FLYJACK

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Everything posted by FLYJACK

  1. FLYJACK

    DB Cooper

    This was Hahneman.. not Cooper, he had Dramamine and Compoz for the crew for his hijacking. Cooper also said he had pills for the crew. Lycopodium Clavatum, a pill lubricant was found on the Cooper tie.
  2. FLYJACK

    DB Cooper

    Tom, Another, the Lycopodium Clavatum.. the pill lubricant. The conclusion was Cooper was a pill popper. Hahneman had and used Dramamine and Compoz during his hijacking. How do we find out if these contained Lycopodium Clavatum, especially the Compoz as it had a foil wrapper which requires a pill lubricant. I have researched the early Compoz tablets and can't determine if it was coated. It was changed in the late 70's as one of its ingredients was banned. FBI - "Prior to eating a Dramamine pill, the hijacker broke the pill in half and required the First Officer to consume half of the pill. The First Officer stated he thought the hijacker would parachute from the plane once they were airborne. He further suggested that this individual should be compared with D. B. Cooper, who hijacked a Northwest Airlines plane in Seattle previously." FBI - Compoz - “This tranquilizer was given to stewardess ________ on 5/5/72, by the Unsub hijacker of flight 175. According to ______ hijacker handled this foil package without the benefit of gloves.” "Compoz contains a long list of ingredients, some of which are known to have sedating effects at doses higher than those in the patent medicine. The contents are scopolamine (a sedative), the antihistamines methapyrilene and pyrilamine maleate (which also have sedating effects), salicylamide (a pain reliever), extract of passion flower (believed to be sedative at high doses) and the B vitamins, thiamine, riboflavin, pyridoxine and niacinami de." "Dr. Rickels said that scopolamine, to name one ingredient, could produce such side effects as blurred vision, increased pressure in the eye, urinary retention and, at high doses, mental confusion, excitement and delirium." https://www.nytimes.com/1973/01/14/archives/study-criticizes-effect-of-compoz-review-by-fda-ingredients-listed.html
  3. FLYJACK

    DB Cooper

    Tom,, Particle pattern on the tie.. The tie has what appears to be particle concentrations in horizontal lines on the front of the tie and if you look close on the front of the back piece of the tie.. Hard to imagine those patterns of particles deposited while the tie was worn. That suggests the tie was rubbed across a sharp/narrow object.. as if it were used to wipe something or it was stored folded laying on the particles.. The control tie particle distribution looked completely random, the cooper tie was not. The tie was manufactured/sold around 1964. It had lots of time and environments to collect those particles. It seems unlikely they all came from one environment.
  4. FLYJACK

    DB Cooper

    Maybe a DZ jumper can recognize something with this chute??
  5. FLYJACK

    DB Cooper

    No, what I am saying is your logic is bad.. it is biased speculation used to reject a theory. We need facts, not speculation to reject a theory. That doesn't mean you have to accept a theory. You can't reject a theory because you think Tina would have burned the money instead of tossing it. Being skeptical is good, rejecting possibilities based on speculation isn't skepticism, it is a lack of reason. You advance knowledge with theories, they get tested and confirmed or rejected with facts not opinions.
  6. FLYJACK

    DB Cooper

    Actually the published ransom bill list is sequential, but lots of info in this case has been wrong.. intentionally or not, who knows. Carr got the randomized bundles completely wrong with Georger and that still won't die 10 years later. Carr claimed the 3 "bundles" (his word) on TBAR each contained random counts. He mixed up random bundles and random packets.. Bundles were randomized, packets were not. The FBI files claim the tie was 1-2 years old after the FBI asked a store manager. The labels on the tie date it to about 1964.. The store manager went by the look of the tie, not deciphering the label. but no doubt the FBI is holding back info, made serious errors and is engaged in propaganda to some degree. BTW, I just read in the new files that the FBI eliminated some suspects then reopened investigations on them.. then they weren't really eliminated,, right. We aren't going to get anywhere using the same 50 year old thinking and hoping some new piece of physical evidence with suddenly pop up and solve it. Sometimes you have to colour outside the lines to find them... Some of the Cooper sleuths are still stuck in 2009...
  7. FLYJACK

