JohnnyUtah

Not true. Tom A, if thats what you believe then youre doing it wrong. Meaning you dont have adequate skill and techniques to be most effective with your toggles. It is also possible you dont have your toggles set up and prepared correctly. I wrote an article on the subject of Risers or Toggles hoping to shed some light on this subject. The article can be found in the Info Library section of my website. Have Fun, Don't Die! Johnny Utah My Website email:[email protected]

Yes! Thank you Brian and Mike.... FOR GOING FOR IT!!! Ballsy move indeed. I for one (and Im sure all the BASE jumpers) would love to meet you both. Have Fun, Don't Die! Johnny Utah My Website email:[email protected]

John MacDonald (hellfish#1) and father Marty MacDonald (hellfish#2) have jumped together at Bridge Day. They are also signed up for BASE Camp - FJC 2005, which takes place in Idaho the week before Labor Day. Have Fun, Don't Die! Johnny Utah My Website email:[email protected]

If youre comparing the use of tailgate (on the inner C line or the slider) with the use of direct control for the slider, the differences are such that each is very specific to its purpose. The purpose of the tailgate is to inhibit tail-first inflation and to reef the steering lines during the initial stages of deployment. I think its safe to say that the tailgate has proven itself to be the best method of line-over prevention in the slider off/down environment. Even still, there are a few cases where a line-over has still occurred. The purpose of direct slider control is to hold the slider up in its most effective reefing position (the top of the lines) until the bottom skin starts to inflate, which is the stage when the lines spread and force the slider down. Here are three benefits of direct slider control. 1. Since the slider cannot be pulled down by gravity during or just after line-stretch, it greatly reduces the chance of getting cracked on opening by making sure the slider is in place long enough to do its job. 2. The purpose of a slider is to reef all the lines (in the center) during inflation. So when the steering lines are routed through the guide-rings and grommets, the slider reefs them as well. That function in itself helps to prevent a line-over by somewhat controlling the steering lines. So direct slider control helps the slider do its job better. The longer the slider stays at the top of the lines until the start of inflation, the better it can reef the lines, and the better it can help to prevent a line-over. However, the chances of getting a line-over while using a slider (no tailgate) are much greater than using a tailgate with no slider. The idea behind using a tailgate on (or with) a slider is to have a similar reliability as the tailgate in a slider-down/off set up. 3. Direct slider control may also help reduce the chance of a tension knot. Theoretically, I would think the more the slider grommets can move up or down the lines during line-stretch and/or any snivel, the greater the chance of the slider being a contributing factor to a tension knot. Some people call the main stow, indirect slider control. The purpose of the main-stow is to stage the opening somewhat. It holds all the lines together at the top until full line stretch. This helps keep the canopy together at the wind channel before and during line-stretch. Theoretically, this can help reduce the chance of a tension knot by not allowing the lines to move around as much individually. Another benefit of the main-stow is that it prevents the slider from sliding down the lines until the main-stow is released. This happens at full line-stretch. The slider can still move down a bit just as the main-stow is released and continue down until the bottom skin starts to inflate. I use a main-stow on every jump (except when using a direct bag or sleeve). I use direct slider control (and the main-stow) on all moderate to higher airspeed slider-up jumps. I think that using direct slider control is the best way to keep your slider from coming down early, and that such a function becomes more and more important the higher the airspeed becomes. I also think using tailgates with sliders is still in a proving phase (test phase) for many jumpers. The use of masking tape with a slider-up pack job to momentarily reef the steering lines seems to be very popular these days. I like the masking tape trick for slider-up jumps as well, though I dont always do it. I still use micro-reefing techniques during my pack job to inhibit tail-first inflation. Hope this helps Have Fun, Don't Die! Johnny Utah My Website email:[email protected]

Back in '85 it was little different. Not a lot of folks were getting #s back then and as far as I know there were no cards. You were just assigned a # over the phone by Jean. She was still a little active back then. My friend Steve had talked to Jean a lot on the phone before we made our qualifying jump and we knew beforehand what #s we were going to get if no one beat us to it. I just cant remember what the exact # is. Hey Fred, I PMed you a phone number for Rick and Joy. Have Fun, Don't Die! Johnny Utah My Website email:[email protected]

