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PhoenixRising

FWC

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I am pleased to announce the first graduates of Flock University's wingsuit coach course.

Congratulations guys:

Brian Snarr
Reg Hurlbut
Scott Thomas
Justin Pabis
Michal Motykiewicz


This past weekend I had the pleasure of running 5 coaches through our very progressive program. The candidates spent all day Friday Doing ground prep and eval jumps. With spill over work on Saturday.

There was a lot of learning and discussion. Even I learned some new things.

Look soon for our website to be updated with coach lists, events
And information on how to take the course if interested.

Flock University is a non manufacturer based wingsuit coach rating. We strive for standardization through all of our school locations and coaches.

Our new Website will be back up and running in a a few days. Look for an announcement here!

Jumptown, MA
Skydive Chicago, IL
Skydive Cross Keys, NJ
Seattle, WA
Skydive Midwest, MI

More coaches and locations are in the works.

Contact us if you are interested in becoming a coach or open a school. There are multiple coach courses coming in the next few months.

There are lots of benefits to being a coach and even more with a school. Growth also fosters our rapidly growing discipline.

Let's keep it safe and fun. Push your skills farther today with an FWC rating.
Wingsuit organizing, first flight courses and coaching
Flock University
Tonysuits

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looks just like the PFC-thing.. except for the outrageous cost.

swissskydive has such a program for YEARS already. and nobody gives a shit about it.

such a shame you guys cant come up with something much more original..
“Some may never live, but the crazy never die.”
-Hunter S. Thompson
"No. Try not. Do... or do not. There is no try."
-Yoda

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Good stuff Justin! Way to go!



I agree, nice job on re working the website and updating the Flock U FWC system. A nice level of continuity with the FFC and coach system can't be a bad thing.

Scott
"He who Hesitates Shall Inherit the Earth!"

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While putting this together, we discussed membership fees. Bottom line is we strive to keep coaches up to date and current. Just like UPSA or other governing bodies, coaches and instructors must maintain a certain level of proficiency to be able to instruct. An annual fee ensures coaches currency, their interest and ability to keep current. If not, and they lose interest thats ok. They do not have to renew. As far as level 1 and 2, we want coaches who can backfly, doing backfly coaching etc. There SHOULD be a way for students to be able to sift through coaches and who can do what. These ratings are for our school to run consistently from location to location and from coach to coach. This rating ensures the coach you hire has the most up to date training and has shown the qualifications and ability to do so. No one NEEDS a rating to teach, whether it is BMI,PFC, FWC. But they DO show ones interest in the greater good, and that they strive to make our sport safer in the long run.
Wingsuit organizing, first flight courses and coaching
Flock University
Tonysuits

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so the difference from WSI to FWC is that the new name makes sure that no students do get killed in the process of being "coached"!?

the new title also insures that no "ratings" do get passed over beers?

BTW, if you want to be as proficient as you say, i would re-phrase your last post, as i noticed about ten spelling errors, just quickly reading over it. most prominent being UPSA. if that's how detail-oriented you give out your ratings.. well, i pass that one!
“Some may never live, but the crazy never die.”
-Hunter S. Thompson
"No. Try not. Do... or do not. There is no try."
-Yoda

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so the difference from WSI to FWC is that the new name makes sure that no students do get killed in the process of being "coached"!?

the new title also insures that no "ratings" do get passed over beers?



WOW, why so bitter? You also got very snide/snipy in a number of posts when another "coach" course was announced, why the Hate? Working towards better more effective training should be applauded. Also having options like this one and the PFC course along with "school" options should be looked at as an opportunity to raise overall standards for wingsuits. Like it or in your case not, this concept is something that is working and there is apparently a demand for it. I will have to take a look in the swooping forum, but are you also taking this same approach towards other discipline specific training or schools like canopy flight schools.

Oh well, it seems that other then complaining about a price associated with the "rating" or I guess more accurately a rating/organization/continuity of training in general, YOU do not really have anything to say about the concept that is constructive. Too bad....

Scott
"He who Hesitates Shall Inherit the Earth!"

