Mr17Hz

Great post. I have seen peer pressure towards people that have canopies that are too large, although in at least one case I feel that it was called for. Landing off the airport 1 out of 5 landings because you can't cut through the wind can be dangerous. This person had a wing loading that was much lighter than 1:1. Matt Christenson [email protected] http://www.RealDropzone.com - A new breed of dropzone manifest software.

FYI, websites using deceptive practices can be reported to google and google will reasearch the claim and remove those sites from all search results perminatly. I had thought about doing this myself, however as a newly formed corporate entity that will be entering into a realm that could be considered competition against skyride, I felt that it was in my best interest not to. Of course, if it is a legitimate complaint and made by someone who has no competing interests... Here is the link: http://www.google.com/contact/spamreport.html Matt Christenson [email protected] http://www.RealDropzone.com - A new breed of dropzone manifest software.

No, I have no intention of targeting any vertical markets other than the skydiving industry; I may however indent on taking small parts of what I’ve done and making DotNetNuke modules for the general public that could be applied to various industries; but I won’t be targeting any one group. I may also make the source for those components available to another company for them to “shrink wrap”, support, and update it. At this time none of this is scheduled; as its profitability is low and my passion exists only in the skydiving component of the work. Breaking into a vertical industry is a very expensive thing to do, unless you know and gain the trust of people in that industry, which is something that can only happen over time. My ability to work in the Skydiving industry has been made possible by various small jobs that I’ve done for a handful of companies over the last few years while I was working full time with another company. All of these jobs are things that I put my heart into because of my passion for the industry. I have no interest in Martial Arts – and so I couldn’t put my heart into the work. RealDropzone represents a very significant investment on my part; I walked away from a salary that was more than three times what I expect to see over the next few years, this is a long term investment for me. After RealDropzone is completed and tested, I have plans to bring the Skydiving Industry into a new marketing era with commission based Pay-Per-Lead online advertising capabilities, and B2B order services. Commission based Pay-Per-Lead advertising pays advertisers only when a user actually signs up for an account and makes a purchase. Purchases will be made directly on the dropzones website, however advertisers who are proven (by RealSkydiving’s B2B hub) to have drawn that user to the site then make a percentage of all purchases that user makes at that dropzone for a set period of time, usually 12-18 months. This type of advertising is attractive for a few reasons: • Dropzones only pay for advertising that has absolutely made them money. • Advertisers are paid based on success, not exposures, and so they are more likely to place ads in places where demographics show them more success. Dropzone’s can pay significantly more than the average site because purchases are usually in excess of $180, dwarfing the commissions made on things like books (if advertised correctly). This is the type of advertising that’s used in many big businesses like the hotel and travel industries, as well as big ecommerce sites. The reason it is not widely spread is because the software necessary to track purchases all the way from the users original entry point to the website is advanced, and not available to most small businesses or companies. Advertisers are vulnerable in that service and retail shops could lie about sales and never pay Advertisers. To further complicate this, there is no perfect science to tracking users, advertisers need to assume that a certain percentage of the leads they made will not be reliably tracked. This is due to privacy settings that some people use on their browsers. Using default settings – if you follow a link and then leave, but then go back to the site 5 weeks later and sign up and make a purchase, a cookie is able to provide that advertiser with the lead, however if a different computer is used, or persistent cookies are cleared – there is no way to track it. The way this issue of trust is usually handled is by a 3rd party (In this case, RealSkydiving, Inc.) who gains the trust of advertisers by showing them results from an entire user group that is in the same vertical industry (requiring similar demographic studies) This kind of advertising tied into a product like RealDropzone is what will allow even small dropzones to have companies like Travelocity or Ticketmaster or Myspace or YouTube or Google selling goods at $15 commission per sale, using their demographics to present ads to regional users who are the most likely to make the purchase. In the future, dropzone’s won’t have to try to think of new innovative ways to bring in clients through online means because they will have marketing giants doing it for them to make the commission. And guess what – no unethical business practices need to take place for this to work. Customers won’t show up and find out they’ve paid ridiculously inflated prices because they’re paying the prices the dropzone charges everyone. Advertisers will be working as brokers but will never actually see the customer’s money, because the customer purchases directly from the business – instead the Advertiser just gets the commission check. This means dropzones are responsible for their own customer support and so brokers don’t have the possibility of passing on a negative customer experience. See where I’m going here? This stuff is way more interesting than targeting multiple vertical industries, but the first step to making it happen is getting a user group together who run a software product capable of this kind of account tracking: A system that completely integrates web based reservations and event registration with user accounts and manifesting. If I can show *this* to the big dogs in online marketing, the entire skydiving industry will benefit greatly by a fresh stream of new blood, who will all walk away with positive experiences. I’m betting every penny I have on it. Matt Christenson [email protected] http://www.RealDropzone.com - A new breed of dropzone manifest software.