I gotta second that one. Great eye candy. Thanks Hans for editing that up. Jaap, Youre gonna love the terminal jump. The guys in the video know what theyre doing.....hence more advanced techniques. While exiting, focus on sticking your exit flat and stable (what ever you feel most solid doing). Once you feel solid in the air (probably at 1 second or so), smoothly (not necessarily slowly) transition into your tracking body position of choice. As you make more of these type of jumps you can transition quicker and quicker and still be solid because of your experience. And Jaap.....remember to have fun and dont die! PS-I got the shirt, thanks. ~Johnny

Alright, you made it bro. SWEET!!!!! Thanks for the email updates during your journey. Sounds like you had a raging trip. Have Fun, Don't Die! Johnny Utah My Website email:[email protected]

This thread got me wondering: Who originally thought of the idea of attaching a tailgate on the trailing edge of the slider? The first person I heard the idea from was Mark Hewitt. It was spring 1999 and a small group of staff/BASE jumpers were hanging out one night at a DZ. Mark and I got to talking about BASE gear and the innovations and improvements over the years. So we got to the subject of lineovers, line release mod, and tailgate. So naturally we started thinking about slider-up lineovers, and how it sure would be nice if there was some way to.............. Then out of nowhere Mark says, How about just putting a tailgate on the trailing edge of your slider? Did someone somewhere else think of it before then. Its cool to see people doing it now. Have Fun, Don't Die! Johnny Utah My Website email:[email protected]

What? They let you keep your tip? Thats not fair, they wouldnt let me keep my tumor. (bastards) Then again I guess I wasnt so attached to it like you and [I]the tip[/I]. Just trying to cheer you up K, OK. Have Fun, Don't Die! Johnny Utah My Website email:[email protected]

Happy Birthday Have Fun, Don't Die! Johnny Utah My Website email:[email protected]

I didnt want to post, but Ray, that was some funny shit bro. I love you man!!!!! I agree with every single thing you wrote in that last post. Your following post was equally good. You need to hook that brother up. Faber, I second Ray. Everything you said in your last post is incorrect except this part: i fully agree,as your right Im only saying this because I care about you bro. Im glad youll be hitting PDX. Yes, but keep in mind, the more developed and reliable your skill is, the smaller that probability becomes.....and that is the key. How much do you trust yourself? Its just like a navy pilot landing on a carrier. If he doesnt trust himself, he will ask for a transfer. You MUST be skillful to use the toggles. Q: So why even go for them? A: Because when used with proper technique, they can help you escape injury or death WAY better than the risers. Q: What is the one thing that sparks fear in us on every jump where an object strike is possible? A: An object strike! That is because we all know it comes down to a race. You dont want to crash before you get around the track; so youll be extra careful. BUT, those who are good enough will do what they possibly can to get ahead. Why? So that they have a better chance of winning! Have Fun, Don't Die! Johnny Utah My Website email:[email protected]

Right on Katie!

No. That's why I began my statement with "I think..." rather than "I'm sure..." Gee, again with the attitude. I didnt mean are you sure that literally. I was just using it as a common phrase in the English language. I thought that reply I made was quite nice. It was polite, stated as a question, informative, and to the point. You probably already knew about what I was saying though. (OR maybe you didnt know about it...yea, thats it.) Have Fun, Don't Die! Johnny Utah My Website email:[email protected]

So, something that you wrote on this forum is as authoritative as a textbook used by a Ph.D. physicist? I'm not doubting that you've got some good insight into these things, but I'm still going to ask as many people as I can. Well actually a Ph.D. physicist (460) did review it and made a post (in the original thread) saying he had no problem with it. Im sure you saw that since you posted right after. I offer you a place to reference, and you come back with that. Whats with the attitude? Actually, I think I know what it is. Have Fun, Don't Die! Johnny Utah My Website email:[email protected]

