Han-Solo

Proxyflying is soooo last year. FTL2 sets the bar real low for Limboflying. The film is a true inspiration when it comes to technical lines and controlled flight. The precision in contouring the terrain, altering glideratios according to the lines and visualizing the flights with smoke, exciting shooting angles and twoways, sets the standard for presenting wingsuitflying in a spectacular way. Also the array of different jumps and excellent terrain keeps the jaw dropped through the whole session. Thank you guys! I remember watching the snowboard gurus ripping deep pow on the mountain sides of Alaska before an upcomming season. For the first time since, I got that same sensation. I wanna do what they do! I'm gonna do what they do! Bigwall season is upon us

Nice to see my home cliffs being put to good use. Very nice!

So you all agree PdG is the only one to ever do this... Is it online somewhere?

Don't get me wrong. My contribution was merely fractional. But it seemed that they had used footage from a lot of various sources. Can't imagine they're all rightfully approved. Me... I'm just glad to be a part of it

Wow... I'm impressed. "...but whatever you do, don't call them crazy." Who would have thought this would be a media statement regarding ws flyers, in our lifetime. Nice piece, keeping it real. ps. What about footage rights? This was a comprehensive collection of quality footage. Anyone been asked if it was ok? Not me...

Nice!

Maybe I wasn't being clear Give a little distance, gain even more dive-ability. Get speed, easy (BOC) pull and handling as well. That's all. ps. as I said; no back inlets...

This season I’ve been jumping a new prototype suit from Phoenix called Shadow. It is basically a modified Vampire, where the wings have been cut shorter. Wing handle is about 10 cm and the leg wing is cut slightly concave from toe to toe. It has the deflector like Vampire, but with a lower profile. Arm wing air inlets are pushed back on the shoulders and have a more diagonal cut than the regular Vampire. Also the arms have gotten an extra layer of foam cushion to make the leading edge smoother and give it a little shape. There are no stiffeners in the wings. Since I got it, I’ve put about 15 skydives and 35 basejumps on it, trying a range of different moves and maneuvers. My reference is pretty much from the GTi, but I’ve also flown the Firebird and the MTR3 suit on occasions. Little need to say that this one is quite different. At first I found the suit to be a bit twitchy. I had trouble figuring out my speed in relation to the stall speed. Sometimes I felt I was going fast and steady but then all of a sudden after a slight flare it started to wobble and act “stally”. Other times I would start to flare the suit before the pitch and there where lots of power left. Since the suit is so much faster overall than my old GTi I really had to spend some time learning to read the speed. But once I figured that out it helped a lot. The stall point kind of sneaks up on you and I feel I have to be very gentle when trying to push for distance. But when I manage it has quite a bit of distance ability within it. The speed of the suit is very high. Going at the same glide angle as my fellow jumpers, they really struggle to keep up. This provides very good stability when you’re not closing in on the stall point. Flying like this the power in turns and the general response is fantastic. I really enjoy having dynamic flights with it, picking up speed through a turn then flaring it out feeling the forces and then diving into another turn. It gives the feeling of riding on tracks. The diving ability of the suit is very good. With the steeper inlets arm wings stay pressurized and the whole suit is stable at glide angles as low as 50-60 degrees, at least. I have not done head down with arm wings exposed, but I wouldn’t be surprised if someone managed to. This steep flying ability opens up a lot of possibilities when it comes to carrying the speed through a dive and into a flare. Dirty flying at low speed is OK by just bending the knees and hips and stabilizing with the arms. Barrel rolls are second nature (as with most suits I guess) and back flying is also easy to control. There are no back inlets, but it flies stable and as long as I arch my back enough it gives some distance as well. Performing two ways on my back with another pilot facing me shows that the other guy doesn’t really have to get dirty as long as I stay in position. Front flips are a bit trickier. Due to the relatively large leg wing the tuck has to be tight and firm to come all the way around. It requires some timing to fly it steady right afterwards. Sometimes I go into a dive and occasionally I’ve ended up on my back, sit flying it, and then having to flip it back into a dive… not a bigwall move just yet. The suit comes (at least this one did) with a pouch, but in my opinion there is no need for it. The cut of the wings allows for a nice pitch from the BOC, unless maybe you have a very short container. Leg wing and booties does not really allow for a running exit, just a step or two. Landings with booties are OK for a larger canopy or a head wind. These are just my experiences with this suit, and as we all know it’s mostly in the pilot. I don’t have a lot of experience with other suits apart from the GTi, which is somewhat different (basically just a lot slower and less glide ratio range). I was supplied with this suit from Robert to test it and tell you what I thought of it. My general opinion is that it is an overall good performance suit and fits the type of flying here in Norway very well, and it is also a blast from the plane. Hans, VKB #11

Don't know much about the AM part, but over here "low" guyed towers are commonly used as first time objects. With the right wind conditions they are regarded as rather safe objects. My first was a 135m (~400ft), with three sectors. I know you're quite into the bridges over there, but alternative approaches can work aswell. But then again it's common to start from bigwalls here... The pca part sounds strange though. Why not take a second, handheld? The perfect/safest approach to base is easy to outline, but for many the reality may be a compromise (risk, available objects, time, cost, contacts, etc.). Very few of us have tried the ideal version.

