baronn

Anybody have any knowledge on a Glide Path Raider? Had someone bring me a rig that has 1 in it. 1991 is the date. R-2145. Max wing load is 235

Thanks

Guy brings in a 1991 rig. Both main [Raider by Glide Path and a Raven 2} are the same yr. Vector 2 harness. Has a leg strap deploy. I had a Master change it to BOC and add magnetic riser covers and velcroless toggles. Is AAD ready. All is in near new condition. Gonna pull test the main and reserve. Expect both to pass.  

Can this go into service?

Another fine example of 1 set of rules for members and another for the BOD. Lots of bad decisions here. Pretty sure if a re-do was available, they wude want it. What is most disappointing is how very different the BOD's reaction is to this incident vs others in the past. They all knew this happened. Well aware it was coming out. When it did, the BOD response is to do an "internal" investigation and just ignore the whole thing. This organization collects over 4 Million a yr from us. Has seperate funds for airport access, Dillingham, Team competitions, Skydive Safety foundation and the US Parachute Team trust fund ( huh?). Has no accountability for the hundreds of thousands it gives to the ISMHOF and what happens to it. 

Just Ridiculous. If this was a company, the entire BOD wude be fired tomorrow

On 2/18/2020 at 3:31 PM, skypilotA1 said:

Perhaps I can shed some light on Baronn’s biggest concern of the Museum... 48 years of nothing.  Two years ago, I had the same questions.  Instead of taking the approach of making accusations and insults on the internet, I chose a different road. I asked some people that knew. My good friend Gary Peek was a USPA Board member for decades, and gave me the following historical explanation.  

   Bill Ottley was the initial proponent of the idea. It was his “baby”. When he died, he left $1,000,000 as seed money to develop the concept of a Skydiving Museum.  Not much was done for about 40 years. Money collected interest, small donations were made to incrementally increase the amount. USPA supported the concept with some donated clerical support and free advertising in Parachutist.  
  When USPA sold their original office townhouse and built & moved to their present location about a decade ago, the Museum made a deal and acquired an adjacent building lot next to USPA headquarters. The idea at the time was to build the Museum next to the USPA building. One could go in one door, the Museum, or turn the other way for USPA.  If you have ever been to USPA Headquarters, it seems the main entrance is “wrong”. It faces a vacant lot, not the parking lot as one would drive in. That’s because there was a plan to build a Skydiving Museum on that vacant lot.

    The problem is, there would be no reason to go to the Museum. It is not a destination. It’s not near any attraction. It’s an hour away from DC.  It is simply in a suburban business park.  Now, it’s great for USPA, but terrible for any kind of business dependent upon tourist traffic.

   So, about the time of President Bush’ AFF jump, the Museum seemed to come alive again. The leadership started installing new trustees, included President Bush as honorary Chairman, and undertook a serious effort to get something done. Since that period, they have quadrupled the money in the bank, dramatically increased and catalogued hundreds of Skydiving items of historic value, installed several high profile people as trustees,  hired a professional for fundraising, sought the advice of professionals in museum organization and management, and completely revamped the antiquated & unworkable original concepts.

   So to me, the situation is like this...I go to work for a business that has been around for 40 years, but never grown. In about 8 years, I quadruple the money in the bank, sign up almost a dozen of the top people in the industry to work for free, develop and catalog an inventory of over 1000 pieces of huge skydiving historical value and warehouse them for free, develop a concept where people and organizations from all over the world are sending money, and finally have some kind of definite goal line, and end result. Should I be supported & rewarded for my last 8 years of huge success and progress? Or should I be penalized for the previous 40 years where not much was done, and I had no control or input?

   What Baronn seems to not understand, all the money, inventory, donations, concepts have occurred in the last few years.  So if there is blame or fault, should it be cast at the previous 40 years? Or should the last 8 years be given some credit for the accomplishments made.  True, the end result is not yet accomplished. Yes, there may be some mistakes and compromises getting from “now to then”. But there is movement, there is forward progress.  
    This is the historical perspective I was given by longtime friend and USPA Board member Gary Peek.  It is not my opinion. If anyone wants to insult or trash Gary, go right ahead. I am sure it won’t bother him. If anyone cares to provide any additional first hand history, feel free.
 