    DB Cooper

    "This is how people get locked up that are innocent. several times in life I was falsely accused. the last time was a hit and run. it all "made sense" to them..." Nobody is on trial here. This is a theory of many, a very reasonable one given the evidence. It needs to be explored. Using personal bias and speculation to dismiss a theory is the reason cases DON'T get solved. You dismiss theories with FACTS, not personal bias and speculation like she would have burned the money not thrown it in the river.. this poor application of logic will never solve this thing.
  8. FLYJACK

    DB Cooper

    I like the money falling off the stairs into the Columbia theory as well.. if it was a single bundle it did not have to be in a container. but for the stew theory.. If one of the stews kept the packets and later discarded them into the Columbia the flight path and LZ would be consistent. Tina resided about a mile from the Columbia in the late 1970's just upstream of TBAR. Heck of a coincidence. There were 20 bills missing from one TBAR packet, they may have been removed prior to deposit, if we had the original unsorted bill list we might be able to determine the order. Proving this after almost 50 years is big ask.
  9. FLYJACK

    DB Cooper

    One slight clarification, Cooper (they claim) offered the drink tip after he received the ransom and after Tina took some and claimed to return it.. about 4 hours after he had the drink.. Stews rejected the drink tip "because it was against company policy" then he offered them the packets of ransom money.. doesn't really make sense. This is just a theory, it isn't proven but it is better than most of the theories floating around, the ransom money packets Cooper offered the stews ended up at TBAR... Tosaw speculated that the "rejected" packets went into his overcoat landed in the Columbia and ended up at TBAR. Perhaps there was another route... This theory applies to any Cooper suspect, it doesn't point to any specific suspect. Georger,, if your going steal my homework at least get it correct.. Twisting, contorting and contextually distorting it to fit a false narrative is just lying. That doesn't advance the case, it subverts it.
  10. FLYJACK

    DB Cooper

    Tosaw's book states that Cooper tried to give the two stews tip money from his pocket as they were leaving - after the money was on board and after Tina took some ransom money. But, he also states that Cooper reached into the money bag pulled out 2 "packets" and said "here, take these, I don't want them." He confirms the timeline from Flo and Gray and confirms that ALL the stews were offered ransom money. Flo started serving drinks at Portland terminal, Cooper was first. No drink tip offered to Flo when she served Cooper and gave him change. Tina brought money on board and asked for some ransom money, took it and returned it claiming she can't accept a gratuity citing the Cooper drink tip incident. Later, Flo lifts the money bag to feel the weight. Flo and Alice are leaving, Flo claims Cooper offered the drink tip bills from his pocket. Tosaw - Cooper offers the two stews a packet of ransom money as they leave. IMO, the drink tip story is bogus. If Tosaw had the ransom offer info, there is no way Cooper offered them a few bills form the tip money as well. I suspect that the FBI used the drink tip story to cover for Cooper offering them ransom money For two reasons.. to withhold info known to Cooper and to not give future hijackers the brilliant idea which compromises witnesses. That means Tina's story is bogus. She likely heard the story from Flo and used it to embellish hers but it doesn't make any sense in the context of her interaction with Cooper. Cooper removed at least 3 packets for the stews, 3 packets were found at TBAR, not bundles, not scrundles, not bojundles.. or even fofundles.
  11. FLYJACK

    DB Cooper

    It was three trips for chutes.. back chute, two fronts and the other back chute. Flo and Alice left after all the chutes brought on board.
  12. FLYJACK

