robibird

Anyone what?! The Ws is on the field since 1996 - Patrick 1998 I made my prototype, also mainly french jumpers were playing w their stuff 1999 BM started, also many other jumpers were playing w their own suits, different types, etc... Now is 2007. Suits started at 1:1 GR, nowdays some flying over 1:2.5GR Is this good answer to your Q?!

I have many serious doubt about that long time system Tom. Perhaps that subject require new thread . Anyway, as we see from discussion above, mentors can or can not screen their students abilities to get the lending right. To expect student can do it by it self, well, of course some of them can, but high percentage will be screened by X-ray machine later for sure due to problems of driving the canopy w toggles out... In my opinion, way better is to get confident in packing, get the tail gate right ( always w rubber band which fly away every jump) than hassle w toggles which has at least 4 different ways to end up after the canopy opens... Robert Pecnik [email protected] www.phoenix-fly.com

This is not good! when u doing this Kris, make it so that you make the knot on one side of a thread. guide the thread from the bottom to the surface w the needle and that is it. make the thread longer than you need , friction between the thread and the material you putting the thread through will be enough to hold the thread in position. When you finish installing , measure the size you want to have and cut it. the way you did is not good , also thread looks stiff too. on the top you should avoid and bumps made by knots Use bright color soft medium thin wool thread. also there is no reason not to make this on the sleeve part of the wings too... hope this explanation will help Robert Pecnik [email protected] www.phoenix-fly.com

Perhaps the best example is Skydiving itself... (and BASE is getting there too) Throughout my 26 years in this sport where I've started to jump with canopies for which nowdays you probably should pay someone to jump them. These were the times when we were so sick of using AADs and couldn't wait to get rid off that bulky ''instrument''. The times when safety was also # 1 thing (as always is) I can see now that Parachuting industry is trying to make this sport so safe that it's becoming almost stupid. (in the next 10 years we are going to be forced to have 2 AADs maybe - just kidding, No!!) The sport of skydiving with today's technology is super safe but one mistake is made in another area. Requirements needed for getting into this sport are getting less and less demanding. A mentality of average skydiver is approaching the stage were he thinks ''Yeah, I have an AAD -nothing can happen to me!'' People are hiding behind the equipment instead behind their knowledge, training and progress. People take the manual as Bible, but even those, mostly ''copy - paste'' types of manuals are never really red with deep understanding and a newbie listens or reads parts of it they like to hear but not those which are also very important. Skill progress is so often a simple repetition (collecting the same type of jumps) without real and obvious progress in knowlege and tehnical understanding of the sport. For example, wearing an AAD is certainly a good thing, but isn't it funny that huge percentage of today's skydivers (who started to jump 10 years ago) would refuse to jump if they do not have AAD?! Well, AADs kill people too... This is strange to me and shows the lack of trust in your own abilities. (I know, there's a million reasons for having one, like collisions in big-ways etc. ...but...) Even the sport of parachuting and skydiving is starting to be presented as super-safe in order to drag in more and more people, and among them also those who would not be even considered able to take a ride in a plane. This kind of approach is pushing the Parachuting industry into the battle which cannot be won. Question for BASE jumpers (were 90% of BASE jumpers through the USA would instantly disagree with me) Most of the FJC teach beginners to jump Slider off with free toggles settings. Why?! Slider down jumps and free toggles setting - to me, that's a bad decision for low-experienced skydivers, BASE beginners! Why? Because the chance to screw up the pack job (highly supervised and inspected by mentor) is a way lower (nearly impossible) than possibility for a poor judgment under the canopy due to problems those beginners have dealing with riding the canopy with such a mode that he/she never really saw and flew before! Fighting tight landing area, as same at the same time flying the new canopy w the new way of toggles setting...( Base newbie has just near or over 200 jumps , usually w standard skydiving canopy with standard line mode) Somehow I just can't get rid of a feeling that in past times a young skydiver or a BASE jumper was forced to learn and listen more and was forced to know much more about theory, meteorology, etc... Yes, 20-30 years ago an equipment was not that good as is today, but people knew more about essential things. Hiding behind the equipment is an easy shortcut but that has many, many surprises. Be aware of that. Robert Pecnik [email protected] www.phoenix-fly.com

Thank you Tom.