Paul Gholson

I continue to appreciate that Paul is the only BOD member that offers his perspective on this matter. Shows Character

My biggest issue has been that the BOD decided to donate part of members dues to it. I said so in my 1st post. Still is. Near half century this has been going on is bad. It's just not the worse.

When Bill Ottley died, clearly nobody stepped up to finish this project. That happens. Volunteer projects are often plagued like that. So it sat for awhile. Bush jumped, he got nominated and interest was sparked again. So far so good. Why didn't someone suggest to him to help find some space in a national museum? A great opportunity came and went. Nothing can be done about that now. Or is there? More later...

As far as quadrupling the amount of funding, how was that achieved? Well, a person was hired and getting paid quite well, pitched the BOD to give away members funds to this. With no input from the members themselves. No fact checking on the BOD's side. Just takes his word that this will get this done. He then used that donation to convince other parachute assoc. from around the world to contribute because the USPA did and they changed the name to International.. Gotta to admit, that was slick. Maybe you can share the number of folks that live outside this country that the "professionals in organization or management of Museums": have to say will visit?

"So to me, the situation is like this...I go to work for a business that has been around for 40 years, but never grown. In about 8 years, I quadruple the money in the bank, sign up almost a dozen of the top people in the industry to work for free, develop and catalog an inventory of over 1000 pieces of huge skydiving historical value and warehouse them for free, develop a concept where people and organizations from all over the world are sending money, and finally have some kind of definite goal line, and end result. Should I be supported & rewarded for my last 8 years of huge success and progress? Or should I be penalized for the previous 40 years where not much was done, and I had no control or input?"

Is this you or are you talking as the 3rd person? I suspect the latter. Who are these dozen top people in the industry?  You must mean the Trustees. The one's I researched that have the full time jobs outside of this business of getting projects of this nature done. Those Dozen? The organizing of the items was very commendable. Sandy Reid was involved in that. Took about a week from what I understand. Don't know if they were paid but, I hope they were. Had to be a lot of work. Still like to know where Bob Sinclairs van is.  Saying that hustling money from folks and organizing :over a 1000 items a "Huge success" in 8 yrs, is a stretch. Saying yer being penalized for the fact that not much did happen in the 40 yrs prior is petty. It's an historical fact and my pointing it out doesn't "penalize" anyone. Get over it. 

"True, the end result is not yet accomplished. Yes, there may be some mistakes and compromises getting from “now to then”. But there is movement, there is forward progress."

I suppose the politically correct thing to do wude be to give everyone that shows up, a medal for doing so. Never understood that but, if that's what yer lookin for OK. I still don't see why some simple due diligence can't be implemented. When funding is being saught, the normal route is to develop a plan from start to finish, figure out how much it's gonna cost. how it can continue as an entity and how long it's going to take to implement and THEN get the money. That's normal. Not here. We are gonna go out and raise as much money from whatever sources we can saying whatever needs to be said to do so. Forget that there is STILL no firm plans. Even after we use your 8 yr scenario. 

Wanna do something that can restore credibility? Start by getting 5 yrs worth of detailed financials from the ISMHOF. Let's see where the funding is actually going. And I'm not talking about a 990 IRS form. Need to see the details of the numbers on there. Tell them to put a REAL plan together. No more of these ridiculous, pie in the sky concepts that have little if any chance to happen..

 Of course, you can ignore my advice. Ignore my and other member requests to act like a responsible stewart of other folks funds and continue down the same path.

Or... you can be the only Board member that actually looked into this. Choice is yours..... 

3 hours ago, accumack said:

I read the whole thread. Now  some questions for you. Have you asked for a refund of the money that went to the museum? If so what was the response? Do you ask for refunds of your tax dollars that go to things you don't agree with?

USPA is the agency that is central for all things skydiving in the US so why shouldn't they support a very important part of the sport.

The only narrow mindedness I see is someone seems to want to run the museum and is pissed he can't so is trying disrupt it. Good things take time. 

I also noticed on your profile, it appears that you have been in the sport for 51 yrs. Is that true? If so, you were here before, well, almost all of us. Haven't you wondered what's taking so long? Did you know Ottley? If so, what wude he think of this whole thing? And finally, none of us live forever, wouldn't you like to see this done before you go?

2 hours ago, accumack said:

I read the whole thread. Now  some questions for you. Have you asked for a refund of the money that went to the museum? If so what was the response? Do you ask for refunds of your tax dollars that go to things you don't agree with?