I think that's mostly history. Adam F. put the 38 handle inside, and the 32 outside. Then, the internal got converted to floating, and the 32 got left. Personally, I kind of like the floating handle for everything (but I've got both external and floating handles in both 32 and 38) Are you sure its not because the 32-inch PC has so much less material to it that having the actual PC material stick out of the BOC at all, would make it more likely to come out of the BOC prematurely, especially at terminal? Its common knowledge in the skydiving world that you dont want any of your PC fabric sticking out of the BOC, whether your belly flying, free flying, or wingsuit flying. This is because there has been lots of incidents from the PC coming out prematurely. Have Fun, Don't Die! Johnny Utah My Website email:[email protected]

Bummer on losing the lens....Ive lost a few. Cool shots though. lets see the video Have Fun, Don't Die! Johnny Utah My Website email:[email protected]

Why do I have the sick feeling that this thread is going to result in 460 checking his references again? Cause people just dont get it. Tom could always refer to post#18 edit to add clicky Have Fun, Don't Die! Johnny Utah My Website email:[email protected]

Tree points finger --> Johnny points finger --> Brit points finger --> Jaap... hey he asked the question, I just went searchin for an answer! Yea Jaap....what the hell? (and yes Im laughing my ass off) 1. A tandem exit is 6,000 to 13,000 feet 2. The drogue is so big that even with its current design there is drogue shock when its deployed at tandem terminal. I can only imagine what would happen if the lower half of the drogue was all mesh 3. The drogue actually collapses when the drogue release is pulled. You actually feel your fall rate speed up a bit before the chute comes out (trap door effect). The collapsed drogue has ample drag to pull out the two-man chute. edit to add: 4. They design them to maintain a certain average fall rate. Have Fun, Don't Die! Johnny Utah My Website email:[email protected]

Actually it returned via Barelylegal, but I digress. Now Winkleport is one I have never heard before. Thanks for making me smile.

Good post toni. My preferences are mostly the same as yours. I prefer my 38-inch PCs to be vented. I currently have large-hole mesh on my 32-inch PCs. Have you had a chance to compare a 32-inch with large mesh against a 32 with fine mesh? If you have, just curious what you thought. Thanks. I agree. Jaap, there will be times when you will want one over the other. Along the lines of what toni is saying about too much snatch force and malfunctions/line-twist/off-headings. You want to always consider the degree of center cell strip your set up will cause on that jump. Here are a few excerpts from a post I wrote a while back in this thread about center cell strip: Center cell strip distorts and undoes your pack-job. At or close to terminal velocity, there is always some degree of center cell strip (unless you are using a sleeve). The goal is to minimize it without causing too lengthy of a deployment. The more center cell strip you have, the greater the chance of having a malfunction/line-twist/off-heading. edit to add: If you are ever unsure about the best PC size for a particular jump, my philosophy is: It is safer to error to the side of one size too big instead of one size too small. Have Fun, Don't Die! Johnny Utah My Website email:[email protected]