Well, lets look at a couple of things. 1. Cost. For the benifit of those who are American, lets talk in US dollars. At my DZ, a lift to 11000ft AGL costs ZAR185, or about $26.50. That's not cheap. If we're spending money on jumps, we have less to spend on anything else. Currency is safety. Now if we take that same exchange rate and we buy things that are from the US, (Like rigs) or the EU (Like AAD's) our 3rd world currency doesn't go very far. 2. Logistics. It's not uncommon for an AAD sent away to the manufacturer for it's 4 year check to be gone 6 months. It's happened to me. During those 6 months.. you are without an AAD. Same goes when it comes to competition, boogies or courses. Going to any kind of boogie on the scale of the DZ.com boogie is going to cost 3 days travelling and $1200 more than any American would need to spend. My BMI course - a near requirement to get the wingsuit disipline off the ground here, cost me $1500 in plane tickets and course fees. Relatively routine items like risers, PC etc are often the age of the harness they came with, even for senior jumpers. 3. Availability. When your Flex-z's wear out, or you need a new visor for your Oxygen, or you drop a reserve handle or lose a freebag etc, you'd better have planned a month in advance, paid Square One, added 50% import duty and 14% VAT on top of that. Sure, you can rush down to the ONE gear store in the country - but without competition, you'll either buy it yourself, or pay what's asked, which can be daunting sometimes. There was a South American fatality caused by a notch in a "$5 ripcord." We see issues like that often that many US citizens simply will never comprehend. 4. Choice. Mostly, people will buy what's available. Many, many local skydivers don't see the US as their local gear store. As our currency slipped against the USD, the Euro and the GBP, the local manufacturers like Chute Shop (Now Parachute Systems) PISA and later Aerodyne pegged their prices to the international market even though that equipment was made in South Africa with South African labour and material. Every weekend I see Naro's, some Invaders, Vulcans (Vector 2 knock-offs) with shoddy pin and riser protection and knackered spandex and velcro pouring through the door. I see SSE Altimaster 2's that have done the rounds longer than I have been jumping and have never had a service - doing the rounds from jumper to jumper as they start and stop every 3 - 5 years, never knowing the history of the gear. I've spent enough time on enough US DZ's to know that this is seldom the case where you live. It wasn't at Eloy 2004, or Perris 2005, or Crosskeys 2006. It's the norm here. Apart from maybe 50 South Africans with enough International exposure to know what they want - regardless of cost, the other 700 odd jumpers in the country are happy with locally made gear with riser covers that don't cover - or some mid 90's Jav that a visiting jumper left here. I see people from the US complaining of the weakness of their currency against the Euro.. and I wonder. How many of you would boogie if Europe was the closest and cheapest boogie spot? If you think the dollar is weak against the Euro, ours is 10 to one. t These are exactly the facts and opinions that I was looking for; thank you for taking the time to write them. Matt Christenson [email protected] http://www.RealDropzone.com - A new breed of dropzone manifest software.