USPA is the agency that is central for all things skydiving in the US so why shouldn't they support a very important part of the sport.

The only narrow mindedness I see is someone seems to want to run the museum and is pissed he can't so is trying disrupt it. Good things take time. 

Both Mike Mullins and Paul Gholson stated they wude refund any members portion of their dues the BOD committed to this. I suggested Mike cude pay for the whole donation for less than half the cost of a rebuild on just 1 of the motors on his plane. So far, he has remained silent. Paul made his offer, I posted my PP acct and he put $5.83 in it. A Man of his word. As far as Government waste, do I even need to answer that?

Answer this, why did the BOD decide to donate to an organization that has not gotten ANYTHING done in 48 yrs? No oversight. 0 accountability and at best, a questionable business plan? At the same time, choosing to ignore funding athletes for competitions, assisting DZ's to operate at airports. Those 2 things require members separate donations. 

As far as doing all this effort so I can "run" the museum, what possible benefit is there to that? I've never stated that and won't. I HAVE stated my reasons and if you read all these posts, you'd know what it is. Or you can continue to be an ignorant enabler and allow this to continue for another 48 yrs of failure. 

Perhaps that's your idea of. "Good things take time....."

4 hours ago, accumack said:

Baronn all I see is you bitching and complaining. Why don't you run for USPA? All you have are problems with no solutions. This  thread is becoming as bad as DB Cooper!

Thanks for revealing your narrow minded view. Now do yourself a favor and read my posts. I have offered a possible solution to every one of the issues I have revealed. Will they work? Not sure. Got a better idea? Share it. What we do know is the current path is a failure. Anybody can see that. IF they choose to. Some are simply going to accuse someone who reveals it as just "Bitching and Complaining". As far as the USPA goes, are you endorsing me for a seat?

Guidestar.org lists non profits 990 IRS forms. I've mentioned this before. As far as plans go, I have not seen or heard of any firm plans in place. Lots of talk, no real action.

i assume that he is referring to my comment saying that you could get petitions gathered and take them to a meeting. 

That is what I responded to. Since I didn't refer to that and you don't know what I'm talking about, its safe to say its a mute point. Let's move on. Anyone that wants to look those forms up can go there and see them. They only have 2015-2017 listed last I looked. If you go to page 28 on 2016 & 2017, you'll see what McCormick was paid. Doesn't break down what he was paid for, just a total amount. 169k over 2 yrs ain't too bad for a part time gig. Willing to bet 2018 and 2019 were more. Lets get the breakdown and see. My understanding and I cude be wrong but, everyone was a volunteer except for the usual small admin costs. I haven't found the 990 form for 2018 or 2019 yet, so we don't know what that is. I did find another non profit watchdog that listed costs for 2018 and thats where I got the 37% number from. I'll get that and post. Sure, there are plenty of "non-profits" that keep ridiculous portions of donations. I don't contribute to them and encourage other's not to also. I'd also be willing to bet that if members knew 37% of all the funding the USPA was giving to them (over 52k out of 150k), they mite not be so happy about it. Especially when most is going to 1 person....

On 2/14/2020 at 2:48 PM, sfzombie13 said:

i assume that he is referring to my comment saying that you could get petitions gathered and take them to a meeting.  i think the google forms route would be the easiest.  it almost seems to me like it would be easy enough for the bod to come up with a google form, circulate it to all the membership, and take the results to the next meeting.  that way, the members will have stated their intentions, at least the ones who care.  i would not recommend doing that with every piece of business that happens, but there is enough controversy on this one that it would resolve things. 

Lets cover a couple things. 1st saying that McCormick is a USPA member and therefore represents many, many more is a stretch. Yes he's a member. He's also a Trustee on the ISMHOF. Who was paid over 169k in 2016 and 2017. No conflict there. Please let us know who all these others you mention are. 2nd request.

2nd, No, my comment was not directed at the petition you mentioned. I'm not opposed to doing that. What I find most disturbing about this whole process, was how quickly enuff all the BOD members bought into whatever McCormick said at the summer 2018 meeting and thought giving 25K a yr of members dues was a good idea. No plan presented and a history of failure. Nobody from the ISMHOF showed at the summer of 2019 BOD meeting to even give an update. This last meeting they gave McCormick a whopping 10 min. to make a presentation. He showed a few concepts and some possible sites. Basically nothing. If this was a company and he was getting paid (he is), this performance review wude have ended in termination. We desperately need an adult in the room. Review the financials of the ISMHOF and found out where all the donations being given to them are going. If they are unwilling to do that, then immediately stop funding and ask for a clawback. If they have nothing to hide, this shude not be a problem.

