giffnyc

I'm going to try an arm mounting. My first attempts were in a pocket on my torso. With the arm mount, I'll try keeping the unit by the door or a window. @DSE, can you describe your setup?

My first experiments suffered from signal loss during climb to altitude with these small devices, so no data yet. I'm at Nationals this week, but will do some cogitating on keeping the GPS lock on the device and try again after recovering. Thanks so much for your article - it couldn't be more timely.

Bryan - I'm the OP - your article on exit order for freefly was exactly the thing that was on my mind when I posed the thread in the first place. I was thinking that we need an update from a source like you that sees a large volume of skydiving and has the patience to look through actual data rather than just make a lot of guesses. I'm really glad your interest is peaked by these problems and looking forward to your articles. I hope you trumpet them loud and clear when they are published. For my own interest, because I want to see the data, I was thinking of doing a small project of data capture from GPS devices like some of the wing suit flyers carry. I have access to a couple (they're really quite cheap, and folks who spend time on the track with a car or motorcycle have been using them a lot to sync video with GPS data, so readily available) to get some plots from any skydivers here at the Ranch willing to carry them for a couple jumps. You mention timing videos - would you have any interest in viewing GPS tracks, if we're able to generate some? Thanks for your continued safety efforts!

To be clear, looking for info as IrishDave has stated above both for steep tracking angle flyers AND flat tracking "flocking" dives. I think they should be treated differently, but again, open to learning what I can. The lane idea of the documents for WS is great - at least there is an agreed upon location for flyers that someone can point to on a photo.

Thanks for the replies - I hope those of you following the thread ask other folks that you know to join in - I haven't seen anything else written on this topic. To sum up the discussion so far: The main reason trackers would like to get out first is to give them the best chance to land on the DZ - I assume that means that they want a shot at the longest line away from the line of flight that still stays within the spot i.e. get out early, go 90 degrees off line of flight as far as reasonable, then track up the line of flight. For multiple tracking groups, they'll go left or right out of the door, or will leave first/last. More than two groups is something to be discussed. There is some difference in what flat vs angle tracking groups can do - I don't know a ton about angle flying, but I assume its steeper, and the time in freefall as well as distance covered is less. So some DZs put them out after the vertical flyers. Anyone know how its fall rate/freefall time compares with flat and vertical flyers? What do experienced angle flyers think? Wingsuits seem to get out last no matter what. Makes sense - they have the most options, time, visibility and have a higher incidence of tail strikes. I'm still left with the question of experience - I've personally seen our 8 way group overtake flat trackers. My theory is that they did not have enough experience to judge their position off line of flight, and turned up line of flight early. At this point we also have opening altitude issues. The person who mentioned groups that have back-flying tracking leaders raises a point I'd like to understand - can one of you tracking leaders way in? Does it make sense to put less experienced groups out later? That's hard to do in the real world. I feel like, as a member of a group that has a higher risk of collision with a tracking group that goes awry, I want to ask if the group has a plan and what it is. But I don't want to be "that guy" all the time - big RW groups that get out early already get enough shit for the spot/the door/the crowding/the landing pattern/slow climbouts/etc. More thoughts, please!

Our DZ, like many I'm sure, is seeing a lot more angle flying and tracking groups exiting the plane. At our DZ, some of the more experienced angle and tracking flyers have been asking to exit first from the airplane. This has become a model for less experienced angle and tracking flyers when they join the discussion at the loading area. I'm an RW jumper, and mostly team train, and mostly 8 way. We very commonly are out first and are often the ones being asked, "can I get out in front of you?". I don't want to be a dinosaur. I don't want to be dick. I understand that at Perris, a large and highly experienced DZ, tracking groups exit early. It doesn't make sense to me, particularly with less experienced groups that are intending to open higher. But I'd like to understand the reasoning behind those that think trackers should get out early. I'm open to changing my attitude - even advocating for this system if it makes sense. Can some of you that have experience with this please offer your thinking? I'm not here to knock it down - I really would like to understand it, and especially understand what we need to communicate to less experienced trackers in this complex situation. Thanks.

Donna tells me I can only buy from her or she will kill me... Wow... G3, huh? Not a visor change? What is the basic idea behind the design change?

