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Yes and yes. Weather at that time of year can be variable, but if its jumpable, they turn loads.

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If you get the DVD of Gypsy Moths, this is included on it. I actually like watching this more than the movie!

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aarco

are sponsored by at least one of the top three canopy companies

Bull s#!t...

The best canopy course directors are the ones who have a wide base of knowledge over time. Who pays their way is of no matter as long as they can be objective.

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The real crux of this problem is the people sent out to search need to be prepared. If the DZ shuts down and sends out anyone regardless of training, it can turn into a shit show quickly. Lots of people who shouldn't go wandering out looking for someone will be tempted to. People who think they are in area A are really in area B, so no one searches area A. A few qualified, dedicated, knowledgeable personnel who stay in communication should be the ones looking and rendering aid as necessary. To send everybody everybody may actual hinder the whole search.

With the advent of wing suits we are seeing people further and further from the Drop Zone (real term, not the airport), the sky portion that has to be watched is getting wider and the time frame longer. That can lead to missed jumpers even with dedicated watchers.

I would love to hear from Bryan Burke on this. No one here has the knowledge and experience that he does in this area.

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this.

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Maybe swooping. Bad swoop can equal bad motorcycle crash minus the thousand pounds of spinning metal also trying to kill you.

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Also, some people change email addresses like underwear, others have the same one for years. You could have a lot of deadwood in the system.

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PS. I read mine every time.

Ask those that have helped you get to this jump to celebrate it with you. Instructors, other jumpers, coaches, etc. And make it super simple so it is successful and fun for everyone, no stress.

Buy beer. Or whiskey.

Bring spare clothes, soap, and shampoo.
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JohnMitchell

***I remember back when lifetime memberships were only like $240!!!!!!

Do you remember back when there were no annual fees to "renew" your ratings? That was the case 30+ years ago. What the hell do I get for all that extra dough I pay in every year? I always felt it was a slap in the face to all of us that built their membership base for them.

You get the USPA cruising around doing the bidding of the tandem manufacturers. YAY!

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I have taught a number of students who were done with AFF but not quite to their A licenses yet. I only allow them to be taught one-on-one, and we go over very basic flight. AFF has a lot of canopy information in it, but it seems to get lost in "passing the levels."The freefall portion takes precedence over canopy control in the minds of the instructors and therefore the students.

Being unstable in freefall you are a liability to yourself and a few people around you. If you are weak under canopy, you are a liability to everyone in the sky and on the ground.

Learn early and learn often from experts.

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masterrig

***************or can they both be accomplished at the same time?

Fellatio and cunnilingus have been performed at the same time in numerous occasions, I don't know if they have been done on a skydive.

There must be a reason free-flyers developed both head-down and head-up flying.

They are too busy messing with their cameras to think about airborn 69

What exactly does any of this have to do with answering my question?

I would say, when you feel good enough to jump and as was said, when the drugs wear-off. I'd say too, it's a personal thing. I've had a dry socket and took a small piece of cotton and shoved in in the socket and went on.


Chuck

If you have had routine fillings, cap, or such.. jump when you feel up to it. Extractions may be something more complicated, if treating dentist says "go home and take it easy for a few days." then do that! If it was a routine extraction, no real work to get it out, then maybe jump the next day.

Dry sockets occur when the blood clot comes out of the hole where the tooth was and the bone is exposed to the oral environment long enough to be infected and not heal/close over. Its no fun to have or to treat. Pretty much its usually lower teeth in the back on a smoker. Don't be that guy.

I treat lots of skydivers, they seem bound and determined to not heed my advice until it hurts. So my advice is "Do what you want until it hurts. Then my fee doubles."

I also do not see a reason to wait for the anesthetic to wear off before oral sex. I don't care if your mouth can feel anything....

Medical/dental advice on the interwebs is sketchy at best and flat out wrong often.

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DOC

I hang out with Haley every so often still. You will be glad to know that God has gotten even with him... his daughter is drop dead gorgeous and super smart! A dad's worst nightmare! (but being a dz kid, she can take care of herself!)

Thanks for the pictures, sorry I missed out on the Antioch experience. When i got out here in the late 80's, all the guys talked and talked about that place with great fondness. you should be proud of the legacy you built!

Blue skies!
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You guys make me want to chuck my gear in the truck this Summer and finish my Jumpmaster rating that I started in 1988. AFF may have taken hold in most places, but I still feel SL offers a better all-around program for students.

I'm glad to see people care about it enough to not only keep it around, but improve it.

Thanks!
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BillyVance

And if its a federally-funded airport, they HAVE to allow skydiving there, so the witch leading the CFQS can go suck donkey cock.

That's just mean!!

There is no way she does that, donkeys are way too loud and they have standards.

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DanG

Quote

... they look at humans as a source of food...

You should edit that. dogbites.org will quote that out of context.