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i'm not bitter at all, i just think that whatever comes from over the pond has been in place on this side for ages, or was invented here; yet it's advertised as "new and exciting"!

as you say, if you got nothiing contructive to add, too bad for YOU!
“Some may never live, but the crazy never die.”
-Hunter S. Thompson
"No. Try not. Do... or do not. There is no try."
-Yoda

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Nowhere did I say "New and exciting" There are ALL kinds of GREAT courses out there. Because they exist, shall we give up? Should we stop teaching and leading the new wingsuiters in our discipline because "over there" invented it? Shit maybe you're right. Either way i will lend credit here and say We did not invent it, we are simply doing it and doing it well.

Hope you have a good day and safe jumps.

J
Wingsuit organizing, first flight courses and coaching
Flock University
Tonysuits

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i'm not bitter at all, i just think that whatever comes from over the pond has been in place on this side for ages, or was invented here; yet it's advertised as "new and exciting"!

as you say, if you got nothiing contructive to add, too bad for YOU!



I can't sleep, I'm bored, and have only been READING this forum for a long while.......holding back a lot of what of what needs to be said.....on a number of things.

OK...FINE; I'll be your Huckleberry and step into this one.

@ Scott Callantine - I like what you said and how you went about saying it. Miss ya buddy.

@ Virgin Burner - OK; you have 300 some odd jumps and started 4 years ago....somewhere around 2007 right? Good for you!

Read on Virgin Burner......because I really don't think you have done your homework.

Would you like some "documented historical origins" of wingsuit training and instruction?

I just pulled off my bookshelf "SkyFlying - Wingsuits in Motion" PUBLISHED/COPYRIGHTED in 2005 by Scott Campos ( Lou Diamond on this forum); Get a copy; you'll like it! Its a 200 page high print quality, extremely technical well written and color / photo illustrated book. Scott also gives contributing credit to Chuck Blue. Photo acknowledgements to some "big names" other folks you may have heard of in your 4 years with us including Jari Kuosma who founded Birdman, Boris Pecnik, Jarno Cordia, and Ed Pawlowski to name a few; others are given credit in the book. All of these folks mentioned are regular / postive contributing members in this forum. All of these folks contributed to this book.

So in the "spirit" of who did what first, whose better than who, how knows more than the other guy and why you should listen to "me" the Latest Rock Star that DOMINATES this forum; I continue.......

The 2005 COPYRIGHT in Scott Campos' book says the following:

" All rights reserved under International and Pan-American Copyright Conventions. No part of this publication may be reproduced without the permission of the publisher. All photos, illlustrations, and graphical representations are the property of the author or have been used with permission. They are not to be used, removed, modified, or used in any way, shape or form without the express written consent of the author in accordance with copyright law.

OK.....so we have something "officially in print and documented"; A WRITTEN AND COPYRIGHTED BOOK; on wingsuiting and we have been at this wingsuit thing for how many years now?

When I started flying a wingsuit in 2005; I met Scott Campos at my home DZ in Eloy and that is how I found out about Birdman Wingsuits. Later on I also "heard" of another company called Phoenix Fly Wingsuits from other wingsuiters who got trained by people......who sold Phoenix Fly Suits.

Back then we had a "manufacturing / go sell the suit based training system"

But even back then I heard "grumblings" that Phoenix Fly "stole / duplicated" what Scott Campos/Birdman had put together so they could train people who were sold suits......and we kicked off our little WINGSUIT CIVIL WAR / HOSTILITY

Does this mean that people now get "sued" over using copyrighted material? NO! Absolutely not! C'mon realistically nobody can "contain / restrict" knowledge and training unless your the military or government. We have had people training others....who go on to train others, who go on to train others for years; but the information had to have its "origins"...its "Genesis" somewhere at least; right?

I can GUARANTEE YOU; that Justin Shorb, Jeff Nebelkpof and thier little "Flock University" crew did not put the first pen to paper and magically create wingsuit instruction out of thin air. Justin copied the information from somebody else, repeated what he had learned / was trained from somebody else, basically copied the ESPN U logo into the Flock U logo for "branding", hooked up with Tony Suits, and along with Jeff Nebelkopf basically opened up a "third war front" going after Scott Campos / Birdman in our little wingsuit civil war.

Jeff and Justin went all all over the country pushing Tony Suit wingsuits and everything I heard Justin Shorb and Jeff Nebelkopf say and do for students in training was EXACTLY like I was taught by by Scott Campos circa 2005. And the "newbee" who encounters them circa 2011.....thinks that "its Flock Universities system, knowledge" BULLSHIT .....when in fact they put on wingsuit for the first time and had to be trained by somebody else.