Long ago I wrote this in Aerodynamics II article (http://www.phoenix-fly.com/articlesstvari/PF_Wingsuit flying and Basic Aerodynamics_2.pdf ) People tend to believe in anything, only if it looks cool enough. Wind tunnel testing certainly looks smart and cool, but beside getting some cool pictures there is so little you can achieve in practice, especially if the research is aiming to achieve something more than just to collect data for comparison between different rigs or components like helmets etc... The VKB boys did that and provided us with data that just confirmed what was rather obvious: thin rig generates less drag than a bulky tick rig. What was nice in VKB Tunnel tes data was that we were able to see all the details and % of drag around two sets of gear... Testing WS in the wind tunnel would be serious task even for organizations like NASA (in US) or TsAGI (in Russia). Even for them that would be a hard job w high cost and questionable results. For the moment, experimenting is the way to go here, since experiments are still one of main and most important tools in aerodynamics or hydrodynamics... Edited to make url clicky ~ Craig Robert Pecnik [email protected] www.phoenix-fly.com

oh boy with pleasure!! What I meant to say with saying '' body armor - no brain'' is the kind of approach I have seen (99.99% super young base jumpers) who think they are invincible with body protection stronger than rock faster than speed of light... It is very natural to feel that way when they are young ( you know what I think - right

Unfortunately I feel that we going to start to deal with such situations more and more. I won't be polite now and I'll say following: How the hell someone can be so dumb and stupid to come to cliff for which he has no clue were the exit is and than jump off without trying to get in touch w locals or with more experienced jumpers , etc.... Luckily he survived and didn't become the part of the Nick list. To me that is the biggest mistake and harm made to Austrian Base association. Maybe here is the explanation '' body armor - no brain'' Maybe we need to establish another list People to Ignore - People to Avoid list ITW - is a few steps away from becoming permanently closed DW - is on the same path ISTW- permanently closed Croatian bridge - probably fill going to get the fence due to circus heavily organized by jumpers who does not even try to keep low profile Soon if this continue will be no need to travel to EU Thank you young boy for such foolish act. You and your mom can be proud you survive. I am damn pissed Robert Pecnik [email protected] www.phoenix-fly.com

very interesting video from PIA. High respect to B.Booth for all he discovered and invented in our sport but the magnets and primary reason why they are there now is to resolve the problem he created on RWS V3 and later Micron series of H/C. Remember on 1996 when we were jumping for N. Kent movie using Kent's Vector3 rigs, we were highly recommended to leave the risers almost open due riser cover problems Robert Pecnik [email protected] www.phoenix-fly.com

Robert Pecnik [email protected] www.phoenix-fly.com

jakee, to design the wing w laminar air flow characteristics is still true task in modern aviation and can be done only on rigid profiles. as ws is not rigid, all theory around having laminar airflow over WS is pointless because small change of the any part of our body would ruin all the performance even if we get close to such design. Important is to understand that I am talking about Laminar airflow and not about airflow which support us nicely when we flying w WS or canopies... Robert Pecnik [email protected] www.phoenix-fly.com

no, whole post was about what ''laminar'' means.. I noticed that people here like to say Laminar , laminar without really understanding what is laminar flow

well, very important is to repeat again and again... The gravity is our only engine and the speed is our only friend - if we want to fly not fall. In general, ticker profile gives you lover stall speed but higher drag, and opposite. It is all about trade here , just like on the canopies...kind off... The frame on The year of.... you can see on the video is the moment when the suit reach the the stall speed and starts to fly. ( I think you talking about the shoot which was taken from the ground w long lens ) Long ago when I was using the skyflyer 1 and 3, main problem I found was the instant loss of performance due the sensitivity to the stall. (best performance was very near the stall, so small mistake or tiredness caused the loss of lift ) V. generation of my suit resolve this problem , but as natural consequence it become clear that this suit has to be flown in specific way. Yes! It requires more flights , more jumps and more thinking... However, once the flier nailed the sweet spot there was more than clear that suit is fast, and that it works on creating lift , not just deflecting air. Proudly I can say that I haven't saw any other suit in BASE environment which was able to cover such distance. ( talking about BASE performance jumps, what I saw and what I was told, and what I have personaly done too. ) For example, Yuri K. who is in my opinion by far the best performance flier took half a season to nail V2 . He came to the point to gave it up, but he was stubborn enough to try and try...so much that he changed the flying style also in order to get max performance he can reach at this moment. Another issue I see at the moment in general WS activity is constant improving of the fliers. For example, RW discipline started so that people were using ''X'' position, in order to fly stable. Later it changed to kind of ''frog'' position, later in to ''box'' and now ''mantis'' is the way to go! From ''X'' to ''mantis'' it took around 30 years. Same I see in WS flying. Where WS is actively out on the field about 7-8 years...In some parts of the world people flying ( flocking ) differently than in another, but for sure it will come to the point were the flocks will be made so that bodies will be in fast mode w stretched legs, so to say clean, not dirty. I just hope that this path will not require another 30 years or so, because I'll be damn old to participate. Robert Pecnik [email protected] www.phoenix-fly.com