As someone living in Africa, I'd have to call bullshit on that. t As someone living in Africa, would you like to be a little less useless with your post and elaborate? I read your PM but I don't feel that editing my original reply is called for. I attempted to start a positive discussion about incident statistics as a whole, and started the conversation with a few ideas to work with. One of those was the suggestion (it was a suggestion based on the context that I wrote it, in a paragraph that was clearly brainstorming ideas and not siting sources of fact) that all areas of the jumping world have access to the same equipment. As far as I know, there are no trade agreements that prohibit the sale of parachuting equipment to foreign countries. I could be incorrect on this, but I do not know of any. Social is defined as : relating to human society and its members; "social institutions"; "societal evolution"; "societal forces"; "social legislation" Political is defined as: of or relating to your views about social relationships involving authority or power; "political opinions" Government is defined as : the organization that is the governing authority of a political unit; "the government reduced taxes"; "the matter was referred to higher authorities" Govern is defined as : regulate: bring into conformity with rules or principles or usage; impose regulations; "We cannot regulate the way people dress"; "This town likes to regulate" Economy is defined as : the system of production and distribution and consumption Based on these definitions, I would classify the lack of a strong economy to be a social reason for equipment not being available, as there are no restrictions that prohibit individual jumpers from making half as many jumps, and purchasing better equipment. We're dealing with an entertainment industry that is expensive. Jump tickets are expensive anywhere in the world. I see low time jumpers in the US making only 30-40 jumps a year and jumping with quality 2nd hand 5 year old equipment that cost them around the cost of 150 jumps. I also see jumpers making 200 jumps a year jumping with less than par equipment (I consider jumping without an AAD, with the exception of jumps when they become less reliable, aka aggressive canopy flight, to be less than par). These are people that are clearly making the decision based on cost and not safety. If you feel that a difference in the equipment being used is a contributing in fact a in the difference in incident numbers from region to region, then why don't you let us all know what kind of equipment is being jumped; and lets take a look at the number of fatalities in Africa and other parts of the world that were, or could have been, cause by not having better equipment available. I would guess, but I don't know - that we would see that a majority of the incidents that took place did not have to do with the quality of equipment, but instead choices that people made during the last 10 minutes of their life. Starting this thread was, in part, an effort to help the community pool thoughts together to help come to an educated group decision; or at the very least - get people thinking. You may have a valid point, and one that we can all learn from, but responding with a one liner calling my brainstorming bullshit is not productive; and is completely hypocritical in that you provide even less basis for your comment than I did for mine. Furthermore, asking me in a private message to remove the statement is insulting, considering that it was in response to your small effort and offensive reply to a post that I made with good intentions to start an educational discussion. Matt Christenson [email protected] http://www.RealDropzone.com - A new breed of dropzone manifest software.

I spent less than an hour putting that site together, I have been concentrating my efforts on the product and will update the site after I have more to talk about. Thanks for your comments. Matt Christenson [email protected] http://www.RealDropzone.com - A new breed of dropzone manifest software.

As someone living in Africa, I'd have to call bullshit on that. t As someone living in Africa, would you like to be a little less useless with your post and elaborate? Matt Christenson [email protected] http://www.RealDropzone.com - A new breed of dropzone manifest software.

Good luck.... I had tried DotNetNuke on a very beefy webserver... I ran into bugs left and right. The worst was that, the first page, if no longer in the cache of the server, would take upwards of a minute to load. I found some aftermarket plugins to "fix this problem" by basically running the homepage every timer click - so the site would never leave the cache, or if it did, the daemon, not the user, would have to wait forever... I could never get the daemon to work. If you have solved this problem or know anything about it, please let me know. I would have liked to use dotnetnuke for the skydiving league, but instead opted for good-olde HTML/Dreamweaver because I ran out of testing time and the ROI became cheaper just to abandon dotnetnuke... I'm sure that something was not configured or working properly. I have seen a server host over a hundred individual websites - durring peak times serving 50,000+ pages an hour. Over the past 4 months I've reviewed close to 70% of the source code of the core product in great detail; which was necessary for me to create the modules that I have, it is one of the better organized and well written products that I've worked with. Part of using the product sucessfully is identifying what modules have matured enough to rely on them; and only using those modules. Being cautious of 3rd party modules that claim to do things that sound "too good to be true". A few of the core modules are lacking in functionality, but the framework is solid and well written 3rd party modules are available. Writing my own modules, I know I can trust them. The learning curve for understanding how to use DotNetNuke is high, higher than most people would think - too many people dive into a product and feel that they should be able to 'get it' with a few days of fiddling around. The key is in not fiddling, but asking people who know. It took me months of my life to get to the productivity level that I am now - but I can now do things that I would never be able to do with dreamweaver - like not only being able to sit down with someone and walk them through setting up a website very effeciently, but also providing them with a whole suite of event registration, tandem reservation, and account management tools... as easy as adding modules to a content pane. How long ago was it that you looked at DotNetNuke? There was an issue on 2000 servers running IIS5 and the 1.0 framework that cause the application to stop prematurely; perhaps that is the senario that caused your wait times. If you're still interested in using a content management system for www.coloradoskydivingleage.com, email me at [email protected] and I can get a portal set up for you to use. Matt Christenson [email protected] http://www.RealDropzone.com - A new breed of dropzone manifest software.