Justin Shorb and Jeff Nebelkopf; I'm calling you to the microphone. Who is the person who did your First Flight Course, what program, where, and when? Who do you give credit to teaching you and where to do your trace your "wingsuit origins"

DSE; Douglas Spotted Eagle; you know him....he is a forum moderator all over this forum commenting on everything, advising on everything, all the time, as if it is a full time job.

I met DSE at the Eloy Holiday Boogie 2007; and guess who did the Birdman FFC for DSE? Scott Campos!

Time moved on and a year later DSE got involved in "Flock University" - Justin Shorb and the Tony Suit crowd. Time moved further on....and DSE got involved with Phoenix Fly and DSE started up his own school in Lake Elsinore, CA.

FFC student shows up at DSE's school in Elsinore and the student look up from the creeper thinks "All this came from Spot, Spot created all of this, NOPE DSE learned from Scott Campos.

Newbee shows up on this forum asking questions and suddenly the one time "students" are now the "masters", somebody's huge ego has to be "more right" at the expense of somebody else being more wrong .....and the pissing contest starts all over again. Same questions / issues just change the screen names; boring......

Your Right! NONE of this shit is new or exciting; NONE OF IT.

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I think you need to read up a bit more about the history of wingsuiting and who founded BirdMan with Jari before starting his own successful company - that didn't sell jeans.

In other news, I LOL'd when you mentioned Scotts book.
Phoenix Fly - High performance wingsuits for skydiving and BASE
Performance Designs - Simply brilliant canopies

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i wrote him a PM with just that info, and others along. i actually wanted to write it public at first, but yea, let the TS-fanboys ruin every good thread.

just for the record, i do actually jump a tonysuit.

if the one crowd stops harrassing the other fanboys, i will stop my bickering. this brandwars really gets annoying and makes all wingsuiters look like princesses in fairy dresses. ok, we actually are! :D
“Some may never live, but the crazy never die.”
-Hunter S. Thompson
"No. Try not. Do... or do not. There is no try."
-Yoda

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DSE; Douglas Spotted Eagle; you know him....he is a forum moderator all over this forum commenting on everything, advising on everything, all the time, as if it is a full time job.

I met DSE at the Eloy Holiday Boogie 2007; and guess who did the Birdman FFC for DSE? Scott Campos!

Time moved on and a year later DSE got involved in "Flock University" - Justin Shorb and the Tony Suit crowd. Time moved further on....and DSE got involved with Phoenix Fly and DSE started up his own school in Lake Elsinore, CA.

FFC student shows up at DSE's school in Elsinore and the student look up from the creeper thinks "All this came from Spot, Spot created all of this, NOPE DSE learned from Scott Campos.



To clarify;
~Scott Campos didn't do my FFC, someone else did. Scott did my second FFC. I did learn from Scott, just as I've learned from a lot of others. Just as Scott learned from others. Just as everyone who has ever skydived learned from others. Sometimes in learning from others we realize what is missing from their teaching and improve upon the foundation laid.

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+1 to Spot.

Like I said, I did not invent it, I am just doing my best to make a safe school and to produce skilled safe wingsuit pilots. My FFC was from Lurch, Brian Caldwell in 2006. He was a great teacher and was a PFI at the time. Brian is a current proponent of Flock U still. There really is only so many ways to teach wingsuit flight and all first flight courses are similar in most ways. AND THEY SHOULD BE. Spot learned alot from us, and I learned from him, I think what he is doing with PF and at Elsinore is GREAT. Who gives a fuck if he started after me or has less jumps. HE IS DOING A GOOD JOB, and for that there should be nothing negative to say. ANYONE who takes on the challenge of teaching the future of our sport should be commended, NOT GIVEN A HARD TIME.

NOW I MUST GO JUMP. THAT IS ALL.

JUSTIN
Wingsuit organizing, first flight courses and coaching
Flock University
Tonysuits

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I'm not sure what point you're trying to make in that massive paragraph.

If the point is that every student has had a teacher at one point in their lives, well yes, that should be obvious.

If the point is that nobody but the very first teachers should be able to construct instructional programs, well no, that is silly.
www.WingsuitPhotos.com

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