When did this degenerate into a "Huh.., so how many jumps have you got.."-thread? I thought it was about what we think is cool to watch online and what is not (regarding snittflyging in this case). Through setting a standard to what is appreciated, we might inspire people to achieve control before recklessness.

then it's worth it I will try to clarify. Many people are amazed and inspired by what they do. I am one of them. Maybe you're not. Did you notice the " "? Agree I don't really see the big difference. The reasons may vary, but the result are the same. Of course different media has different audiences, so that must be taken into consideration. Something might be OK at a friend’s party but not on national TV. But most of the time we're somewhere in between Exactly, and that puts the pressure and responsibility on them to fight the corporate/commercial demand. Probably very difficult, but in my opinion it goes with the job. In this case this is the only area where I argue they should have acted differently. I totally agree. Actually I think all practicing basejumpers feel this way and in a way every jump is in part this statement. I know. I'm not claiming any authority here at all. In a way I feel more like throwing rocks in a greenhouse (sorry, couldn't help it), as I can imagine some people might have been inspired by it. Actually there was some discussion on whether or not it was "responsible" to release. The conclusion was that as long it showed controlled jumps that we were not embarrassed by, it was OK. Some of the stuff in the extras section does not fit under that phrase. But there's the carnage-value... No I won't. Unless he's being whacked by some guy that's sick of seeing hairy jump on the internet. Apparently I'm "telling" him something else than you think I am. Some may argue that "proximity-flying" starts when full flight is achieved. Rob hit the ground because the rockdrop was too low and the talus wasn't steep enough. Not exactly true. Having done five ws jumps in suit I didn't pay for doesn't give me any insight. Maybe if I had I would understand the pressure to release "carnage footage" on the internet better. Sorry to hear, cause I think this is kind of valuable. Didn't have the heart to drag him down all alone. Some really nice flying there by the way. My point is how it is presented, and I perceive you as being a part of that. Maybe (I think many would have acted pretty much the way he did, as there is not much else you can do), but I don't think it deserves a round of applause. And the idea that he made it due to his "calm, clear-headed and fast response" is a bit out there.

Spot on. But it's not only the press. It's probably even more how the community (in this case that would be the "proxy-comunity") responds to this stuff. Example: if you're a snowboarder doing a 1260-rodeo-stalefish-to-fakie and don't stick it, is that "cool"? Even if the sponsors get their airshots, I doubt you will be on the cover of snowboarders magazine. My reference was not to a "Jeb flaming thread" (maybe if you'd take a look at it you'd notice). It was a thread starting out as "look-at-this-it-is-so-cool" until a certain mister on holiday pointed out that maybe it wasn't cool at all since it appeared to lack the element of control. It had nothing to do with Jeb at all. And that is another part of my point. If we flame "up-and-comers" for showing off before they got it nailed, we have to have the same standards for the "gods". Actually it is ten times as important, since they are the ones in the limelight. (but of course i'm jealous, who isn't) Anyway. this is not about flaming anyone. It's about defining what we as a community appreciate when it comes to people flashing their "look at me" videos. It's about what flies and what doesn't. And to me it definitely doesn't fly when it relies on luck. But when it does fly, I apreciate it a lot. For instance I have enormous respect for the achievements of Jeb and Luigi and the stuff they have done. But that doesn't mean I will let it pass when I feel it shouldn't. The sheep scare me too. But I guess to me the sheep are the ones that approve of uncontrolled stunts, just because they are performed by "gods".

not really. if your life depended on it not dropping, would you call it anything but a failure if it did? even if you survived? "occasionally" is not a phrase in the classic physics dictionary (we're not dealing with quantum physics here). So it's up to your performance. Me talking about "half a meter" earlier was a figure of speech. The point is that you have to set the margins as to what ocasionally happens. That's why we (some of us at least) don't jump underhung lowcliffs with nasty taluses on a regular basis ("occasionally" is a phrase in the BASE manual, appears before 180) We can all make mistakes, but isn't it more productive to learn from them than to brag about them? Were the margins wrong? Did something out of the ordinary happen? In that case, what? Unpredictable windy conditions? Unpredicted suit performance (stiching, fabric, grippers...)? All i know is, something or someone failed. Without analysing what it was, it will happen again. For sure. Especially if it is portrayed as "cool".