Slower than I had anticipated, but it's still coming along. The project has grown significantly in scope to accomidate localization (multiple languages, date formats, currency) as well as integrate with www.SkydiveSecure.org, a single sign-on service that provides skydivers with portable profiles - and also serves as a BBB for dropzones, with the minor difference that in addition to accepting complaints, it will proactively survey all participating dropzone customers asking about the service and collecting positive testimonials. Also, all of the web components have been redesigned to be DotNetNuke ( an advanced content management system ) modules, so that dropzones can benefit from easy web content management. I'm currently working out some of the bugs in the event registration component (it needed to be extended to allow for multiple sub events in order to handle registration for the 2007 USPA Nationals). It The event registration system should be live on Skydive Chicago's website in the next couple of weeks. The manifest component is "finished" but has yet to be tested - I ancicipate a month worth of touch up after it goes live in March. If anybody else wants to jump on as a beta implementation, now would be a great time to contact me. I'll also be at the PIA Symposium. I won't have a booth, but I'll be in town all week. [email protected] Matt Christenson [email protected] http://www.RealDropzone.com - A new breed of dropzone manifest software.

I noticed that the Safety Section of DZ.COM has not been updated in a while. Has anybody been taken a running total of North American and Worldwide fatalities in 2006? Currently the safety section shows 17 north american fatalities in 2006, the latest recorded one on Nov 25th. I'm not sure if this is complete up until that date. 2005 showed 30 North American fatalities. 2004 showed 23 North American fatalities. From what I've gathered through various sources, there are around 300 dropzones in the US and 300 in the rest of the world. I don't know how acurate this is. 2005 showed about equal incidents in North America and the rest of the world. (30 vrs 29) 2006 seemed to bring us considerably more incidents in the rest of the world than it did north america (17 vrs 31 - based on the incomplete information in the safety section of DZ.COM). I wonder, is this a reflection of the sport loosing popularity in North America and gaining in popularity in other places; or is it a reflection of North America getting smarter in their training / education? All regions of the world have access to the same equipment benefits; so it would seem that the difference in numbers must be caused by something social. Ideas? Matt Christenson [email protected] http://www.RealDropzone.com - A new breed of dropzone manifest software.

You could do it; the demand is there, the hardest part is going to be getting the attention of the demand. The best way to do that is to underbid the competition and produce equal or superior quality, while providing equal or superior service. Because experience of efficiency is not on your side – this means loosing money the first few years… After year two you’ll have repeat and word of mouth business coming in, and by year three you’ll have a little bit of branding on your side. If you can pull through those first three years aggressively – you could be up with the rest of the ‘big’ guys by year 4. Good luck. Matt Christenson [email protected] http://www.RealDropzone.com - A new breed of dropzone manifest software.

There is opportunity for Consulting work after you're able to establish yourself as a professional in a certain feild. Advertising and Marketing, Sales, Software design, inventing gear, operating retail stores, etc... Of course, you're probably not going to get rich doing it. I just recently quit my comfortable salaried position to start a software company for the skydiving industry. My success point right now is that 5 years from now I want to be making the salary that I was 6 months ago, and 12 months from now I want to be making 1/2 of what I was 6 months ago. On the plus side, the job gives me the ability to be my own boss, travel around from dropzone to dropzone, and always be at the airport, and make skydives on my lunchbreak. There are a lot of positions out there to be taken, but there are also a lot of people who would love a job in the industry - to get the good jobs you need to do something that will differentiate yourself from others; bringing in needed skillsets and being willing to accept less pay than you would in other industries is part of that. Being able to put in 60-70 hours a week when the work is available is another. I think your best bet is becoming a professional in a general feild; and then entering the Skydiving industry with that. Only a small portion of people that enter the 'normal DZ jobs' ever move from what that job is.... but then again - many of them wouldn't give it up for the world; the pay isn't great - but the benefits are hard to match. -Matt www.RealSkydiving.com

Only 5 minutes? That's 5 times the amount of freefall time you get in a skydive... Make the time feel like longer - one thing you might do i start the presentation by asking everyone to remember *this* moment - then introduce yourself and the fact that you skydive and a few short points, then exactly 60 seconds into your presentation, identify that that's exactly how long everyone would have had to fly around weightless with their friends. Matt Christenson [email protected] http://www.RealDropzone.com - A new breed of dropzone manifest software.