    DB Cooper

    That confirms my previous point and timeline, that the "tip" was offered after the money was on the plane. It reflects the FBI interview with Flo,, and confirms the timeline I pointed out. It conflicts with Tina's timeline for the attempted "tip"... it occurred after Tina was offered money. Other books have claimed the two stews were offered ransom money before leaving the plane.. not in FBI files. So, the order of events.. In Portland, Flo serves Cooper a drink then returns his change. no tip attempted. Hours later.. Tina brings money onto the plane and asks for some. She takes it then returns it citing company policy and notes the drink tip from pocket for all stews incident. Flo lifts the money bag. Cooper giddy. then Cooper offers the stews change from his pocket, they refuse citing company policy.. No way, it doesn't make sense. Cooper offered them all ransom money, the drink tip story was used to cover it. Another possible explanation is that the FBI instructed them to use that tip narrative to hold back public info that only Cooper would know.
  13. FLYJACK

    DB Cooper

    Not true, it wouldn't be a crime if she took the money and handed it to the FBI later. Her story sounds ridiculous. People lie all the time for many reasons. Only she and Cooper knows the truth.. It has happened in hijackings.. https://m.metrotimes.com/detroit/the-final-flight-of-martin-mcnally/Content?oid=2483257&storyPage=2 Martin McNally "He also requested another $2,000 in small bills, most of which he gifted to the stewardesses as a tip for their compliance."
  14. FLYJACK

    DB Cooper

    Loose ends,, FBI doc above,, Flo began serving drinks while the plane was at the Portland terminal. Cooper was first. Cooper retrieved notes and the matchbook, he was wary of fingerprints. Would he later pull small bills from his pocket and hand them to all the stews giving them his prints? Occam's razor,, we know two people handled the ransom money after it went onto the plane,, we also know that one of them went to a facility a few miles upstream of TBAR in the late 70's. Finally, we know that 3 packets of bills matching the ransom money was discovered a few years later on TBAR. Recordak - There were actually two Recordak recordings done. The first was well before NORJAK, $250,000 was recorded $230,000 in $20's and the rest in $10's. We know this for sure because the micro given to the FBI contained all of the $250,000 including the 10's. The FBI had to use a sketchy method to determine the bills that went to Cooper vs the ones not given to Cooper. The 10's were easy but the bank only had the start and stop bill for the 15 packets left behind ($30 grand). The process to create the ransom bill list was not an active recording of those bills, but it was a deduction of bills not taken based on only 15 pairs of bill numbers. 15 packets. There were 15 packets of the bank stash left behind and the bank quickly created a new "emergency stash" after NORJAK of $300,000 incorporating those 1500 bills. Another Recordak micro was done. The FBI contacted the bank claiming that they were having difficulty sorting out the ransom list from the original micro. The bank then sent the FBI the second micro with each bill number including all the other bills that were now newly added.. but there was an error in the range. That is probably where the 9998 bills comes from. The entire process of curating the FBI ransom list from two micro lists that included bills not given to Cooper was extremely sketchy. It is possible that some of the bill numbers on the ransom list are wrong. For NORJAK the bank took $200,000 from the $250,000 emergency stash, 100 packets likely in uniform bundles. An employee randomized the bundles into various numbers of packets per bundle using rubber bands.
  15. FLYJACK

    DB Cooper

    Nope, the bills were recorded well before NORJAK via the Recordak machine. They were in packets (also called straps) of 100 bills with bank bands and rubber banded into random bundles for Cooper. So a bundle would have a random number of packets. Cooper received random sized rubber banded bundles of packets (100 bills each). The three packets found on TBAR didn't go to Cooper independently, they were rubber banded in a bundle. The real question is,, how did the money go to Cooper in bundles and end up in three packets on TBAR. They had to have been separated by someone at some time or they landed as one bundle and as the rubber bands deteriorated the three packets separated slightly. The old argument that they had to arrive in a container to land close but separate is a red herring. If they landed as one rubber banded bundle (containing packets), the means by which they could have arrived opens up.
  16. FLYJACK

