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Venom1986

JFX really suitable for wingsuit ?

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Hi,
On the description of the canopy, you can read you can jump wingsuit with it. Is this possible ?
Has the canopy more the ability of the 7-cell canopy than the high elliptical, crossbraced 21-cell what he is at the openings ? 
Jumps anyone the JFX with his wingsuit ? How are the openings ? Has maybe a line twist and his effect ? Evil spin with dive or furthermore suitable for wingsuit ?
http://www.nzaerosports.com/canopies/daedalus-JFX

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The description is a bit strange in my eyes. They state that this would be the canopy for work and fun jumps including WS flying but at the end of the description they say "Recommended wing loading 1.8 to 2.8".
A wingloading around 2.0 in a wingsuit is nothing I would recommend. Some people might fly such a wing in a WS but I don't know anyone who jumps an elliptical canopy or one loaded at >2.0 and had over 300 WS jumps with it without cutting away. (not stating that there is no one)
I don't know the JFX but have my doubts that it would be a good idea to fly an elliptical wing loaded around 2 in a WS.
For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong.

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You can jump any canopy you like with a wingsuit you just need to assess the level of risk you wish to personally take. Their is ample common sense advice that will state if you wish to decrease the risk of potential malfunctions or deployment issues your better off with a non elliptical non highly loaded canopy. We seem to ask the same questions over and over again, the advice is out their have a look and decide upon it.

Anyone can tell you I jump thsi or that and its fine, but you have no idea of how they fly, the packing, deployment or wingloading or personal risk levels. So read the well established advice and make a decision.
Dont just talk about it, Do it!

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My personal advice: If you switch disciplines occasionally get a cheap used 7 cell (like a Triathlon) and buy a set of risers/ bag/ PC. When you want to wingsuit just connect the low performance canopy and have peace of mind.
I have a Crosssfire2 129 I use for freeflying and a Tri 160 for wingsuiting. Currently, since I’m only freeflying at he tunnel the Tri is quickly becoming my main canopy:)
Engineering Law #5: The most vital dimension on any plan drawing stands the most chance of being omitted

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I agree with this as well. A Sabre 1 also makes a great WS canopy and you can pick them up really cheap. The last two I got were for $300 each. Picked up a D-bag, PC and risers for $140. Now I can switch mains at will.

Did I mention I'm a gear whore?
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A wingloading around 2.0 in a wingsuit is nothing I would recommend. Some people might fly such a wing in a WS but I don't know anyone who jumps an elliptical canopy or one loaded at >2.0 and had over 300 WS jumps with it without cutting away. (not stating that there is no one)
I don't know the JFX but have my doubts that it would be a good idea to fly an elliptical wing loaded around 2 in a WS.



For what it is worth... When I still skydived I used to jump Icarus Extreme FX 88 sqft loaded at 2.1 - 2.2 for all of my jumps, including WS. I recon I made 100 - 150 ws jumps with it and had no problems. I also know a friend who regularly jumps 70 sqft FX loaded around 2, has maybe 300 ws jumps with it and is super happy (can´t recall if he has chopped it yet or not). So it can be done for sure but obviously if you can afford a seprarate WS rig x-braced highly loaded canopies are not your primary choice. If you need to choose 1 canopy for all of your jumps, then it´s a trade off between the length of the swoops or the cost of occasional reserve repack after a chop. :)
http://www.ufufreefly.com

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Tony U jumps one and loves it. Says it opens way better than his Saber 2 and better on heading. All he jumps is wingsuits. I am going to demo one and see how it goes. When I talked with Tony he loved the canopy.



Jari K is jumping a Katana 97 with wing suit. Does it mean anything for most of us? I don't think so.

Keep in mind that Tony U has escape sleeve on his suits, so he can reach risers without unzipping....

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As Gabor also sais, not everyone has the same 2000 to 10.000 jumps as other 'examples' of people that use those canopies on wingsuit jumps.

Aside from a choice of canopies being clever, I also see certain people fly 2 inches from the ground in a wingsuit. Doesnt mean everyone should do so or would be capable of doing so.

Every canopy CAN be used with a wingsuit. But not every canopy is the most ideal choice one can make.