Sounds like yer new to this discussion. May want to read a few pages back and get up to speed. This isn't really a discussion about why we need the museum (we do), it's more about the lack of progress and why it isn't done. A few valid points in your 2c, I'm just not sure what the point is. The cost per member over the 5 yrs is approx $5.83

3 hours ago, sfzombie13 said:

you get me the go ahead and i will help.  i may even be able to help get some progress done, as i am a licensed contractor with a degree in leadership.  i don't have experience with a project of this magnitude, but i did run a special forces batallion s1 section for a year from ft campbell while they were deployed.  i wouldn't know who to begin talking to so handle that part and let me know what you need. 

As far as getting involved to get this project done, thats gonna ride on the ISMHOF. Again, they MITE be influenced but, since I can't even get most of them to return a phone call, I don't think that's gonna be easy. Stop the funding will get their attention. Letting them know we're sick of all the delays and if they can't get this done, let's find someone who can. A real possibility is they may get completely butt hurt over all this and refuse to cooperate at all. They control the purse strings at this point. I do have an alternate plan if that happens. Hope it doesn't. My focus has, is and always will be to get this project finished. A few steps in the rite direction and it shude be possible.

At this stage, I think exposing how the ISMHOF has managed to botch this up and how the USPA BOD continue to support this failed project is paramount. The ISMHOF can make whatever decisions they wish. We CAN expose how the funding being given to them is used. I have spoken with quite a few that have contributed significant money to them. To say the are unhappy is an understatement. Once this happens, then we can get some experienced individuals involved and rite this ship. 

Continue spreading this message. Let folks know how 37% of their contributions are NOT being used to build anything. 48 yrs and still not done. An excellent opportunity with an ex President completely blown and finally how 1 individual is benefitting financially from contributions. 

If you wanna go thru the survey thing that's fine. I think just exposing the facts mite be enuff to get members to take action, contact their Reps and say end the funding. That will stop the ridiculous "plan" revealed by McCormick. 

My suspicion is that "plan" is just another decoy for an excuse to get more funding. The start date will come and go with little to no action by the ISMHOF. They will blame it all on the fact they didn't get enuff funding. Some will buy that, ra ra for more funding, and this process continues. Time to end this insanity

2 hours ago, sfzombie13 said:

you get me the go ahead and i will help.  i may even be able to help get some progress done, as i am a licensed contractor with a degree in leadership.  i don't have experience with a project of this magnitude, but i did run a special forces batallion s1 section for a year from ft campbell while they were deployed.  i wouldn't know who to begin talking to so handle that part and let me know what you need. 

Any help is appreciated. I cannot do this alone. I want to make sure what the final goal of all my actions are. I want to get the Museum done. The fact that so many pioneers and members are now gone before they ever saw it, is sad. The fact that the Honorary Chairman GHWB was the ONLY skydiving President we ever had and he wasn't used to secure a location at the Smithsonian or at his Presidential Library is mind blowing to me. I have contacted both of these (and a few more) and got to both directors. Sadly I was told they weren't interested. Pretty sure an ex President wude have gotten a different answer. Since it was never tried, we won't ever know. To me, that indicates the ISMHOF is not really interested in getting this done. 48 yrs and still waiting. Sad. 

Any help is appreciated. I cannot do this alone. I want to make sure what the final goal of all my actions are. I want to get the Museum done. The fact that so many pioneers and members are now gone before they ever saw it, is sad. The fact that the Honorary Chairman GHWB was the ONLY skydiving President we ever had and he wasn't used to secure a location at the Smithsonian or at his Presidential Library is mind blowing to me. I have contacted both of these (and a few more) and got to both directors. Sadly I was told they weren't interested. Pretty sure an ex President wude have gotten a different answer. Since it was never tried, we won't ever know. To me, that indicates the ISMHOF is not really interested in getting this done. 48 yrs and still waiting. Sad. 

54 minutes ago, mbohu said:

This is coming from your own statements: Jim petitioned the USPA. Jim is a member. Ergo: A Member petitioned the USPA. I also assume that he is not the only one behind that effort.

