bliston

The link below has a download of a deployment video with the 2-stow main deployment bag I made using a Velo 90 and a Micron with magnetic riser covers. The video will only be available for download for a few days. The bag has side tuck tabs and magnets on top to create the channel of the line pouch - design pictures are posted earlier in this thread. Frame by frame shows a clean and strait bag extraction, a bit of bag oscillation when the locking stows release, and what might be later than normal release of the risers from the riser covers (in comparison with the use of rubber band bags)... which I thought might happen since there was almost no tension needed to extract the lines until it came to the locking stows. You of course need to watch it frame by frame to make sense of anything. It felt like the canopy "popped" out of the bag with a bit more force than normal, and if felt like the time from when I released the pilot chute to when I was vertical happened a bit faster than normal. Just based on one jump... Yousendit.com link to 2-stow bag deployment I think I might just use my normal deployment bags since I generally get smooth soft and on heading deployments or maybe buy one of the UPT bags... I was thinking of trying to mount my point n' shoot camera on the back of my helmet and take video of perhaps 10 deployments with a rubber band bag and 10 with the line pouch bag to see if either one seems to have any discernible advantages/disadvantages, but I'm not sure I like the idea of being a test jumper, especially when there's a tested and proven design for sale through the company. I think that the UPT design (with the figure 8 stow method and stronger tuck tabs on the top and sides) is also likely faster pack, has a more secure pouch design, and probably worth the money instead of building one. Anyway, just thought folks thinking of using one of these might find the info/video helpful. Ben Mass Defiance 4-wayFS website sticks!

It should fit just fine. I temporarily put a Pulse 120 into my Vector 304 container. The Pulse 120 packed smaller than my Velo 96. The container is sized for up to a ZP 107. I imagine the larger sizes even pack up (relatively) smaller, since there is more of the new material but still the same number (and size) of line attachment points, and all the other stuff. Ben Mass Defiance 4-wayFS website sticks!

You are missing of a critical point point here, and the guy that thinks his Racer will beat a Vector w/ a skyhook (from a mostly inflated main canopy cutaway) is just plain wrong. I mean think about it, what's going to pull the reserve out faster, a 30+ inch reserve pilot chute that needs to find air, inflate, and accelerate the length of the bridle? or an already inflated 100+ square foot main? One of the main advantage of the Skyhook is that it drastically reduces some of the downside of a standard RSL. This is important because many folks that refuse to use a standard RSL will opt for a Skyhook - so the comparison really should be between a non-RSL equipped rigs and skyhook equipped rigs. For example, cutting away from an aggressive spinning mal with a standard RSL has the potential of creating a reserve bridle entanglement and has the high likelihood of having the reserve deploy asymmetrically (because of the jumper not being symmetrical in the harness) - the result, reserve line twists or worse. For this reason, you'll see a lot of folks jumping Velocities and other high performance canopies that won't ever jump a regular RSL, but choose to use skyhook equipped rigs. Also, the freebag and reserve pilot chute also usually stay connected to the main after a chop, which is nice. Sometimes they are hard to spot by themselves and end up costing you $265 if you can't find them. A person real life experience with the skyhook is that a few years ago I had a spinning mal and was on my back under a Stiletto 107 and had a skyhook assisted reserve deployment that was perfectly strait, symmetrical, and fast. I doubt the reserve deployment would have been so clean or even safe with a standard RSL. If you look at the UPT video and this Jumpshack video: http://www.jumpshack.com/videos/speedbag_cutaway.wmv you'll see that the RSL Racer deployment takes about two second to get the reserve out of the freebag (and about 4.5 or 5 seconds to see a fully open reserve). With the UPT video, you can see the reserve out of the bag in about 1/2 a second and a fully inflated reserve is about two seconds - from the frame by frame deployment from a spinning mal. No comparison. To be fair, one should just look at the time it takes to get the reserve out of the free-bag. At that point, how the reserve is packed determined the speed. I know if I was doing a bunch of test jumps that were intended to simply test the effectiveness of the skyhook (particularly with high speed mals) I'd be rolling the nose a bit to save my back and neck. As for the question of "does it matter" - usually... no. However, sometimes having a reserve out faster means that you have time to get back to the main landing area instead of landing off, or maybe have time to turn into the wind before landing your reserve (a canopy that most people aren't used to landing), or even have time to make it back to the main area, do some practice flares, and then set up into the wind. I also have had two people I know go in because their reserves weren't fully inflated when they hit the ground. Should they have been that low? of course not, but it doesn't change the fact the a skyhook would like have saved both of them. Both had thousands of jumps, we current and just had a few things in a row go wrong. Don't get me wrong, I don't think that rigs without skyhook RSL are unsafe. I just felt that some of the points presented in this thread were incorrect and merited a response. Ben Mass Defiance 4-wayFS website sticks!