I love a lot of things about my G2. It's a really big upgrade from the Sky Systems helmets I've used for the past 10 or so years. BUT. Here in the northeast at least, they fog like crazy for us RW jumpers, particularly while tracking off, a super bad time for that. I know the guys on XP are drilling holes in the visors to try and stop the fogging issues, but are not satisfied yet with the results. For myself, I find the biggest help is to keep the interior clean, especially from dust. Cookie is pushing fog wipes as a solution from the dealers, as well as a foam thingie that extends the area around your mouth out a bit to redirect your breath. I've tried the wipes, but didn't get much result. The foam thingies have not yet been available at the local gear shop. When I've talked to dealers, they tell me that Cookie has not fully acknowledged the problem, but that the dealers have heard from more than a few jumpers. Cookie has jumpers in a lot of different environments, and I can understand that some of the them may not have issues. But almost everyone who jumps a G2 at my DZ has experienced significant fogging. I love the helmet, and I don't mean to be a whiny entitled skydiver brat, but I'd like Cookie to do some experimenting with lens mods to see if they can't get some ventilation that works. I hate that I am tempted to take a dremel to my expensive helmet, but I had to chop a few weeks ago, and truth be told, I did not have a lot of visibility. That ain't where I like to be.

Skydive Long Island is about 70 miles, the Ranch is about 90. LI traffic can really suck. Ranch weekends tend to draw a bigger experienced jumper crowd -- we've been around for a good long time.

At this level, the mental game is gonna play a big part. To me, an important element for Fire last year was the mental discipline they maintained in the final two rounds, and the mental edge that a team with nothing to lose has in a competition. The Knights had reputation and more on the line, and glitched round 10. Fire seems to respond pretty well to challenges, including the concerns that any team would face coming off injury and a training break into a closely watched competition. Sinapsi seems to have re-committed to winning the worlds... wonder if they have an "it's now or never" feeling about their upcoming year. Neither team has a title to defend. Come to think of it, the French have nothing to lose this year, either. I think we'll see some true go-for-broke skydiving this summer in Germany. That's always inspiring.

IMHO and YMMV, etc... Everyone has their own style! As others have pointed out, snapping the piece turn isn't of much value when the outside folks have some work to get done. Precision in the turn is what helps. It has to stay dead-center-pointed and stop predictably. Trusting the center piece to always be there allows the outside flyers to keep their heads in the right place and minimizes the ad-lib work they have to do. Give them predictable targets every time and trust them to work it closer and faster through the season. The grip-ee in the center piece has very little to do aside from keeping an eye on the point. A little back pressure, a little inside leg, to initiate, then let it be. Too much effort and the center-point is gone. The gripp-er can stage the turn, flying thru the grips, or if more advanced, can carve the full turn. The idea of "feeding" the tail is a little dangerous -- the advice so far is that it has helped center pieces from sliding towards the point and that's good. But the opposite can happen too -- work on center pointing the piece turn and let the outside folks find the targets. Given a weekend team's training schedule, it's generally not a good idea to try to cut off too much of the turn. It usually results in unpredictable finishes that can take time to work out without too much gain. Do the center work, go for a full 360, and let the outside folks work out predictable, tight targets.

Ranch Hands and wanna-be's - As of Wednesday, the weather gods were smiling, so let’s boogie. As in Mystery Boogie, this Saturday, October 12. What's the Mystery Boogie? We could tell you, but where's the fun in that? All you need to know is: You show up. Teams are mysteriously formed. Mystery Events are revealed one by one. Jumps are made. Points are scored, fun is had, kegs are tapped, free dinner is served, the great struggle is won...winners gloat and losers are trash talked. The rest of the evening is up to you. You're invited, as long as you're off student status. No discrimination based on race, creed, preference, jump numbers, or direction you like to face in freefall. Bonus points for creative thinkers. We'll start at 10 o'clock, just in case Friday night went a little late for you. Or us. Feel free to bribe organizer's Friday night at Benson's. In case you're worried, a special Mystery Plan has been developed to allow those participating in Guy's 16-way RW jumps to score points, so don't fret, you get to play, too. Join us for the last round and we'll let you share dinner. And guess what? We want to jump, too. So events will be organized so as to keep you in the air, doing your thing Ranch style. Sound like fun? A fan of mild carnage in the landing area? Live for free food? Be there. Questions, suggestions, or just want to let us know you're in? Send them to [email protected].