punished by the USPA. Nothing else matters no matter what DSE or "Twardo was told you guys have my utmost respect and I get the smoke and mirrors but we are all grown ups and being scared of losing everything SHOULD keep one from doing stupid shit and when you do STUPID shit that injures others it should be extremely painful.. Still amazed only Remi figure that out.. You are right, you are not an attorney. In my mind, this was not about punishing someone, but keeping the integrity of the role of Chairman of Safety and Training. Do you think Rich will be able to fulfill his duties in that role with this clouding it? What happens if next year Rich plows into a four year old girl and injures her at a demo? Do you think USPA's failure to do anything will play a role in sucking USPA into another lawsuit? Again,the BOD is exposing USPA to lawsuits by protecting others instead of the constitutional responsibility of protecting USPA. YOU don't get it. top Jump more, post less!
  3. I prefer the cheaper way Parkman, OH?? top Jump more, post less!
  4. Interesting, but I don't think it will happen. Mostly because the people who are disciplined are Instructors, not average jumpers. USPA is trying to protect the general public from screw-ups, not save its membership from them. USPA cares about numbers of members, not the individual members. Also, that is the procedure that has been established. Maybe the Chair of the Safety and Training will contact the Constitution and Bylaws committee chair and see about making the meetings open..... doubt it! top Jump more, post less!
  5. I know some pilots won't put the flaps down because floaters like to use them for handles in spite of the large "Do not grab!" signs on them. It seems 200lbs of stupid hanging on a flap is bad for it.... top Jump more, post less!
  6. Sadly, I concur. The BOD doesn't care and most members don't care. top Jump more, post less!
  7. I have served on the BOD. This isn't about transparency, we all know what happened. The eye witness accounts were posted shortly after the original incident. Unless the Regional Director or some other BOD member asks for an investigation to be done in an incident, it just isn't done. It's like getting your bike stolen but figuring the police paperwork is more of a hassle than getting a new bike. But, this isn't just some toggle jockey who screwed the pooch, this is THE guy you go to when you screw up and start the begging process to get a rating(s) back! This is THE guy that supposedly not only administers the rules of our organization, but is instrumental in writing them. (Like high performance landing areas being away from regular jumpers and objects). By the co-owner of the DZ's own admission, this was a pattern of behavior for the DZ. This is not about transparency, its about credibility. Rich lost his as THE safety guy when he pounded into a table and then into another jumper. Sherry lost hers in trying to take the heat off of Rich and refused his resignation from the chair of the Safety and Training committee. The entire Board is losing its credibility because two of its key members are not working in the best interest of the organization. top Jump more, post less!
  8. What are you getting at? Are you implying that the rules set by the manufacturer are primarily motivated for legal reasons? That is asinine! I won't imply that, I will state that: the rules set by the tandem manufacturers are primarily there to stave of the possibility of lawsuits. Since they really can't enforce those rules, they lobby USPA to do it for them. Think about it: the manufacturers make rules that they don't even have to enforce, they just call up someone at HQ and it gets done. No matter how onerous the rule might be, no matter how silly, it just doesn't matter, the membership gets to fund the enforcement. Think about that next time you are paying your membership renewal. top Jump more, post less!
  9. Could you elaborate on the alternative explanation? Here is from the original incident thread: Bold added for emphasis by me. This first-hand account sure sounds like an intentional move into an area with spectators and obstacles in it while technically landing in the landing area. Aerial photos show lots of other areas if he was landing short due to a bad spot. So, who has another version? top Jump more, post less!
  10. I'm not picking sides here, but if HQ made public statements about everything each member would like a statement about they would do nothing but make public statements all day every day. I'm not even sure if the organization is required or authorized to discuss procedural matters with the general membership. Anyone know the scoop on that? I'm not an insider in any stretch of the imagination. I am sure they are not required to make any sort of public statement. I do remember whole bunch of the current board members promising more transparency and accountability to the membership when they were running for the board in the last election... Actually, when doing investigations, the opposite is true. When the BOD or a committee is discussing investigations or incidents because the person is requesting a rating or membership back, the gallery is cleared and only the BOD members are privy to the information. The person accused can come in and speak, bring in witnesses, etc. But the entire process is done behind closed doors so everyone speaks freely. That is why no official word will come from USPA or a BOD member, they are bound by the confidentiality clause. Interestingly, that may mean Rich can't come here and speak, maybe he is bound by confidentiality on his own incident..... top edited for clarity Jump more, post less!