Thanks for those thoughts, Peter... helpful. Look forward to hearing if you see any heat damage on your gear after you have a second to take a look. What is the material that is used in most reserve bridles? I think I have some of that lying around. Since I live in a third world country, I can't just order stuff up. I'm not sold yet on adding a buffer. If I decided to even use the bag (might just get a couple of the UPT ones that have been tested and proven), I wouldn't be that worried about bag wear. The construction of the addition only cost about 2 bucks in materials and rebuilding one, re-using the magnets and plastic of course, would only take about and hour and change. Since made it a bit narrower than the actual bag and just sewed it on top, it's not like I'd have to unpick a ton of thread or binding tape. Thanks again for the thoughts, Ben Mass Defiance 4-wayFS website sticks!

Yeah, I see the white tape on the UPT bag that you are talking about, but I don't understand the need for it. Not saying there isn't a need, I'd just like to know the rationale behind it. There's been plenty of stuff that has come out in the past like mini-force risers, Reflex's catapult system, and even reverse risers (designed to protect the three ring components, right?) that haven't really been necessary. Have any of you other folks that have been using bags with line stow pockets (velcro or other) noticed friction wear on HMA lines or the top of the parapack pouch where the lines exit? Do you think that the white tape is there to protect the bag or the lines? I imagine that it must be the bag, or else there would also be concern about the "line on line" friction. Since the majority of the lines are pulled over the portion of lines that go from the second locking stow into the base of of the pocket, right? We know that HMA is more prone to abrasion than microline, but since it doesn't shrink maybe it's more resistant to heat damage from friction (either from the slider grommets during opening or as they come out of the pocket). I don't know anything about the structural properties of lines, maybe other folks can chime in. Maybe I should have left more space between the two magnets just on the covering flap (not on the bag side) just to create a more open channel to reduce the contact there between the lines and the material. In hind sight I think I also should have make the side tuck tabs wider to make them a bit more secure. I only had one of the pieces of plastic that came with the old cypres instal kits and cut that in half the long way to use for the two flaps. Ben Mass Defiance 4-wayFS website sticks!