Wishing a fast and full recovery to a man who's heart has always been in the best interest of everyone. Matt Christenson [email protected] http://www.RealDropzone.com - A new breed of dropzone manifest software.

And therin lies the crux of the matter with skyride and others who advertise that they are located in your area when in fact they are not. The simple words that pop up saying "Skydive XXX" indicate that the DZ is IN that city when it is really in another one. Deceptive in my book. PS: Please tell me that Disney World ad did not say that it was in your city when in fact it is 1000 miles away from you. I don't see anywhere that anyone has protested anybody advertising in any particular place...magazine, newspaper, billboard, internet or elswhere. That has not been the point. Sorry you got side-traacked on that. Let me clerify what I was trying to get at regaurding the disney work reference. Lets say that two companies called "EastCoastSkydiving" and "WestCoastSkydiving" both exist in their indicated regions. I am saying that I do not in any way consider it to be unethical that "WestCoastSkydiving" uses the keyword "EastCoastSkydiving" when purchasing Ad space on google; as long as the content on www.WestCostSkydiving.com, and the search summary displayed to google users in no way implies that they are located on the east coast or is in any way affiliated with EastCoastSkydiving... The keywords that you choose represent the "space" where you decide to advertise. Above someone mentioned that "I searched for EastCoastSkydiving and got results for "WestCoastSkydiving". That is perfectly reasonable and fair as long as WestCoastSkydiving makes no effort to deceive users into thinking that it is located on the WestCoast or that it is any way affiliated with WestCoastSkydiving. I do, however, feel that it would be unethical for WestCoastSkydiving to register a domain name called www.EastCoastSkydiving.com. Currently, unless EastCoastSkydiving actually trademarked their name nationally; this is a perfeclty legal practice. (there is an implied local trademark just by doing business in a local region - but only in the region your'e doing business - that does not include online advertising) . However even though this is legal - my personal opinion is that it is unethical and shitty business practice. A good lawyer may be able to declare it as illeagal through "deceptive advertisement laws" - but I am not a lawyer; all I know as that as far as trademarks are concerned - it would be legal (but unethical). Matt Christenson [email protected] http://www.RealDropzone.com - A new breed of dropzone manifest software.

If your intent is to travel cheap, Skydive Chicago does have a bunk trailer available. If you decide to go that route I would suggest packing a space heater along for the trip, there is no heat in the bunkhouse but there is electricity. Make sure to bring layers - it can get COLD in chicago in november. You shouldn't have a problem finding people to jump with you at SDC, expecially at the very end of the season when less people are around... it's less chaos which gives everyone a little more time to be friendly :) Matt Christenson [email protected] http://www.RealDropzone.com - A new breed of dropzone manifest software.

provides ads to the highest bidder. If Skydive Alpha is on the East coast, and Skydive Beta is on the west coast, and Skydive Alpha decides to pay google to advertise their space using the keywords “Skydive Beta”; there is nothing unethical about that at all. If Skydive Alpha deceptively attempts to convince people who make it to their website that they’re located on the West cost… then there is an ethical problem with that. When it comes down to it, it is more valuable for Skydive Alpha to use the keywords Skydive Alpha; all they need to do is choose to pay a little more money per click. Here is something to consider. Google is a very smart company; they want to provide their customers with the best results and success. While they don’t advertise or guarantee it; they’re actually not randomly showing your ads, they’re showing ads to people they think will click on them. If you use the same computer regularly there is a 85% chance they know where you live down to at least the zipcode… and that means that you’re more likely to be interested in an ad that pushes something in your area. Ads are not displayed randomly; they are displayed in a way that Google’s algorithms suspect they will provide the highest hit rate. This works both ways… if google is not able to identify who you are and what you would be interested in, they’re not going to “waste” ads on you when they know they can get a higher hit rate with a known demographic. To give you an idea of this in action; I just did a search on google for “Skydive”. The paid advertisement at the top of the page was for www.SkydiveMidwest.com, they claim on their ad “Closest to Chicago”. I am from Chicago but I did not type Chicago or Illinois or anything in the subject that would indicate that I am from Chicago… Coincidence? Next, I logged into one of the co-hosted web servers that I maintain which is located at a secured data center in New York City and I did the same search for “Skydive”. The resulting paid at was for “Skydiving Lessons” at www.nepaSkydiving.com – “World Class Tandem Skydiving, Skydiving lessons for PA, NJ & NY”. It is worth mentioning that I NEVER use this cohosted server to browse the web. Asside from service updates, this may have been the first time… but Google must already know where I’m from! Advertising on the web is not as cut and dry as you may initially think. I live around Chicago where there is a six flags great America theme park about an hour away from me. I often pick up those freebee ad magazines they give away outside of restraunts… the ones with real estate for sale, or cars for sale, or restaurants in the area. These are distributed only in the chicago-land area. One I was looking at today over dinner had an advertisement for Disney world. I didn’t see any advertisements for Six Flags great America in that magazine, and yet Disney world is a thousand miles away! Is it unethical for Disney world to advertise in Chicago for their services? Of course not. Does Six flags have the opportunity to also place an add in that same magazine? Sure. There are two casinos within an hour of where I live, one is an hour north, and one is an hour south. Right outside of the south casino is a giant advertisement for the north one… and right outside of the north one is a giant advertisement for the south one. Is this unethical? Of course not. In summary; there is nothing wrong with advertising YOUR SERVICES in ANY region that you feel it would be valuable; however there is a problem with deceptive advertising... deceptive advertising relates to the contect of the ad, not the location of it. Matt Christenson [email protected] http://www.RealDropzone.com - A new breed of dropzone manifest software.