A post of mine from that same thread. Some basics: Square canopy A square canopy is an airfoil, a wing, a glider. The pressurized wing generates lift because it is an airfoil shape. In this thread, round canopies seem to be the topic, so… Round canopy A round canopy is a drag device. The canopy captures air as it is pulled in a direction. This capturing of air pressurizes the canopy with static pressure holding the round canopy in its inflated shape. The shape of the round canopy creates drag, which is the opposing force to whatever is pulling the payload in the said direction (i.e. gravity). It is this drag that allows a person to land with a safe rate of decent under a round parachute. Inflation of a round For a round parachute to be considered inflated, it needs to be pressurized with air. For air to get into the round parachute, it goes in through the opening at the skirt, not the apex. Air exits through any hole at the apex. During a round deployment with some airspeed, the canopy starts out in a stretched out streamer type of shape. The skirt of the canopy is gathered together in the center and therefore the opening at the bottom is very small if any. Because there is some airspeed, the airflow across the canopys outer surface creates a low pressure. Since there is a lower pressure on the outer surface of the canopy than on the inside of the canopy, the streamer shape begins to expand. The opening at the skirt begins to expand as well. As this happens, air does go in there. The air keeps collecting inside there, and it is at the apex of the canopy where it collects for the most part. Once the opening at the skirt becomes large enough to let in enough air to completely expand open and pressurize the canopy, then that is what happens. The low air pressure on the outside of the canopy during initial inflation, helps the canopy change from a streamer shape to an expanded, more open shape. IMHO- If a round parachute were deployed with its skirt completely opened up (full diameter), then it would inflate (pressurize) immediately and the need for an external low-pressure to help expand the streamer and open the skirt up (as during initiating inflation), would not be needed. I agree that the static pressure created by the canopy capturing air is greater than the external pressure and therefore the canopy stays open. Pilot Chutes I have no doubt in my mind that when doing a high airspeed deployment, there is a low pressure created on the outside of the PC which helps it to initially expand. It seems to work very well and that is why I use a regular mushroom for those types of jumps. In this thread we were talking about a very low airspeed PC hesitation. My point of view is that if you can get the mesh/rip-stop seam of the PC opened quicker (and reliably) on its own, then air will go right in there and pressurize the PC that much quicker. That is why I was mentioning the Super Mushroom. Thats its purpose. If you pack the PC so that it is dependent on airspeed to begin to open, then you need sufficient airspeed at deployment time or enough altitude to get away with a hesitation (like we see in the video). With the regular mushroom, sometimes you can do a throw and go and the PC opens immediately with nil to very little airspeed. I believe this works because enough air successfully flows through the opening of the seam and successfully inflates it. However, sometimes the airflow is not so successful to get in and inflate the PC at low airspeeds with the regular mushroom. The result is an occasional hesitation. In the video, it probably hesitated until an external low pressure did happen and helped get the PC to open. Not ideal in my opinion. Have Fun, Don't Die! Johnny Utah My Website email:[email protected]

Thats the post where Tree (Treejumps) exclaims that: Im sorry, and Im not trying to take a dig at Tree, but those two statements have got to be two of the dumbest things I have ever heard. Regardless of what the air pressure is on the outside of the material, a PC captures air to inflate. That is what holds its shape. Have Fun, Don't Die! Johnny Utah My Website email:[email protected]

Heres my 2 cents I agree with most of what Tom Begic and Ray Losli have said on this subject. I disagree with most of what Nick and Tom A have said on this subject. I spent today writing an article on the subject of Risers or Toggles hoping to shed some light here. The article can be found in the Info Library section of my website Have Fun, Don't Die! Johnny Utah My Website email:[email protected]

I am not recommending Daves choice of gear, but I do understand what Kevin is talking about with the micro lines and slider configuration: Im guessing most BASE jumpers have never BASE jumped (or seen BASE jumped) micro-lines on a large 7-cell. I made about 25 jumps on a Dagger 266 with micro-lines a few years ago. There is a big difference in the way a canopy opens with micro-lines. Basically it will slam the ever-living-hell out of you if you go 2 or more seconds without a slider. With a slider it still opens very fast, even if youre doing just a 2 second delay. Three second delays with the Dagger 266, with micro-lines, with a mesh slider produced basically an instant opening again and again with total consistency and good heading performance. While jumping that Dagger, I never worried about it sniveling. I came to the conclusion that the drastic difference is because Dacron lines stretch some during opening shock whereas the micro-lines dont stretch much at all. Also, the slider moves down the micro-lines with very little to no resistance. I also wondered if the little bit of difference in the wind resistance (drag) of Dacron VS micro-line could be a factor. I would never want to have micro lines on my own personal canopy because of how hard it opens with no slider. But, for someone that does use micro-lines, I totally understand why they would want a slider with a 3 second delay. I guess one reason someone might choose that gear configuration is if they didnt like slider down openings in the 2-4 second range but still wanted something that would consistently open quickly. Think about this: Youre jumping a wall big enough where you will be doing a 5 or 6 second delay. Which set up is better? Personally I would choose my canopy with Dacron lines, mainly because thats what Im use too. An experienced micro-line pilot may have an edge at this delay range............I dont know. Have Fun, Don't Die! Johnny Utah My Website email:[email protected]

Ahhh yes...the Cruiselite XL That thing has history bro, seen some sick action. How are the openings getting to be? Q: Why do you keep looking up there? A: __________ Have Fun, Don't Die! Johnny Utah My Website email:[email protected]