Thanks for the responses. I just edited my post to add the last picture with the tabs tucked in, must have forgot to hit upload. - Yes, I still have two locking stows - I just make the addition and sewed it right on an extra bag. I just slapped in on rather than un-stick stuff and incorporate the mod into the existing seems. - The pocket is in the same place as a standard free-bag (towards the jumpers back), as the last picture shows (#12), not on BOC side, Jerry. Given the direction the pilot chute is pulling I can't think of any other place it could work. - I'm not sure I understand the need for the cotton (or non-nylon enforcement). Does cotton absorb the heat somehow? I used a fold over design for the top of the cover and a hidden stitch seem to sew on the pocket intentionally. Thought being that the lines would not have be exposed to any rough stitching. I did this thinking that if they could just travel over/past the parapack that that would be the best for the lines. Maybe I'm missing something here. I sure don't want to risk damaging the lineset. I've never seen friction damage to the inside/top of freebags (between the velcro) but maybe that's because they usually only have a few deployments. I had also thought about incorporating another small cover/channel for the first bit of line that goes down the middle of the pocket (from the second locking stow) since the rest of the lines are traveling right over it. If heat friction is a concern with the material between the magnets, maybe this would be important to protect the lineset, too. I imagine that another long triangle with the base at the bottom of the pocket and the point extending past one side of the channel opening would do the trick. - In terms of the magnets releasing, I imagine if it works as I intended it to, that the magnets will not release during deployment, just like the velco doesn't release during the reserve deployment. Hopefully the lines just play out through the center channel. I did test it by clamping the lines between the magnets and also splitting the cascades and pulling them free - seemed to take less force in both situations than it normally took to free a double stowed large rubber band (with 500 HMA and a velo inside). I just like the idea of the lines being able to bull through the magnets if they needed to (instead of having to force flaps open) to avoid a bag lock. Please keep the thoughts coming - I don't want to use it until I clean up the design. Thanks, Ben Mass Defiance 4-wayFS website sticks!

Had a couple hours this afternoon and, as we all know, that can be dangerous if if some scrap material and a sewing machine is around. Please take a look and let me know if you see any potential problems with this design. The sides of the "cover" has tuck tabs, and then magnets seal the top. I went with the triangle covers to help hold the lines in place until the main cover is in place - thought being it would be easier to get the lines neatly in place than with a regular freebag style pocket. I attached pics of the final product and some along the way, just in case anyone wants to build their own. Ben Mass Defiance 4-wayFS website sticks!

I, too, work with him regularly and have always been happy with his services. Ben Mass Defiance 4-wayFS website sticks!

Just had a customer bring in a main and freebag that landed in the ocean after a cutaway yesterday. It was in the water for 20-30 minutes. PD told me that they wash and then thoroughly rise canopies exposed to salt water. They use a light dose of woolite (one cap for a large tub of water), and then recommend a hang dry - without exposure to sunlight of course. They said that they would typically reline the canopy as well. Sunpath recommended a thorough rinse in water only for the freebag, reserve PC, RSL lanyard and main risers - and noted that with only 20-30 minutes of exposure there wasn't enough time for any real damage to occur. Glad to see that other link, though. I'll be sure to heed the advice. Ben Mass Defiance 4-wayFS website sticks!

Due to some new interest, I have made the instructional tunnel video available for download again. Donations to the NSL (www.skyleague.com) are required, $20 for individual use and $50 if for 4-way teams or people using it for paid coaching work. Contact me by PM for more information. Here is a link to a sample of the video: http://www.youtube.com/user/Skyleague#p/search/0/ic7sC30bocA Ben Mass Defiance 4-wayFS website sticks!

Due to some new interest, I have made the instructional tunnel video available for download again. Donations to the NSL (www.skyleague.com) are required, $20 for individual use and $50 if for 4-way teams or people using it for paid coaching work. Contact me by PM for more information. Here is a link to a sample of the video: http://www.youtube.com/user/Skyleague#p/search/0/ic7sC30bocA Ben Mass Defiance 4-wayFS website sticks!

I've made a couple of these for FS. The ridge marks are actually skinnylong pockets that have about 4 lbs total of lead sewn in permanently. When it's on, these fit in the gap between the backpad and MLW of my micron V304. They actually make the rig fit a little better in and I don't get any rig shift in freefall. I've got padded laterals but there was still just a little space there. Saw some of these at Skydive Dallas, but the ones there had the ridges all the way across the back and they felt a bit funny to me with my rig on. The inside front has the zippers to add pouches and I can fit about 6 or 8 more pounds in the front. If I was making one for a swooper, I guess I could just make the whole thing "taller" to be able to load more lead in there. It's adjustable, but the straps are hidden in the front covers/pockets and a little super tack through the webbing makes it temporarily fixed so that the fit stays consistent. Inside of it is lined with padded parapak which, while thin, does make a difference. Feel free to send me a PM if you have any specific questions. Sorry for the blurry pictures... Ben Mass Defiance 4-wayFS website sticks!