They need me alive. Only I and my fellow humans can work the magical food dispensing cabinet and keep them fed. And rub their bellies, and sit on the floor while they nap on the couch.

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BIGUN

***I'd find a better source than "dogsbite.org". Not exactly neutral.

Even taking the statistics at face value (which I'll address below) they can't discriminate what caused the dog to bite. Nat (and apparently you) claim that there is something in the dog's genes that makes them more likely to bite. You can't prove that with a statistic that says they bite more often. I can equally claim that they bite more often because their owners are less responsible on average, and more likely to encourage aggressive behavior.

As far as the staistics go, they are also questionable. Every time there is an aggresive dog in the news, it is likely to be reported as a pit bull. That doesn't mean that it is. As an example, there was a viral video last year of a cat saving a toddler from a dog attack. The dog was widely repprted as a pit bull, even though on the video it was clearly not.

Anyway,like I said, if an owner doesn't want a pit bull (or wants one for the wrong reasons) then they shouldn't get one. They can be very loving and friendly dogs, but they are not for everyone.

You asked to cite a source, which I did
You don't like that source because you don't agree with it.
Then, you make it my responsibility to find another source.

Did you even read the fatalities report... kinda hard to dispute the fact of death by
Tell you what, unless you find a source that disputes the facts I presented; I'll let my source stand.

Dogsbite.org is THE anti pitbull site. Not neutral by a long shot. Its like quoting Citizens for Quiet Skies for skydiving related issues. Direct quote form their website: "DogsBite.org is a public education website about dangerous dog breeds, chiefly pit bulls."

This is a better group and a look at causes of dog attacks: http://nationalcanineresearchcouncil.com/dogbites/dog-bite-related-fatalities/

I agree that heading to the local shelter is the best bet. Check the city and SPCA shelters. You would be amazed at the wonderful dogs that have been there for months. Spend some time interacting with the dogs, let the personalities come out. Some may have been there long enough that they have shut down.

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PS I own two pits. They are sofa queens, they look at humans as a source of food, entertainment, and love. I am cautious with my dogs not because of what they may do, but people's reaction to them. I also work to educate people about the breed and how good they are.... and how awful some people can be.

There is a huge factor being ignored here. Thirty years ago, there was so much less skydiving knowledge to know to be an expert. Today, there are more disciplines, more types of canopies, more canopy materials, more types of aircraft being used regularly, and a greater ability to garner knowledge from around the world. Those are just a few factors. An "expert" in skydiving may have only needed 500 jumps back then to truly have mastered enough areas of the sport to feel confident, but today that number is just enough to qualify you to start learning more things.

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cpoxon

She appears to be "following the money" now...

http://www.dailycamera.com/guest-opinions/ci_27054767/kimberly-gibbs-longmont-airport-woes-self-inflicted

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OPINION: GUEST OPINIONS

Kimberly Gibbs: Longmont airport woes self-inflicted
POSTED: 12/02/2014 07:49:45 PM MST

The Colorado Division of Aeronautics is taking some well-deserved heat for grossly overestimating next year's tax revenue from aviation fuel sales. This revenue is used to fund the Colorado Discretionary Aviation Grant Program (DAGP), which supports runway maintenance and other improvement projects for Colorado's 74 public-use airports. The grants for 2015 were initially projected at $15 million, but they were recently revised downward to $3 million - a $12 million shortfall.

Colorado airport managers harshly criticized the division's wild miscalculation. And Longmont airport manager Tim Barth stated that the funding cutbacks will hamper airport and economic growth down the line ("Colorado airport officials admit errors, vow to save grant program," Denver Post, Nov. 19). But there is more to this story than meets the eye.

For those of us who have analyzed the airport budget, it is obvious, at least in Longmont's case, that the funding crisis has been years in the making and largely self-inflicted. Longmont officials have fully embraced a budget model that relies too heavily on federal and state subsidies, and not enough on revenue from airport users - a tiny fraction of residents who actually benefit from the airport. City officials are responsible for charging reasonable fees to use airport property. Yet for many years Longmont has elected to leave money on the table, as the following examples show.

1. The airport has designated a Parachute Landing Area, aka skydive drop zone, covering about 40 acres. Assuming for a moment that the best use for this prime real estate is a drop zone, shouldn't the city earn revenue from its use?

The Longmont Municipal Code (section 4.64.040) clearly specifies a $7,500 annual fee for the use of airport property and further states that no one may use this area without first obtaining an applicable permit. Yet, curiously, the city is not assessing this fee. In fact, there have been no drop zone fees assessed since June 1999.

2. In 2007 the city leased about 180,000 square feet of airport property to a skydive operator. The initial annual lease amount was $41,566 (roughly 23 cents per square foot.) The skydiving company currently enjoys the use of that land. However, that lease is still considered "inactive" and no fees have been assessed or collected - ever.