    DB Cooper

    BTW.. It was Flo who served the drink at the Portland terminal. Not Tina. I can't find any indication by Flo or anyone that Cooper tried to tip when he received the change from that drink. Flo's account of her serving the drink and returning the change has no mention of any attempted tip. Cooper was offered free drinks later, he refused. The claim is that at sometime later Cooper randomly pulled the drink change money from his pocket and offered it to the ALL the stews ($6 each?) but they refused citing company policy.. Tina never actually stated a time. Flo mentioned it as AFTER the ransom money was on the plane. Goerger is confused again,,, "Serenity Now"
  17. FLYJACK

    DB Cooper

    3 packets (100 bills/packet) were found, some incorrectly refer to them as bundles. packets banded together constitute a bundle. One bundle is a group of packets.
  18. FLYJACK

    DB Cooper

    Unfortunately, Georger still has the timeline wrong. Cooper did NOT attempt to tip when he actually got his drink and the change. Flo discussed the drink, payment and return of change to Cooper, she never mentioned a tip attempted or otherwise. Flo recalled events in chronological order, she mentioned that Cooper tried to offer money from the drink change to ALL stews after Flo handled the bag of money. Tina claimed at one time Cooper tried to give money from his pockets to ALL the stews. "He opened the bag and inspected the contents which Miss MUCKLOW said she observed was money packed in small packages with bank-type bands around each package. Having inspected the money in a cursory fashion, the hijacker stated that “it looked okay” and then indicated to Miss MUCKLOW that the crew could now permit the passengers to deplane. She stated that she called the cockpit on the intercom with this message and an announcement was made from the cockpit that passengers at that time could disembark. Miss MUCKLOW recalled that she, in attempt to be humorous, stated to the hijacker while the passengers were unloading that there was obviously alot of money in the bag she wondered if she could have some. The hijacker immediately agreed with her suggestion and took one package of the money, denominations unrecalled by Miss MUCKLOW, and handed it to her. She returned the money, stating to the hijacker that she was not permitted to accept gratuities or words to that effect. In this connection Miss MUCKLOW recalled that at one time during the flight the hijacker had pulled some single bills from his pocket and attempted to tip all the girls on the crew. Again they declined in compliance with company policy." The point here is that these stories are both incompatible and unbelievable. Cooper did NOT attempt a tip when he actually got his drink and the change. (At terminal) Flo indicated the attempted tip was after the money was delivered. Why would Cooper tip all the stews later from drink change? $6 each?? It is hard to believe Tina would ask for ransom money, take it then hand it back claiming they can't accept gratuities.. Ransom money isn't a gratuity and she asked for it. One or both of these stories is false... they are incompatible. The theory is the tip refusal stories were an embellishment to cover for Cooper offering them all money and one or more of them may have taken it.
  19. FLYJACK

    DB Cooper

    The three packets were in one rubber banded bundle.. "It's all from one bundle" said John Pringle "There is certain information only known to the hijacker"
  20. FLYJACK

    DB Cooper

    This is the timeline from the FBI files... which nobody seems to have researched. Tina asked for some ransom money, Cooper gave her some, she took it then returned it claiming that they aren't allowed gratuities and she used the refusal of the drink money tip as confirmation. Tina's story sounds bogus, ransom money isn't a gratuity. She asked for some, took it and the drink tip incident came later. While Tina was getting the chutes, Cooper even asked Flo to lift the money bag. The FBI files only document the stews stories, the FBI doesn't know if they were true or not. Is it reasonable to believe that after Cooper handed some ransom money to Tina and offered some to the other Stews that with $200,000 ransom money in his possession while preparing to don a parachute, giddy with excitement he reached into his pocket and offered the $18 drink change from hours earlier to the stews.. $6 each?? I think the story is BS, somebody is hiding something. Tina version Tina brought money to Cooper. Cooper inspected it. “bank type bands” Cooper let passengers go. Tina asked or some money. Cooper gave her some, she returned it claiming against company policy and noting that Cooper tried to give all stews a tip from drink change and they declined. Passengers deplaned. Tina went out for parachutes. Cooper asked Tina to lower shades after first parachute brought on. Tina’s last trip was a large parachute, Cooper looks them over and all stews were still on board. Schaffner version All passengers deboarded the plane. She, Tina and Alice talked to Cooper. Cooper asked Tina to go get parachutes. Cooper asked Flo to lift money bag. Cooper offered the stews money, change from the $20 for a drink. She refused the tip. Cooper bagan putting on parachute. She and Alice went to exit the plane, Tina went to the rear. She returned to get her purse.
  21. FLYJACK

