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mccordia

Scam allert - Wingsuit Coaches/Instructors etc

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Recently we've been getting some sketchy requests for trainingcamps, for people offering big sums of money and deposits, for big groups.

I know some dropzones recently had similar 'camp' requests, equaly sketchy in details. And always with half the money payd up front, and the other half payd a few weeks before the 'event' by a traveling 'financial director'.

The initial payment is always made in methods where the money needs to have a part sent back. Typical nigerian scammer setups. It only took one email to find out, but just in case someone is a bit to trustworthy...

Be carefull who you accept money from, and by what means..some shitty people out there online!
JC
FlyLikeBrick
I'm an Athlete?

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I'm confused. I thought the Nigerian scams required you to send them money first, to "unlock" the fortune awaiting you.

The people you are describing are giving you some money up front? How is that helping them out? How can that hurt you?
www.WingsuitPhotos.com

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They send cheques that take a while to clear, only they dont clear.
They usually send a few thousand more than needed, and ask for immidiate refunds. It takes a week or to for their cheque/money order to come back as fake, by which time you've already sent them their 'partial refund'

Seen it on Oprah man....:P

JC
FlyLikeBrick
I'm an Athlete?

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Here's one I got the other day. I replied to the first one tentatively as it wasn't immediately clear what he actually wanted.

I love the $9500 for their logistical planner! :D

> On 26 Oct 2010, at 06:34, JIM BLACK wrote:
>
>> Hi
>> I received your email,good to hear from you. They are learners
>> (novice) and we need experience instructors to train them on basics
>> and field.They are males, 19yrs old,weight 74,72, 70 ,73 and 74kg
>> ,height 5.9 ft all and 3 of them are from Northumberland, England
>> United Kingdom while 2 of them are from United state.I want to know
>> the total cost of training in dollars or GBP. We need 4hrs training
>> for 5days, every week.
>>
>> PLEASE EMAIL ME THE TOTAL COST FOR YOUR SERVICES AND STATE CLEARLY
>> YOUR 50% DEPOSIT PLUS $9500.00 FOR OUR CARETAKER (THE LOGISTICAL
>> PLANNING PERSON) ON LOGISTIC ARRANGEMENTS,The caretaker come to your
>> establishment two weeks before our arrival to finalize the
>> reservation. What is your payment option? Do you accept credit cards?
>>
>> Jim Black
>>
>> On 10/25/10, Macca wrote:
>>> Jim,
>>>
>>> Where do you guys / girls jump at the moment? How many jumps do each of
>>> the
>>> people have?
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>>
>>> Macca
>>>
>>> _____________________
>>> Macca
>>> Phoenix-Fly.com
>>>
>>>
>>> On 25 Oct 2010, at 06:31, Jim Black wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Hello
>>>> I want to book for 5 people coming over to take Wing suit lessons in
>>>> your
>>>> facility for a period of 4weeks, we need quality instructors or tutors
>>>> who
>>>> can teach them effectively because they are all learners(Novice).What
>>>> is
>>>> the total cost for the 6 persons,Let me know if you have availability
>>>> for
>>>> this dates,accommodation or apartment to hire.My Date is flexible
>>>> Details.......... If there any informations you need just email your
>>>> question and i will respond immediately.
>>>> Arrival Date.7th Feb. 2011 .
>>>> Departure Date 7th Mar. 2011.
>>>> Regards
>>>> Jim Black,
>>>> England, United Kingdom.
>>>> United Kingdom-- +44701113298

Phoenix Fly - High performance wingsuits for skydiving and BASE
Performance Designs - Simply brilliant canopies

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Jim Black is awesome...a quick google search shows he's also into running marathons. Must be the same group of people thats doing extreme stuff all over the world. Their doctor is pricey for a week though...