3. In 2004 and 2007 the city considered a modest $1 per jump fee, which would generate more than $30,000 in airport revenue annually. Both times, this funding option was rejected. Again in February 2012, the Airport Advisory Board (AAB) revisited the proposed fee. A brief discussion followed in which a city employee described the airport budget as "bare bones." Still the AAB voted unanimously to strike all information regarding the skydiving jump fee from the Airport Business Plan, thus hampering any further consideration by the city council. The result: zero revenue.

Longmont officials have a fiduciary duty to manage the airport finances ethically and in the best interests of the community. The first step toward solving the airport budget crisis is ending the great giveaway program. Airport users should pay a fair market rate for use of airport property - especially private businesses that are reaping enormous profits and enjoying a free ride at taxpayer expense.

Kimberly Gibbs is a Boulder County resident and the organizer of Citizens For Quiet Skies.

#3 is flat out illegal according to the Feds. Cities and states have tried that and been told in no uncertain terms that such a tax is not allowed. The "short discussion" may have been that... a short discussion about the fact it is illegal. And $30K a year on a $12 Million dollar shortfall is not even a drop in the bucket, its just wishful thinking.

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Shibu-

Come out to NorCal and I will do a class with you. Day, weekend, whatever you need. Just cover slots.

Please don't wait until the dead of winter, I am from California and hate the cold....

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brodg

If this is the case then the statistics change from 1 in 133.333 (0.00075%) to 10.000 in 133.333 (7.5%). That's right!: If everyone has the same chance of dying per jump and you want to do 10.000 jumps in your life, you have a 7.5% chance of getting killed! How fucked up is that?

Completely effed up. Statistically speaking that is. You made the odds cumulative right there and they are not.

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JohnMitchell

***I hope that's not a trend in the sport. I personally know two jumpers who would clearly be dead had they not performed solid PLF's.

From what I've seen, it is a trend, Chuck.

In the 70's and early 80's, round student canopies meant a lot of PLF practice or a lot of injuries. Try as I could, I never got my injury rate below ~3%. Lots of sprained ankles and the occasional broken bone.

Of course, the advent of the (usually) soft landing student square canopies made injuries almost a thing of the past. Any kind of flare on those big bad boys seemed to yield an injury free, if not graceful, landing. Dedicated PLF practice in the FJC became minimalist to non-existent.

To this day I still have the students do 3-4 PLF's, hopping off a trailer fender maybe 2' above the pea gravel. I'd like to give better training but we don't have a dedicated PLF platform at the DZ, so I improvise. I think some of the instructors skip it entirely.

As any experienced jumper knows, sooner or later you're going to have a hard landing. PLF's have kept me out of the hospital more than once. For us former round jumpers, they're almost reflexive. Unfortunately, I've seen way too many serious injuries among newer jumpers who were never really trained to PLF and didn't when they really needed to. A simple poor landing turns into 6 months in a cast and maybe never jumping again.

If you don't know how to PLF, learn how. It may really save your a$$ someday.

I can't reiterate this enough! Definitely saved me on a number of occasions and when it really mattered. So many AFFI's feel it is not worth the time to teach and the students don't know they aren't getting it.

Learn em, live em, do em.

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billvon

>My understanding is that the 100-way Canopy Formation World record showed up on radar.

It would also have the advantage of having a considerable ground speed (depending on winds of course.)

I think at 13K they said we were doing 50 but slowed as we got lower. I think it was a 64 way then...

Wonder what the radar image looked like!

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My understanding is that the 100-way Canopy Formation World record showed up on radar. Of course it was the size of a building!

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ASOT_QC

JUST DON'T EVER LET GO OF THE TOGGLES ONCE YOU UNDO YOUR BRAKES!

A good candidate for the worst internet skydiving advice ever.

Don't drop your toggles when you are trying to use them. Don't drop your toggles when they are pulled down, they could snap up and around your slider, riser, or GoPro.


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rwieder

Quote

It's about politics and money, not about members and safety.

I'm calling "Foul" on this statement. If the members of the USPA, of which I am one of them feel so strongly about this incident/topic, call your regional director, attend a meeting. Raise some cane! If my numbers are half-way right, we're some 34K T/ 35K strong. If everyone is sooooo unhappy about this incident and hasn't made any phone calls, or attended a meeting, then stop the whining and crying. Christ sakes. We're the one who put the BOD where they are, they are elected officials, we are their constituents, they represent US. Ask them to do their jobs and we need to stop the complaining, and making rude remarks. C'mon, whuddya say?

You are free to call it whatever you want, that doesn't change my opinion.

I have called/emailed my RD about this. He and I talk often as I am one of his S&TA's. You assumed that this was the only avenue I am taking, I assure you that is false.

I served on the BOD, several of them have contacted me regarding this incident. Some are not happy with the criticism about this incident, others welcome it.

If someone at the DZ I am the S&TA did this, they would be out, as they are too dangerous to be around me, the students, the public, and my friends. I would then refer the action to my RD for further review. And I would expect some action to occur! Especially if it was an instructor.

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