There is the difference between V1 and V2 Kris. V1 used to have the Dacron stiffer leading edge while V2 has softer leading edge. V- series WS main characteristics is shaped tailored arm wing. Also, All PF suits except Acro should be flown with bend arms and ( this is a must for all wingsuits which has wingtips ) regards Robert Pecnik [email protected] www.phoenix-fly.com

As I read here many times word ''laminar'', and as I see that so many times this word is placed in wrong context I would like to provide additional information. Wingsuit and Laminar Airfoil Laminar Flow is the smooth, uninterrupted flow of air over the contour of the wings, fuselage, or other parts of an aircraft in flight. Laminar flow is most often found at the front of a streamlined body and is an important factor in flight. If the smooth flow of air is interrupted over a wing section, turbulence is created which results in a loss of lift and a high degree of drag. An airfoil designed for minimum drag and uninterrupted flow of the boundary layer is called a laminar airfoil. Laminar flow airfoils were originally developed for the purpose of making an airplane fly faster. The laminar flow wing is usually thinner than the conventional airfoil, the leading edge is more pointed and its upper and lower surfaces are nearly symmetrical. The major and most important difference between the two types of airfoil is this, the thickest part of a laminar wing occurs at 50% chord while in the conventional design the thickest part is at 25% chord. The effect achieved by this type of wing design is to maintain the laminar flow of air throughout a greater percentage of the chord of the wing and to control the transition point (point at which laminar flow is converted in to turbulent flow). Drag is therefore considerably reduced since the laminar airfoil takes less energy to slide through the air. Laminar airfoils are used for fast airplanes, or on high performance sailplanes. Also, Burt Rutan is using these airfoils in his designs very often. But laminar airfoils have also some undesirable characteristics. They have to be manufactured very carefully and with high degree precision. Also, they require very smooth surface (did you ever wonder why competition sailplanes have high polish surface?), and any disturbance can lead to significant reduction or almost complete loss of performance. An extreme example were some airplanes that were using laminar airfoils that were not able to sustain level flight in heavy rain, because water on the wings disturbed laminar airfoil and reduced available lift. Wingsuit is typical example of aerodynamic body that is completely unsuitable for the use of laminar airfoils, for number of reasons: 1. Wingsuit is not rigid. Wingsuits are more like parachutes, semi-rigid airfoils. Each wingsuit flyer is different in shape and size, and maintains slightly different body position in flight. In order to function as intended, laminar airfoil geometry has to be designed, manufactured and maintained to a great precision. Even if we manage to design and build laminar airfoil suit, you can only, for example, bend you elbows slightly during the flight and the wing will be completely out of shape (and out of performance). Or bend you knees slightly in flight. Put on different rig. Wear different helmet. Or just look to a side or behind you during the flight…There is infinite number of things you can do during the flight to completely nullify any potential advantage of laminar airfoil. Also, we cannot look only arm wings on the wingsuit. With its short span wings, wingsuit looks more like space shuttle then like high performance sailplane. Therefore, you have to look the complete flying body, which has actually a lot of areas that are causing interference and disturbing the airflow (head, shoulders, rig, arm wing and body attachment, knees, feet, etc.). Also, no matter what type of fabric we try to use, since wingsuit is not rigid, we will have huge problem to keep surface very smooth. Anything but absolutely perfect tailoring, manufacturing, fitting and maintaining of the body position in flight would lead to bends, ripples and wrinkles in fabric that would prevent laminar flow. 2. Laminar airfoils in general have sharper leading edge. The leading edge on the wingsuit in general has the shape of the arm, and this is not very sharp. If we try to put some kind of rigid leading edge, we can severely compromise safety, but if we try to add some kind of soft leading edge, then we are back to the problem of maintaining the proper shape of the airfoil during the flight i.e. proper body position. Also, laminar airfoils are particularly sensitive to any change in shape. For instance, modern high performance sailplanes have slider that can wipe dirt and bugs from the wing leading edge in flight, in order to maintain performance; otherwise their glide ratio could drop by 10 % or more. 3. Laminar airfoils in general have unfavorable stall characteristic. In general, they lose lift rapidly without warning and they do that at lower angles of attack then conventional airfoils. I don’t think that you would like to fly a suit that stalls very easy with no warning signal (imagine canopy that stalls that way, no one would like to jump it). 4. Wingsuit flight speeds are not very appropriate for laminar airfoils. Simply, we are still way to slow and we are operating at to high angles of attack to use and fully exploit the benefits of laminar airfoils. I have mentioned similarity in shape between wingsuit and space shuttle. For lift generation, space shuttle relies heavily on generation of vortices over the whole airframe. These vortices are accelerating the air flow around space shuttle, thus generating higher pressure difference i.e. more lift. We can assume that the same thing is happening with the airflow around the wingsuit (and it is rather difficult to obtain experimental confirmation for that, as I explained some time ago). So, in the end, some vortices (turbulence) does not have to be a bad thing in the end. Robert Pecnik [email protected] www.phoenix-fly.com