Quote

From: Jim Black [mailto:[email protected]]
Sent: Friday, September 24, 2010 10:18 AM
Subject: Booking


Hello,
Compliments of the day,I want to check availability for marathon sport in your facility ,for a group of 7 adults for 4 weeks or more,depending on the routine of your classes,this classes will run through the month of Nov. 2010 to Dec. between the dates 15/11/2010 to 15/12/2010,if my request is granted,i would be glad to also make plans for training kits if possible or necessary, confirm as well if supplies can be made for the group for there training with you,feel free to make references to us about hotels,guest houses close to your training facility or site ,please advise.What are your payment option?Do you accept 50% deposit via credit cards?Get back to me in details with necessary information we need to know,enclose the total cost of your services plus $7500 for our medical insurance which will given to our medical doctor for their medical insurance,or an estimate of the cost of this project,i await your suggestions and reply towards our request.hope to hear from you soon.

Regards
Jim Black
United Kingdom
+447011132987


JC
FlyLikeBrick
I'm an Athlete?

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Jim Black
United Kingdom
+447011132987



Someone should call that number (anonymously)... see what kind of character is on the other end.

Leading along Nigerian scammers is an art form, by the way. Some people actually are so good they get the Nigerians to send them money. Usually it's just pictures of some shmuck doing something silly.

Check 419eater.com for hilarious email conversations and silly pictures of hopeful Nigerians.
Costyn van Dongen - http://www.flylikebrick.com/ - World Wide Wingsuit News

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Quote

Jim Black
United Kingdom
+447011132987



Someone should call that number (anonymously)... see what kind of character is on the other end.

Leading along Nigerian scammers is an art form, by the way. Some people actually are so good they get the Nigerians to send them money. Usually it's just pictures of some shmuck doing something silly.

Check 419eater.com for hilarious email conversations and silly pictures of hopeful Nigerians.



I just tried the number. It rings, but with a really strange ring tone i've never heard before - then cuts off. What a surprise!
Phoenix Fly - High performance wingsuits for skydiving and BASE
Performance Designs - Simply brilliant canopies

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Google just the phone number you get a loong list of other adventures by mister black and his group of 'adventurers'

Finding letter on kitesurfing lessons, fencing lessons, hang-gliding lessons, a lottery and also references to Jim Black on dz.com related to scams targeting DZO's.
JC
FlyLikeBrick
I'm an Athlete?

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Not new! We've all known this sentence to be true for the last seven years.Cool



yea...still tons of people calling themselves all that in skill and knowledge and training people, yet not desire to show and validate those skills in any real way that promotes a certain standard or safety:P;)
JC
FlyLikeBrick
I'm an Athlete?

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Scam allert - Wingsuit Coaches/Instructors etc - NEW



Not new! We've all known this sentence to be true for the last seven years.B|




This feels like DeJaVu.....

"Pot meet Kettle".

Shit, Glenn if you put half the hot air that spews from your mouth, into the wings of your suit, you might get more than 90 seconds from 14K.
----------------------------------------------
You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously.

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yea...still tons of people calling themselves all that in skill and knowledge and training people, yet not desire to show and validate those skills in any real way that promotes a certain standard or safety:P;)



[pa removed] I've never said I'm "all that" in terms of any level of Skill at flight, ability to successfully teach a WS ground course or follow along with in flight coaching. I do OK, The people I mentored into wingsuits do OK, and they are all happy. But then 75% or more of them would have done OK just reading the manual and going for it anyway. I pass along some BTWs and answer any questions that come up on the spot. The magic is all them. I'm not magic or "all that" and will never claim to be.

The Audacious part is that a select few self appointed ( as in nobody voted you into the position you just decided what is best for everybody) have decided they will set the new standard. Everybody else who came before was wrong or incapable. They must all re-certify to the new standard. Your new standard.

Step back, take a breath- doesn't that sound like homeless, living on the street, crack cocaine crazy? You want what you few want but that does not make it any less crazy.