In terms of the "many, many other ways"; Jim is extremely active in the sport. I personally benefit from his organizing and coaching; he seems to be involved in many bigger events and jump organizing (example: https://uspa.org/p/Article/the-warm-embrace-of-thailand ), and as far as I know he is an S&TA.

Again, I'm just saying: Obviously some members are into the funding of the museum (even in the way it's currently done), including the ones that asked the USPA to donate. To say NO ONE is, is just not matching up with reality. It seems to me that some are strongly supporting it, some (like you) are strongly opposed, and most are probably ambivalent (like betzilla).

Again, lets be accurate. I said I haven't met anyone that has said they knew about the vote ahead of time. That shouldn't be taken as they don't exist. Stating that 1 member did (McCormick) also should not be stated as many, many that did know either. "I also assume that he is not the only 1 behind that effort" is just that. An assumption. 

To also say that some members are for funding the museum and some are not, is also inaccurate. What they have been led to beleive,  is by contributing to the Museum, the project will get finished. So far, that has not happened. I also doubt that anyone has been told that a portion of their contribution (up to 37% so far) will not be used to actually construct this but, is used to gather more funding. We also don't have an actual site picked out, an actual building plan, any kind of business plan to keep this operating or any engineering company to help get this built. We only have a group of 14 Trustees that have little to no experience in these projects, have other full time jobs and have been put in charge of this project and in 48 yrs have produced exactly nothing. Those are all historical, verifiable facts. 

2 hours ago, sfzombie13 said:

i assume that he is referring to my comment saying that you could get petitions gathered and take them to a meeting.  i think the google forms route would be the easiest.  it almost seems to me like it would be easy enough for the bod to come up with a google form, circulate it to all the membership, and take the results to the next meeting.  that way, the members will have stated their intentions, at least the ones who care.  i would not recommend doing that with every piece of business that happens, but there is enough controversy on this one that it would resolve things. 

I am not. MBOHU stated that the members Knew about this coming up for a vote. I have not found any evidence to support this. Lets try and stay with factual, historically accurate events. If you don't have a way to prove a statement, please don't make it till you can. I have encouraged anyone that reads my statements to check them on your own for accuracy

As far as members petitioning the USPA to donate members dues is news to me. Please share whatever evidence you have to support that statement. Or the many, many other ways you speak of. 

3 hours ago, mbohu said:

You wrote:

Clearly, the request for funding did come from members--probably very active members (in terms of petitioning the USPA and communicating with it--and in Jim's case in many, many other ways). So they DID listen to members. Members DID know about this. I assume the USPA thought that a majority--or at least a significant portion of members--would be on board with this. 

These members just don't happen to agree with you. I'm not saying you don't have any valid points, but you seem to assume all members agree with you, and clearly they don't. The suggestions about collecting signatures and bringing up a motion at a BOD meeting really seem to be the best way to find out how many agree with you and to get something moving on an issue you care so much about.

That makes no sense. The ISMHOF is a 501c3 and anybody that wanted to donate cude do so on their own. Many have. Why have the USPA step in and use members dues for that? A completely unnecessary step....

1 hour ago, mbohu said:

You wrote:

Clearly, the request for funding did come from members--probably very active members (in terms of petitioning the USPA and communicating with it--and in Jim's case in many, many other ways). So they DID listen to members. Members DID know about this. I assume the USPA thought that a majority--or at least a significant portion of members--would be on board with this. 

These members just don't happen to agree with you. I'm not saying you don't have any valid points, but you seem to assume all members agree with you, and clearly they don't. The suggestions about collecting signatures and bringing up a motion at a BOD meeting really seem to be the best way to find out how many agree with you and to get something moving on an issue you care so much about.

I've yet to meet anyone that knew about this before the vote in 2018. I've also spoken with BOD members that didn't know about this before the vote. McCormick pitched this to the BOD, apparently not 1 of them knew that Ottley never wanted members funds used for this or if they did, they ignored that. They had a vote, it was close and it passed. Forked over the funds, no oversight, no plan, no timeline. Nothing. I keep hearing "But, we need the Museum!" No Shit Sherlock. We have for 48 yrs and it's still not done.  A few events to induct folks into it and that's it. As I dig into the financials, I discovered a large chunk of the donations are being paid to 1 person. The same person thats begging for more money and every "plan" he has presented, has fallen apart. The latest "plan" presented, has little if any chance of happening. We are all free to make whatever decisions we choose. This isn't about agreeing me or anyone. Its about looking at the facts, making rational, adult decisions and getting this project done. 