Moving the tunnel would be a lot easier than most might anticipate. Tunnel costs involve licensing to skyventure, matterials for contruction, and assembly. He's already purchase the licensing (although may need to work out a deal for relocation based on regional exclusivity agreements) and the equipment. It all had to arrive on trucks, so it can all be moved on trucks. It all seems a very minor issue when compaired to the cost of moving to (or building) a new airport. Matt Christenson [email protected] http://www.RealDropzone.com - A new breed of dropzone manifest software.

You can withdrawl from an IRA for a few different reasons before you're 59.5 years old without taking a tax penalty. I believe that two of them are the purchase of a first home, and for a childs education. If you're putting money in at 23 I would strongly suggest you max it out with the idea that you'll empty it on your first home; you will need to pay income taxes on it, but not the 10% early withdrawl penatly. I did this a few years ago. This is a particularly good way to go if you have a company that it willing to match contributions. Also, I don't know for sure but I'm pretty confident that (at least for a simple IRA ) the max per year is $6,000. Matt Christenson [email protected] http://www.RealDropzone.com - A new breed of dropzone manifest software.

This year Skydive Chicago had a graduate who had a custom "big-boy" rig built out of various parts that he bought here and there. To be honest I don't know the details, however if you were to call up ParaConcepts and ask for Kirk or Betsy Smith, I believe they were the master riggers involved in making everything happen safely and professionally. ParaConcepts Phone Number 1-815-434-6094 Fax Number 1-815-434-6095 General Email [email protected] Technical Email [email protected] Matt Christenson [email protected] http://www.RealDropzone.com - A new breed of dropzone manifest software.