Fact: I harshly raised my nose up at the first batch of chief instructor/ examiners in regards to whom should and should not be allowed to instruct. Nothing to lose, I'm not getting suits for free. Seven years later I will not bow down to the next generation of WS chief instructor/ examiners in regards to who can and can not teach a first flight course. Specially ones that don't have my time in the discipline..... and that is fact.

One last question I'm I the guy on the left or right in the balcony? They look wise and in great shape for their years you should pay attention when they mock the weak and silly.

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Shit, Glenn if you put half the hot air that spews from your mouth, into the wings of your suit, you might get more than 90 seconds from 14K.




It is nice to see you take a few seconds out from bashing Lodi and Bill to bash on me. I'll make a note the exalted one does not approve.

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The Audacious part is that a select few self appointed ( as in nobody voted you into the position you just decided what is best for everybody) have decided they will set the new standard. Everybody else who came before was wrong or incapable. They must all re-certify to the new standard. Your new standard.



Clarification:
The Phoenix-Fly standard is the standard for Phoenix-Fly. Others seem to respect it. Audacious? Perhaps in your world, but it's not your neck on the line when someone dies. We're not giving manufacturer support to someone with only 20 jumps or foregoing industry-standard gear checks that finish in fatalities.

Keep that nose raised if makes it easier for you to look down on those of us that strive to do better than "OK (aka 'perhaps maybe average')" and will never meet your standard. :P

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I do OK



Ive seen many self proclaimed 'intructors' (as you are/claim to be) train in half assed ways. Not saying you do so. But the only thing we're trying to do with the PF coaching program, is to make sure everyone who has that label is someone who knows what he/she is teaching, and doesnt just wing it based on 8 year old manuals. There is too much valuable teaching information out there, and it all been condensed into a good and working teaching program. And unless you want to go around claiming you are a PF coach, this stuff is all stuff you can happily ignore and go about in your own 'I do ok' teaching methods.

No AFF instructor is magic, but for sure, they've proven their worth. And if they suck, their teaching allowance/rating is taken away. Sure that same guy can stil rent a plane, and teach someone the whole AFF program on his own accord. It would be frowned uppon. But he could..

You seem to enjoy getting your panties in a twist over people having to prove they can do what they claim to be capable of.

Quote

Step back, take a breath- doesn't that sound like homeless, living on the street, crack cocaine crazy?



Some of what you wrote...maybe...
But otherwise...not really.
As DSE also commented. The PFC standard is only one that applies to people wanting to be one. As a seal of approval.
The list of people involved in setting and upgrading that standard is compromised of A LOT of names and people in the sport with a lot more years in the sport, first flight and teaching experience related to wingsuit flying than you will ever be able to get street-cred for.
People who all activly help the sport grow, instead of trying to keep thing the way they are. Which an increasing amount of bad-teaching related accidents is showing, isnt the right way forward.

Quote

Fact: I harshly raised my nose up at the first batch of chief instructor/ examiners in regards to whom should and should not be allowed to instruct. Nothing to lose, I'm not getting suits for free.



No PFC is getting suits for free either.
And the first batch of instructors. Thats also not what we are condoning or promoting. But I dont understand why you object to those 'first batch' people. Dont they adhere to a certain standard you'd like to see? Whats that standard? Should they all see you, and ask if they are 'OK'?
You dont agree with the skill/experience levels these standards seem to set, yet dont want to work and improve on that to make sure people who are crap dont get to teach or at use some fake made up/meaningless WSI rating to BS their way into teaching half-assed FFCs, leading to accidents. Great way to further the sport!
You bitch, yet dont actually DO anything about the thing you bitch about.

Quote

you should pay attention when they mock the weak and silly.



You should try dialog intead of monologue. Listening and undertanding, instead of being the creaming caveman throwing rocks at the moon....;)
Experience wise, some of those people with fewer years in the sport than you could tell, teach and outfly you by a large margin....
And thats ignoring the many people involved with equal or more years and experience in the sport than you have.

Weak and silly...if that makes you sleep better. For sure continue those empty rants..
JC
FlyLikeBrick
I'm an Athlete?

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