Did someone indicate that? I know I haven't. I'll assume he is as he was jumping at SDA before and after the meeting. 

2 hours ago, skypilotA1 said:

To yoink:  The Museum trustee roll is comprised of several highly successful owners of multi-million dollar businesses. I believe the Museum trustees, Board of Counselors, and President have the needed knowledge and expertise required for this project.  Check them out. Skydivingmuseum.org.  
      Feel free to contact them if you wish.

Paul Gholson

I have. 7 that say they are dedicated skydivers, 5 skydive equipment mfg., 1 ex DZO Radiologist and 1 sports consultant. Nobody with any project development/Construction design /build background. There mite be some crossover from the business owners if they built their own facilities. Most farm that out to someone who specializes in that. You certainly having a lot of confidence in a group that has little to no experience in this field. And a track record of nearly half a century with 0 results. According to their own timeframe, they have till Jan. 13th 2021 to start this. And they don't even have a final site picked out. Good Luck

4 hours ago, billvon said:

This world.  It is working; they are in fact funding the museum.

Don't like it?  Simple answer.  Go to a meeting and talk to them.  Call them and talk to them.  And if that doesn't work, vote them out.

Or just sit in front of a computer.  Bitch on the Internet.  In what world does that accomplish anything?

Wrong! IF it was "working", we wude have the museum finished. It's only going on 48 yrs.

13 minutes ago, baronn said:

I've said many times to research what I post here. I discovered today, that the ISMHOF paid Jim McCormick 95,670 in 2017 and 73,509 in 2016. Thats a total of 169,179. It's on page 28 of their 990 IRS forms. You can find those on guidestar.org

There are a few other charges for other things but, he is by far the largest. And he's the only 1 listed on that page.

2 hours ago, billvon said:

This world.  It is working; they are in fact funding the museum.

Don't like it?  Simple answer.  Go to a meeting and talk to them.  Call them and talk to them.  And if that doesn't work, vote them out.

Or just sit in front of a computer.  Bitch on the Internet.  In what world does that accomplish anything?

2 hours ago, billvon said:

This world.  It is working; they are in fact funding the museum.

Don't like it?  Simple answer.  Go to a meeting and talk to them.  Call them and talk to them.  And if that doesn't work, vote them out.

Or just sit in front of a computer.  Bitch on the Internet.  In what world does that accomplish anything?

Still don't know how to read a previous post huh? Mite wanna work on that. I present facts and make a decision based on those. Perhaps you may want to give that a try......

3 hours ago, sfzombie13 said:

like i said, if you go to a meeting and make a motion to have the donation stopped, then someone seconds the motion, it has to be voted on.  at least that is how the rules of parliamentary procedure work in general, depending on the version the uspa uses.  if you had a petition of a certain percentage of membership (not sure what that would be), it would show that many people are with you.  i am not sure what you have and have not done, but if you have been to a meeting with facts in hand along with petitions and were ignored, then you have standing for a major complaint.  if you haven't, then that would be the next step.  i am way late to the conversation so don't have any of the pertinent facts.  i am going to go to the uspa site and read minutes of old meetings so that i can see for myself that you are accurate.  not that i don't trust you, i don't trust anyone much if i want to get facts.  i like to see them for myself in their own context. 

3 hours ago, sfzombie13 said:

like i said, if you go to a meeting and make a motion to have the donation stopped, then someone seconds the motion, it has to be voted on.  at least that is how the rules of parliamentary procedure work in general, depending on the version the uspa uses.  if you had a petition of a certain percentage of membership (not sure what that would be), it would show that many people are with you.  i am not sure what you have and have not done, but if you have been to a meeting with facts in hand along with petitions and were ignored, then you have standing for a major complaint.  if you haven't, then that would be the next step.  i am way late to the conversation so don't have any of the pertinent facts.  i am going to go to the uspa site and read minutes of old meetings so that i can see for myself that you are accurate.  not that i don't trust you, i don't trust anyone much if i want to get facts.  i like to see them for myself in their own context. 

I've said many times to research what I post here. I discovered today, that the ISMHOF paid Jim McCormick 95,670 in 2017 and 73,509 in 2016. Thats a total of 169,179. It's on page 28 of their 990 IRS forms. You can find those on guidestar.org