V705 will also do a 7 shot burst in about 3.5 seconds which can be nice... takes for ever process/recover, but nice to have for exits, openings, and landings. Just too bad that it doesn't hold the burst setting in memory, so you have to set it after turning it on in the plane before exit. Mass Defiance 4-wayFS website sticks!

Thanks for the responses... Ben Mass Defiance 4-wayFS website sticks!

If you came across a Sigma tandem rig that didn't have the safety thread through the skyhook plastic cover (or the red lanyard tacked down the old way) would you contact the previous rigger about it? Mass Defiance 4-wayFS website sticks!

If it's possible to post the comparison video, I'd love to see it. Thanks, Ben Mass Defiance 4-wayFS website sticks!

Yeah, tandems are barely worth it. I'm thinking of changing my pricing structure based on reserve square footage. The smaller canopies are truly easer to inspect and pack. Doing a tandem I&R vs. an optimum 113 is night and day... maybe double to work. Mass Defiance 4-wayFS website sticks!

What is the going rate for a tandem reserve I&R these days? I was charging $75 when working for time at a DZ a number of years ago, but that seems to be closer to the going rate for sport rigs. Ben Mass Defiance 4-wayFS website sticks!

Has anyone used the LaCie d2 Blu-ray Drive? I'd be using it with a new Mac and iMovie for personal use (4-way video...) and using video from a sony cx100/cx150. Ben Mass Defiance 4-wayFS website sticks!

Thanks for the update, please keep us posted on with the scores... Mass Defiance 4-wayFS website sticks!

Hope all the collegiate competitors have a safe and fun meet this week - I think Collegiate Nationals runs from Dec. 28 - Jan 3rd this year at Skydive Spaceland in TX. If anyone on-site can post updates, that would be great! While I wish everyone good luck - I wish the West Point Parachute Teams and the Aggies just a little bit more... Gig 'em and Beat Air Force! Blues, Ben Mass Defiance 4-wayFS website sticks!

Anybody see any downside of making a 2 stow bag using the "Wings style" velco free bag design (that keeps the hook clear of the lines)? Would that be more likely maybe to allow the lines to lock up since they couldn't separate the velcro as they were extracted if need be? I have 500 HMA on one canopy and might prefer to use velcro instead of magnets... Ben Mass Defiance 4-wayFS website sticks!

Instead of making or buying a rig condom - another way to go it to convert and old container into a tunnel rig. I made them for my team a few years ago by covering all the exposed hardware so that there was nothing that could scratch up the tunnel. Then I simply cut out high density foam to fill the containers and also inserted weights to match what each person's container weighed. The last step was simply to close up the containers semi-permanently by routing 1500 lb. dacron through the grommets of both the main and reserve and then sealing it with a knot. I used 5lb plates as the base weight and then added individual lbs of weight belt style weights to match them to each persons regular rigs. No handles, no parachutes, no way for the containers to open. They worked out well for our team... Ben Mass Defiance 4-wayFS website sticks!

scores and team photos are up at http://www.skyleague.com 29 teams total, good times had by all, see ya next year! Ben Mass Defiance 4-wayFS website sticks!

We've got 90 competitors heading to SkyVenture NH this weekend for a 4-way tunnel comp. Three classes Rookie (3 point random dives), Intermediate (4-5 point dives with randoms, plus blocks 7, 9 and 14) and Open (5-6 point dives, plus blocks 5, 6, 7, 9, 11, 14, 15, 16, 17, 21, and 22). Please contact me by email at nhtunnelmeet"at"gmail"dot"com if you'll like a copy of the draw. It'll be available Saturday around 12:00 EST. Our scores will get posted on Skyleague.com and you can see how you did against the mighty flyers of the north east! Ben Mass Defiance 4-wayFS website sticks!