  11. First sentence: remember, Rich isn't a regular member, he is the guy that helps decide if another member keeps their ratings/membership after an incident/infraction. Will he be able to do his job as effectively since this occurred? Will the system be as effective? Do we wait to find out? Second sentence: What I would like is some facts and truth to be told to me by those who know them. Instead, after initial reports of the incident, everything has become hush hush. Some people are privy to inside info, others aren't. Okay, then the rest of us get to speculate until someone comes out and clears the air. This isn't complicated. A guy hit a person in the spectator area while he was flying his fully-functioning parachute. Is there a penalty for that? In most cases I would say no, but this isn't your average doofus with more balls than brains. This is the guy that decides who gets to keep flying when they screw the pooch. This thread title is wrong, it's not a cover up, it's a total screw up from the get go. Screwed up landing, screwed up response by USPA, screwed up moves by some BOD members, more screw ups by those involved. And it just becomes an indictment of all those involved! Me included. More than one BOD member reads this forum including Rich, and staff members from USPA read it also. They know we are unhappy and want to know things, several have messaged me during this time. Every incident I have been involved in, I have tried to provide the most facts in as timely a fashion as possible. It may take a few days, but I posted sometimes very difficult to write passages because the easiest way to squelch rumors and innuendo is to get here and post first-hand facts. Poster may throw a few rocks at you, but most just want to know what happened and why. They want to know it will not happen to them or to one of the friends because no one changed the situation. I don't want Rich in some stockade, I want to know it will not happen again. Ever. Anywhere. Anyone. top Jump more, post less!
  12. Who sent what email is immaterial to the real issue here: The Chair of the Safety and Training Committee through his own actions injured a person on the ground. Rich has been vilified so much here, and that is unfair, but the Safety and Training committee as a whole asks members, and especially instructors, to be more professional in appearance and behavior. Anger isn't the word, it's disappointment. Disappointed with Rich, how this was handled, Sherry, and everyone involved. This could have been a real opportunity for USPA to show the membership that the BOD was going to set the bar for professional behavior, set a standard for taking responsibility for actions, live up to the expectations the membership has of its leadership to truly lead. Instead this has devolved into politics and finger pointing. This whole incident along with some of the recent changes to BSR's, has devalued my time I served on the BOD, and will probably mean I won't run again. If someone truly wants to serve the membership, be an instructor, coach, or SnTA. top Jump more, post less!
  13. Has that happened? I know for a fact yes- he has been instrumental in the removal of ratings and membership for lesser injuries. top Jump more, post less!
  14. I teach several canopy courses a month to all experience level jumpers. The teaching and tacit approval of butt landings in AFF leads to more serious issues later in your career, if you are lucky. If you are unlucky, it leads to a debilitating injury early on. Simple facts. Most people can take about four inches of compression in their ass (give or take a few inches) before spinal compression occurs. You legs can give you (again, on average) about 18 inches of compression before they run out of room. Your legs are meant to be landed on, your butt is meant to be sat on. If you are landing with your legs in a slalom water ski position (one in front of the other, slightly offset) you are best prepared for running out a landing, or compressing at the knees to absorb some impact, and if the impact is too great, sliding on one hip (similar to a baseball slide). You can spread out the force of sliding on the entire leg, protect your spine, and pop up at the end. The single biggest mistake most jumpers make is when they flare, they throw their legs out in front of themselves, putting their feet waaaayyyyy out in front of the center of mass. Unless all conditions are right, your center of mass will stay behind your feet, forcing you to butt land. They don't put all the wheels of a 747 in the front for a reason..... Take a good, quality class, learn to save your spine and your ass. top Jump more, post less!