yes!!! one of the organizers ( Valera Rozov ) is in Chile right now. When he get back he'll send the info out to public

and every phone call to the bar for wind condition will cost you about 3.00€. that money goes to girls !!! Robert Pecnik [email protected] www.phoenix-fly.com

Interesting... usually i advice student to push leg wings as much as they can and not to stretch arm wings completely, in order to fly properly and not to stall the suit.... Unfortunately very common misconception in thinking about flying. Putting tension on the arm wings does not mean that you producing lift. What you getting? You getting sensation of ''lift'' but that ''lift'' is the WS in stall or very near stall position. actually you are falling slow verticaly, also horisontaly you hardly moving forward.. that is not flying (that is common flocking style now days) For example, if you put simple streamer and if you see that angle of the streamer is ~40 degree or more, easily you can call that falling were forward movement is done by air deflecting, not by any lift.. If you want to move forward , every WS , incl. prodigy should be flown so that arm wings are stretch, but not so that trailing edge is straight. Personally during flocking, I prefer to see flying style were the legs are stretched all the time but the body arching and de-arching in order to control forward and vertical speed. yes - it is harder , yes - it is more demanding, but also, is way more fun and way more flying too. C'ya at Z-F&D

What you are saying is more or less true but it should be noted that the design of the Vampire wingsuits make them suitable for skydiving as well. Evidence of this is apparent at DZs around the world where there are many V-1 and V-2’s flying around. There are many similarities between the BASE and skydiving environments, however designing equipment for BASE requires extra attention to some specific details. Any equipment designed and manufactured with BASE in mind can be used skydiving, the reverse of this is not necessarily true. The Vampire series were designed with performance in mind – this is my main point, because performance is what I desire on WS BASE jumps. WS + performance + BASE = Vampire series… Skydivers who like performance will also like the V series suits. Back flying can be done in the V series suits, just like any non-back vented suit, however I recommend a back vented suit for those who would like to look up during the jump. Robert Pecnik [email protected] www.phoenix-fly.com

why you have a tape around the PVC handle? bad idea. it makes it heavier. it make handle stiky due the leaking of the glue w the time... ???? Robert Pecnik [email protected] www.phoenix-fly.com

Jason, Your Texan friend is super tracker really!! He is very good and he is a ''bubble head'' when camera is on his head!! He has one and only good reason to be around the big rocks, you know which one, I have no doubt at all... robi 5000 Robert Pecnik [email protected] www.phoenix-fly.com

Global warming will probably save the BASE industry, because.... I see that those kids are away from hassling w the parachute gear... I don't know what to say?! second one miss the rock for about 1 m, last one landed on his head http://www.kladblog.com/content/html/200702/free-ride.asp Robert Pecnik [email protected] www.phoenix-fly.com