Robert Peknic jumped an Atair Radical 95 as a wingsuit canopy. Currently he upsized and changed to a PD Storm 135. Some canopies can be fun to fly, but treat you like their bitch on opening.
For some people the (short) flying fun is worth the hassle. For some that type of fun wears of after a while, and solid, on-heading, predictable and comfortable openings are the new 'fun'.

Jumping a suit where 'you can reach your risers' I think has little to do with what canopy you choose as a main. EVERY suit allows you to do a normal cutaway and reserve pull without needing to unzip or reach.
Its only the reserve where the ability to reach up while in a spin, without lifting knees (which doesnt work on 90% of the 'sleeve' system suits, also visable in the constant redesigns, topics on clothing selection etc, and some manufacturers choosing to keep a functional cutaway aside of such features:D).

Jump whatever size and make main you want.
Selecting your reserve of a size and make you trust during any type of opening is a more important aspect.
As well as a rigger who gives you a discount on repack if you have to chop your main again:P

With 2 years in the sport, and most likely not thousands of jumps, I would advise to go for a moderate and known canopy as your choice for wingsuit flying...
JC
FlyLikeBrick
I'm an Athlete?

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wasn't directed at you... hadn't even read your post. Just an illustration of what can go wrong combining small canopies and wing suits. This is the second video I have seen where this happens... then again ...do whatever you want as long as you don't physicaly hurt or kill anyone else

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I am no expert when it comes to canopies. However, isnt it about time that a working mans cross brace hit the market. My velocity feels much more stable and rigid than my storm. I dont know about line trim aspect ratio and what have you but maybe what they have done with the JFX is given you a nice stable platform that has docile opening much like 9 and 7 cell non cross braced canopies. Part of the issue with the velocity being so damn twitch line length as well. Maybe someone from NZ can speak to this.

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You didnt get the hint at sarcasm?

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Jump whatever size and make main you want.



Meaning you'll most likely see more of your reserve than most people:P



I retired my Stiletto shortly after I started WS. Very bad combination.
...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

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Yes Cross bracing makes a more rigid canopy, it also means less deformation in flight so you change the wing shape rather than depress the wing shape through partial deflation change in pressurization. However with the benefits this brings in terms of performance, glide path efficiency and construction it also means that on deployment any assymentry can create a far greater rate of change in canopy direction, surge and recation depending on the situation, line twists, assymetrical loading etc etc. So as I said in my earlier posts jump what you like but use common sense, the information is out there and the information from tens of thousands of jumps is pretty clear. As for a working mans crossbrace, hmm and lets have a working mans F1 car wouldnt that be great. No not all things are for all people and what is a working mans crossbrace anyway?
Dont just talk about it, Do it!

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Maybe the JFX is the working mans cross brace. A cross braced canopy that is not super twitchy wants to open on heading or aka opens much like a normal 9 or 7 cell. Jumping a velo I pull and hope for the best. I sure dont expect it. I just love flying the canopy so makes it worth it. If someone built something with just a slight loss in performance but better opening characteristics then yes thats a working mans cross brace. We were crazy to go from rounds to squares.

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One mans ferrari is another man BMW, beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Working man or not, i wouldnt be jumping a Velo if the approach was deploy and hope. have a chat with PD about what your doing, they dont design canopies to deploy like nightmares, however twitchy they might be. Also if mentally your thinking this come pull time its likely you'll reflect this in your body position. Hope it improves and keep enjoying the flight.
Dont just talk about it, Do it!

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You can jump anything with wing suit, if you have consistant good openings with your current canopy than you'll probably have good results with jfx as well.
Tagle jumped velo 69 or 7 something for the record with full RDS
Cani jumped his jfx for the REAL record.

Having jumped a jfx, my experience is that it openes really nice and quick but like any x-braced canopy, when shit goes wrong it will go wrong very quickly.
Bernie Sanders for President 2016

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I guess I over simplified. Until I got my velo I have never even come close to chopping. I will say it opens better than my Katana did. So would not say its a nightmare but in 150 jumps its been chopped twice. Relax look at the horizon pull symmetrically I dont touch risers while its opening stay centered in harness. My thought on working mans cross brace is making it a bit less aggressive and twitchy. Its gotta be possible. Anyway good thread. I do hope to demo a JFX see the differences.

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