Don't know if it matters, but I'll share some thoughts regarding this event and the likes in general. This is directed towards Jeb and Luigi in particular. Being the "gods" they are, even if they don't know how to take care of themselves, they do know it's up to them and them only to do so. But I feel a bit awkward when this kind of stuff is presented the way it is. Another discussion/flaming comes to mind. Maybe it was in order, I don't know. But I suspect it was. If for no other reason than the signalling effect. At least I will not project the idea that doing stunts that rely on anything but technique, training, planning and control, is cool at all. That's just me. I love to see radical flying being pulled of. But don't bother showing it until you have it dialed. (unless it has a carnage value) We all make mistakes. We all make judgment calls that shouldn't have been made. And we learn. We also try to teach others from our mistakes, so the same ones don't have to be repeated over an over. One thing I don't think we should do when we have made a mistake is to a)pretend it as planned and therefore not a mistake b)brag about how rad it turned out to be c)flash it as a success when your survival was due to pure luck I guess this can be very hard when the sponsor angel/demon is looking over your shoulder. But I for one would prefer not seeing unsuccessful stunts portrayed as "the coolest stunt ever". I base my point of view on the "facts" that 1- Luigi hit a branch in freefall -> cannot have been planned, therefore a failure 2- "he was white as a sheet" -> he narrowly escaped death and he knew it. In my opinion luck is the only factor here, and there was a lot of it. 3- Seeing the uncontrolled pre-pull sequence tells me he was not in control (might have been due to being "white as a sheet") (4)- In my opinion the video shows scary and dangerous flightpattern on Luigi's side, (and I'm not talking about the flyby itself) with less then full speed and good working range. I'd interpret this to be poorly planned and/or poorly executed. I'm open for a discussion as to how these flights should be made (technically). If any or all of these "facts" are not correct, please enlighten me. Of course there is a lot to be learned from unsuccessful events. So what about this one? Please share with us, Jeb and Luigi. I'm eager to learn all I can. Or maybe you disagree with everything I've said? If so I'd appreciate if you'd explain why.

ps. what's up with the "box-position" pull on the first flier? I know Luigi is a skygod and all, but seriously... Since this is technically a skydive, i'd call a case for stupidity and luck

Be careful out there. When flying like this, accidently finding yourself half a meter lower than planned is not cool, an I'd call it a total failure. I'm glad he survived. Not saying this was the case here, but the idea that "flying slightly dirty would give you the ability to climb relitive to you flight path. If you cut it close maxed out you have nothing left if you get low. " is all wrong and must not be practiced when doing close flybys. This kind of flying has ended with close-calls several times and maybe at least one fatality (DW? not sure about this, I wasn't there, but a reliable(?!) rumor indicates that it might have been the case). In my opinion this kind of flying should only be done with lots of speed and on a steeper glide angle than you are capable of. Anyway, looked like a whole lot of fun.

I did. I was being sarcastic...

In a sense this is my theory. And there is not much we can do about it, apart from not showing anyone the door. I don't believe gear development is ever going to help the statistics. It doesn't affect it all. And I don't think education has anything to do with it either. If there is a connection it's probably that good education and good gear makes more people start jumping and the list increases. Yet the relative fatality rate stays the same. example: "i mean why would a person whith less than 100BASE start doing arials?" Because with the good gear and the good education, that's what it takes to make him tick. It used to be figuring out how to survive taking the stoneage skydiving gear off a building. It's exactly the same. As long as "high sensation seekers" (yes I know it's worn out) are attracted to this activity, we will have a pretty much fixed fatality rate. No matter what we do people are looking (aren't we all) to push their limit. So by having splendid gear and the best education the limit has just shifted. That doesn't mean we won't push it, where ever it is. The question is how can we affect the numbers. My theory: 1- by not bringing people into this activity, the additions to the list (numbers/year) will drop 2- by attracting other personalities ("low sensation seekers", i.e. stamp collectors) the rate will drop So what is it we want actually? Do we want the numbers down, or do we want the rate down? Both of course. Easy, just stop jumping.

How can you be so sure about this? I'd guess we jump a whole lot more than ever, so maybe this assumption is all wrong. The development of "what the whole community is doing with jump style, jump numbers, jump objects, etc" has everything to with it as well. But wouldn't the level of relative individual danger within our group be more or less constant as long as the activity attracts the same kind of personalities. I mean the degree of pushing our boundries as a group is probably not changing that much. Or?

getting out of the zorb in freefall could be really interesting

downstream from the blade there is a rotational force the size of the blade diameter, that turns the opposite way of the turbine. i've never jumped one, this is just purely theoretical, but might be something to consider. i guess the downdraft can be noticeable if you fly out of the wake on the side where the blade are rising. anyone with experience from jumping working turbines ever noticed this?

me norway exactly hell no, that's jeb's project...

don't know about favorite, just thought i'd share this. flying for the crowd...

the first testflight (form a cliff of course) showed a horizontal speed of 210 km/h.