Interesting hypothesis. Do you have any proof? Why do I not see giant plastic research ballons on my radar scope, then. I've worked dozens of missions with them at Tillamook, OR. Your talk of how radar works is correct, although mine doesn't use the Doppler effect, but to say that something is transparent to radar but also a good reflector sounds illogical. However, I have observed temperature inversions bending radar (think mirages) but that is much different than reflecting radar. What I am saying is that in general terms - air does not effect radio waves (this is actually untrue, particles in the air do but as a level that takes it out of the scope of this conversation). However, if air causes another material that would reflect radio waves (nylon) to take a different physical shape (in this case making it a flat plane) then the originally very weak and scattered reflection becomes more concentrated and it is more likely that a receiver looking for the signal is able to pick it up. Technically speaking, all radar technology needs to consider the Doppler effect. Radio waves are everywhere, from every directions. Even your cell phone emits a signal that travels forever if nothing absorbs it. The further away from the transmitter, the more spread out the electromagnetic radiation becomes, causing the signal to be more difficult to identify. In order to transmit and receive signals with accuracy, radio technology as we know it uses a carrier frequency and different forms of modulation. The most common knowledge modulation types are AM (Amplitude Modulation) and FM (Frequency Modulation). Radar radio doesn't need to carry any more information than is necessary to be able to identify itself when listening to the echo. If you bounce a certain frequency (using unproportional figures for simplicity) off of an object that is not moving at say 10MHz - your echo will be 10MHz. However if that object is moving away from you, the frequency becomes slower - lets say 9.9MHz. If that object is moving closer to you, the frequency becomes faster at 10.1MHz. This is the Doppler effect, and can also be noticed with sound (the textbook example is when a police car drives past you, the siren on his car changes tone slightly from a high pitch, to a lower pitch) Again, these numbers are for the sake of example... the actual change would be much much smaller. A radar can't take a "snapshot" to detect anything. It requires time to work. Radio frequency is quite high, you can receive 100 million wavelengths a second - so from our perspective it seems to work instantly - but it needs to receive the signal for long enough to lock on to the carrier frequency, and then determine small changes in frequency. This is all done with analog electronics because digital computers of today are not powerful enough to make this calculations. Various techniques can be used to assist in making sense of weak signals. One of these is to look for patterns that would represent signals reflecting off of a flat surface that was not at an exact 90 degree angle. These types of analog circuits are commonplace in electronics; but are most commonly implemented in the design of the antenna. The round nature of a balloon is not something most receivers are designed to accomodate (not that it couldn't but it would be a lot of extra unnecessary engineering for most common radar practices). This would explain why an inflated parachute would be more likely to be picked up than a weather balloon. It all comes down to what a particular radar was designed to look for. ATC radar systems may or may not be able to pick up single skydivers. I would be surprised if they did, as they're looking for larger items. They have a larger chance of being able to see a deployed ram-air parachute. The point that I was trying to make is that the air pressure inside of a ram air canopy *would* indirectly make a physical difference in a radar being able to detect that parachute because air is what is giving the parachute a close-to-flat surface, and that most radios are designed to receive signals being sent from (antennas) or reflecting off of (airplanes) relatively flat surfaces. As any radio expert would tell you, what I wrote above isn't 100% accurate from the perspective that I left a lot out about concepts involved in receiving signals... But that was my best job of explaining why the air inside of a ram-air canopy would contribute to the entire parachute becoming easier to see on a radar than if it was not inflated. - without writing a book on radio. While I'm not a professional with radio (I've never made money doing it), about 5 years ago I actually built a radio that I used to measure the distance between the earth and moon by reflecting signals off it. and, It was only a 5 watt transceiver. My original intention was to make a clock that would teach itself what time it was over a few days time based on light changes, and measuring the position and distance of the moon... I only got as far as measuring the distance between the earth and moon before I got bored with the project. Took me about 2 weeks of free time. Matt Christenson [email protected] http://www.RealDropzone.com - A new breed of dropzone manifest software.

It has something to do with the dense air trapped in the cells. And it takes a certain amount of it. Conversations with our pilots and the local ATC seem to indicate that you need a 260+ sf canopy to generate a return. I'm calling Bullshit on that one! Air is transparent to radar, as well as most plastics, such as nylon. But depending on the radar, a small amount of metal will produce a return, such as cable housings, buckles, etc. A techie could tell you much more. I work ATC radar everyday, but our primary (raw) radar is heavily filtered. It would be hard to tell skydivers from random ground clutter. The approach control radar, though, is more sensitive. It doesn't matter that air is transparent to radar. Radar produces electromagnetic fluctuations in the 'radio wave' frequency. For radar to work signals are reflected. The time it takes for the signal sent to return indicates distance, and the doppler shift in the frequency is measured to determine the approximate velocity of the object. Any surface that is ridged is more likely to reflect radio frequency. Air pressure inside of a canopy causes the nylon itself to become extremely taught; and the overall surface to become a flat plain. That tautness will cause more of a signal to be reflected; and the flat surface means that the reflection of the radio signal will be more dense and measurable... so yes, a deployed parachute would increase the chances of being seen on radar. Matt Christenson [email protected] http://www.RealDropzone.com - A new breed of dropzone manifest software.

don't you mean "you don't speak english well? If you're gonna insult the guy try not to look as stupid as you are trying to make him look. I didn't even read the rest of you post because you sound like an ass. (sorry to everyone but that had to be said) It's too bad that you didn't read my post, or you'd have read the next sentence where I gave him more respect than anybody else that bothered to reply did. Not being able to speak 'English well' is not an insult, it's an observation. There are billions of intelligent people in the world that don't speak English. If you left your arrogant bubble long enough to see that the world extends beyond the borders of the united states and english speaking people, perhaps you would not have jumped to conclusion so fast. Your judgement only goes to show that you give little regard to someone who cannot speak English, your post could be considered insulting to billions of people; who's the asshole now? Matt Christenson [email protected] http://www.RealDropzone.com - A new breed of dropzone manifest software.