    DB Cooper

    I rank the "plant to be found" theory very low as finding it would have been extremely unlikely. If somebody wanted it found they would do it in a way that assured discovery. My top three TBAR theories in no particular order.. The money washed down the Lewis to the Columbia, the massive 1976/77 dredge/barge operation across the river on Sauvie brought the money in material upstream by barge. Erosion caused it to come loose and deposit across the river on TBAR. The TBAR money was the money offered to the stews. Discarded later. The money was dropped and hung on the stairs to work loose and drop over the Columbia River upstream of TBAR. The stairs are only slightly open with no weight on them. One of the 3 packets was missing 20 bills, either they deteriorated/separated and were not discovered at TBAR or somebody removed them between the hijacking and deposit on TBAR. If so, this supports the theory that somebody had possession of the packets after the hijacking, perhaps those 20 bills were spent.. I wish we could get the original ransom list "in order".
  22. FLYJACK

    DB Cooper

    There is more evidence to support this theory... Tina moved to within a few miles of the Columbia River just upstream of TBAR in the late 1970's..
  23. FLYJACK

    DB Cooper

    me too, originally, but not so,, I carefully went through the timeline from the witnesses in the FBI files and matched the stories up,, This was hours after the drink change was given back to Cooper. and the claim of Cooper tipping from pockets occurred after the money was on board and after Tina was given ransom money and claimed she returned it,, that is one reason I believe it is a made up story, an embellishment, a virtue signal. Only Cooper and the stews really know what happened. Anybody really think Cooper is going to tip 3 stews from $18 when he has $200,000 and already gave some to Tina. One TBAR theory is that one or more of the Stews kept some ransom money and discarded it later.. it never left the plane with Cooper.
  24. FLYJACK

    DB Cooper

    but Tina confirmed she asked for and rec'd ransom money, she claimed she gave it back,, and in one of the books Cooper offered money to the other stews as well. I don't believe the tip story. It doesn't make sense or fit the timeline when you carefully line up all the Stew's stories. Cooper had his drink hours before and received change, no tip then. After he receives the ransom he hands ransom money to Tina, she returned it using the no tip allowed excuse but the time Cooper tried to tip the stew's came later. Cooper has $200,000 and tries to tip 3 the stew's change from a $20 after he gave ransom money to Tina,, no way. In one of the Cooper books, Cooper offered the other stew's ransom money as well. IMO, the tip story is bogus… At 14:29 in video, Cooper offered ransom money to EACH stew.. 3 stews and 3 packets found on TBAR?
  25. FLYJACK

    DB Cooper

    The flightpath is solid, to reject it for an alternative requires the NORJAK crew, NWA, Boeing, the Air Force, flight controllers and chase pilots to all be collectively wrong and to cover it up. There weren't three bundles found on TBAR.. There were 3 packets.. of 100 bills (one was missing some) Cooper received randomize sized bundles of packets (100 bills).. The three packets found on TBAR went to Cooper in a bundle. The argument that the three packets landed independently and must have been in a container is not valid and an error. The 3 packets of money most likely came from ONE bundle. With that, there are many theories for the money arriving at TBAR as one bundle. I have several theories,, my favourite one is that the TBAR money was the money offered to the stews.. as we know it was separated from the money bag. But, it may as simple as Cooper dropping a bundle on the stairs and it fell off over the Columbia after he jumped.