  15. And starting at 26 could be a major distraction to your work, causing you to get fired. Starting at 36 could be a major distraction to your marriage causing you to get divorced. Starting at age 46 could be a major distraction to you family causing your kids to hate you because you are spending their college tuition money. Starting at at 56 could be a major distraction to your retirement plans making it so you have to work longer. Starting at at 66 could be a major distraction to your retirement making it so you miss too many shuffleboard games.... Go jump and decide if the thrill of jumping is worth disrupting your life as you know it. top Jump more, post less!
  16. Like the ultimate game of "52 pickup?" Or did you mean cars? top Jump more, post less!
  17. Apparently, Rich was not swooping at the time of the incident. This was merely an accident. Sorry for any confusion this caused. top Jump more, post less!
  18. An S&TA dropped an improperly-rigged flag weight through the roof of a house less than a year ago, nearly hitting (read=killing) an infant. No change in rating. An S&TA struck and injured an NBC cameraman with an 18' flag on a stadium demo. An S&TA swooped National Guard soldiers on a stadium demo, injuring himself and minor injury to the National Guardsman. No change in rating. Non-S&TA (organizer) warned about a likely incident on a bigway. True to warning, a fatality occurred. Non-S&TA (instructor) warned about a likely incident on a low-time jumper. True to warning, a fatality occurred. Non-S&TA (Organizer) was found to have Photoshopped a State Record. USPA had already ratified the record, issued certificates. 9 months later the record was quietly rescinded with no commentary as to why the rescission occurred. All of the above qualify for Article 1-6. All occurred in the last 18 months. In the above situations (AFAIK) no Article 1-6 was initiated. In the case of Winstock, at least two (I've heard rumor of a third) have been initiated. To specifically answer your question, it already appears that this instance has gone well beyond what Joe Jumper would face. While you were on the board, there were *many* others just as, if not more egregious, but no Article 1-6 was opened. I specifically requested two Article 1-6's to be enacted; both were denied during that period. Both involved fatalities. Even in the face of dead bodies "joe jumper" didn't get investigated, let alone a slap on the hand. Okay. I guess this is just business as usual.... Never mind. Sorry Rich, I thought you were getting away with something, but apparently this is just how its done. top Jump more, post less!
  19. Rather than fight about he said she said, let's look at the facts in play here. Rich swooped a demarcated spectator area and caused significant injuries to another person. If you look up in the USPA Governance Manual, Section 1-6: Disciplinary Actions, under 1-6.4 B "Any USPA member shall be guilty of an offense justifying the imposition of the penalties set forth in the USPA Governance Manual Section 1-6.4.C (below) who- ..... 3. While engaging in any phase of skydiving, is so grossly negligent in his conduct or acts as to imminently imperil his fellow skydivers or aircraft or persons or property on the ground, or wantonly disregards the safety of himself or other persons 4. Engages in any conduct as a skydiver which a person of reasonable prudence would anticipate as being likely to bring public contempt upon himself or herself, or upon skydivers, or upon USPA ..... So, if this was Joe Jumper, would a RD start a 1-6 action and would that be appropriate? Does being on the BOD/Chair of S&T make the jumper more or less answerable for their actions? Would an S&TA lose their rating for doing this? top Jump more, post less!
  20. Ask to see the specific rider that states its not covered. I have never heard of someone denied medical treatment or insurance because of jumping. top Jump more, post less!
  21. Dennis McGlynn made one mistake that caused no injuries. He was banned for life from USPA. So it appears USPA has a zero-tolerance policy.... if it ain't one of their own. top Jump more, post less!
  22. Doesn't matter if it is one spectator or ten thousand, it was bad. top Jump more, post less!
  23. I thought it was about the Concrete Rebound Hammer! Or a faux Canadian ID. top Jump more, post less!
  24. FIFY top Jump more, post less!
  25. I have all three. Am I screwed? You are getting the fourth: the pilot salute. You stand up and rub your butt from sitting in the cockpit all day with the FAA and DZO up your ass. And yes, you are screwed! top Jump more, post less!