We've got a winner here. Yeah - when it comes down to it; having a plane larger plane is the answer here. Both from the business and the safety perspective. Business: more economical, doesn't hold up waiting customers, doesn't cost more in gas, doesn't reduce the chances of filming a quality video. Safety: I think that I speak for over 95% of the sport when I say that we need to continue to keep the average tandem skydive considerably safer than the average experienced jump. This is critical for the sports continued success. In recent years there have been some really bad tandem fatalities. Two people falling out of harnesses, drownings, and total collapses at 15ft. I think we all have a responsibility to keep 'first time' skydives as safe and simple as we possibly can. We should save the added risk for experience jumpers who *really know* what it is that they're getting into. It seems to me like a 2 plane formation is an unnecessary complication for a tandem skydive. It's just one more thing to think about. Don't get me wrong: This is not an attempt to say that what was done was not responsible; if it was common practice it would be just as safe as any other tandem video jump - the only thing that adds a bit of danger to it is the fact that it's considerably different from the norm. It's a very small amount of extra danger, but it's still unnessisary - in my opinion. Matt Christenson [email protected] http://www.RealDropzone.com - A new breed of dropzone manifest software.

DropTheMan04, Clearly, you don't speak good English; so to give you the benefit of the doubt, I will assume that you're actually a very intelligent person and planning on opening up a dropzone in a region where your native language is the primary language. I think that the estimate above was lowballing it a little much. I would plan on something more like the following for a single cessna dropzone. This is all bare minimum: Tandem gear: 4x @ $10k Student gear: 8x @ $5.5k (remember you need different sizes) Cessna 182: $60,000k hangar rental & aircraft maintenance: $40,000yr advertising budget: $5,000 opening a business legal/government: $15,000 business start up (furniture, computers, copy machines etc.): $15,000 legal consult - liability: $10,000 So you're looking at ~$230,000 to just get started; and you don't even have an office to work out of... a small office for $300/mo.. is another $3600 You also need to consider employees. A large place with a good following can get tandem masters cheaper because of how fun and accommodating the place can be for skydivers... but a single Cessna dropzone where there won't be any fun jumps? You're going to have to pay someone some kind of full time wage to keep them... and you'll need at least two - so at a conservative $20k each... plus a pilot for $30k, and one person on the ground to handle the phones - $20k... now you're at ~$325,000.00 for one year, and you haven't even considered fuel prices - which i don't know enough about to quote... if a Cessna can do one load every 30 minutes with 2 tandem passengers - that's 16 customers in an 8 hours day. If you operate every single day of the year at 1/2 total capacity, you could bring in $584,000 - however keeping yourself at 1/2 capacity isn't very realistic at all, not even large dropzones can maintain that. realistically you'd be doing good to hit 25% capacity. Remember that most people with money work during the weekdays; and that most places you have to accommodate cold and rainy weather. When it comes down to it - opening up a dropzone is completely reasonable... *IF YOU DO IT FOR THE LOVE OF THE SPORT*. At the numbers above, it would be very difficult to grow into anything larger - and with such a small capacity; you won't be getting repeat customers often. You'll have a hell of a time trying to find anyone to give you a private loan with such a risky business model, so you're only option is to have $350k in the bank... And quite frankly, there are a lot of other places that you can put $350,000 where it can make substantially more return. If you consider opening up a larger operation - something with a king air or a twin otter, you'll be looking at closer to $800,000-$1,400,000 start up costs, however your business model would start to look a little better because your capacity per dollar invested goes higher.. When in comes down to it, it sounds like you're missing the two very necessary things to start up a business in such a specialized industry: 1) Industry Experience 2) Social networking without industry experience you're not going to know the best way to advertise, and what kind of problems you may expect to run into without social networking, you're not going to be able to find a pilot, tandem instructors, receptionists, packers, etc.. that would work at the rates that I quoted above. If you're looking to get people up in the air in your region, that's awesome and I wish you the best... But if you're looking to make some money on your investment, there are considerably better places to invest your money. If you do happen to have $350,000K in the bank and are looking to invest it, you're welcome to give me a PM and I'll shoot over a few ideas for you. :) While we're on that topic - ROI means "Return on Investment" -matt Matt Christenson [email protected] http://www.RealDropzone.com - A new breed of dropzone manifest software.