Imanewdiver 0 #1 February 20, 2010 Is the opening shock flying a wing suit any lower than in free fall? Since the vertical rate is much slower does that reduce the opening shock of the parachute? Or perhaps the vertically downward plus horizontal speed has a resultant similar to free fall? Love to know from an expert. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DAN0 0 #2 February 20, 2010 I'm not an expert but I've done a bunch of wingsuit flights. The opening (for me, at least) is a little softer cuz I will slow down a little horizontally but still be falling slowly vertically. It is still a harder opening than a hop-n-pop with very little delay. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The111 0 #3 February 20, 2010 Depends on your technique. If you do it with a lot of forward speed and leave your leg open, you can get whipped pretty hard which can hurt your back or neck if those are sensitive. If you do it right it can be softer than a freefall opening with very little whip.www.WingsuitPhotos.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
phoenixlpr 0 #4 February 21, 2010 Quote Depends on your technique. If you do it with a lot of forward speed and leave your leg open, you can get whipped pretty hard which can hurt your back or neck if those are sensitive. If you do it right it can be softer than a freefall opening with very little whip. Really? I do open from full flight most of the time. Even I have lots of forward speed (130-150 Km/h) still open softer than opening from terminal velocity. I jump a Triathlon160 with wing suit. When I deploy my PC it feels like a speed break or anchor than it turns into a canopy. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The111 0 #5 February 21, 2010 Quote Quote Depends on your technique. If you do it with a lot of forward speed and leave your leg open, you can get whipped pretty hard which can hurt your back or neck if those are sensitive. If you do it right it can be softer than a freefall opening with very little whip. Really? I do open from full flight most of the time. Even I have lots of forward speed (130-150 Km/h) still open softer than opening from terminal velocity. I jump a Triathlon160 with wing suit. When I deploy my PC it feels like a speed break or anchor than it turns into a canopy. Try it with 10 pounds of cameras above your head, then let me know what you think. It's not about speed as much as it is about angle. If you deploy from full flight you are going to get yanked backward and rotated 180 degrees (vs 90 degrees from falling straight down). That rotation is an acceleration which puts a whip on your head/neck/back. It's less pronounced if you don't have extra weight on top, but it still exists.www.WingsuitPhotos.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
phoenixlpr 0 #6 February 21, 2010 Quote Try it with 10 pounds of cameras above your head, then let me know what you think. I use to jump a bullet cam. 200g extra on my helmet. Quote It's not about speed as much as it is about angle. If you deploy from full flight you are going to get yanked backward and rotated 180 degrees (vs 90 degrees from falling straight down). That rotation is an acceleration which puts a whip on your head/neck/back. Yeah, that's the theory. I can tell you, I don't kiss my knees on opening. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The111 0 #7 February 21, 2010 QuoteYeah, that's the theory. I can tell you, I don't kiss my knees on opening. It's not a theory, it's basic physics. I can open full flight and not "kiss my knees" either. That doesn't mean there's not a stress on my body. If you want to minimize that stress, full flight is not the best way to go. If you can do full flight and the stress doesn't bother you... great. But that doesn't answer the original question.www.WingsuitPhotos.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
phoenixlpr 0 #8 February 21, 2010 If I break down my opening don't feel significantly softer, but it less nice because the big burble behind me. For the original question: v(h) 100 Km/h, v(v) 80 Km/h , means only 128.06 Km/h. My terminal speed is about 190-200Km/h. WS opening fells softer, slower than opening from terminal speed. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
yuri_base 1 #9 February 21, 2010 Quote Is the opening shock flying a wing suit any lower than in free fall? Yes, most of the time it's like falling into pillows. In fact, sometimes the openings are so soft that if I keep the leg wing open and pull from full flight, I don't swing forward past the point where the relative wind hits the leg wing from the back side - the aerodynamic force on the open leg wing is stronger than the deceleration caused by the inflating canopy. It feels weird to continue to fly while the slider is starting to slide down. Quote Or perhaps the vertically downward plus horizontal speed has a resultant similar to free fall? No, it's lower than the standard 120mph. For example, 90mph forward, 45mph down (L/D = 2.0) is only 100mph total speed. For big suits in full flight the numbers can be like 75mph forward, 30mph down (L/D = 2.5), that's only 81mph total. For f10ckers the numbers are usually switched around (30mph forward, 75mph down, D/L = 2.5), but the total is the same. Android+Wear/iOS/Windows apps: L/D Vario, Smart Altimeter, Rockdrop Pro, Wingsuit FAP iOS only: L/D Magic Windows only: WS Studio Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
yuri_base 1 #10 February 21, 2010 Quote It's not a theory, it's basic physics. Look who's talking. You used to ridicule anyone who used basic (and sometimes not so basic) physics in wingsuiting... what happened?! Times change, huh? Or they started to teach physics in aerospace schools after that Mars rover crash due to metric-imperial fuckup? Coming up next... Matt replaces 10lbs of cameras on his head with 10lbs of accelerometers, Pitot tubes, gyroscopes, GPS'es, and computers to prepare his B.S. thesis. Android+Wear/iOS/Windows apps: L/D Vario, Smart Altimeter, Rockdrop Pro, Wingsuit FAP iOS only: L/D Magic Windows only: WS Studio Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Imanewdiver 0 #11 February 21, 2010 So downward velocity is ABOUT 120 for a normal person in belly down free fall, and what would it reduce to with say a camera suit and booties? Perhaps 100 ish? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
timve 0 #12 February 26, 2010 i'm no expert either, but experimented 200 jumps with a stiletto 150 (1.6 WL) whilst wingsuiting. A few things I came across, - way of packing influences the opening sequence a lot - tucking in the tail deep into the packjob can kick you right unconscience, full flight or not. What helped for FF scared the hell out of me when opening speeds were reduced. - loose packjobs kept me fine, no rolling up, tucking in, etc... - WS and moderate - high loadad elliptical rags is fun, lot of twisting, kicking out, banging openings, I've seen them all... ask my surgean. ;) - jumping a storm 150 now same WL, loose packing, full flight, sinking in to terminal speed, all works fine ! - most canopies are designed to open in terminal velocity, opening them below is ... like a box of chocolats, you'll never know what you'll get. (and with 10 kg of gear on top, it hurts ... but then again this is my humble experience. grtz to you all oxygen wingsuitteam check out our newest movie Trainingweek Seville Spain 2010 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iwtzc1RDzDQ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
slim_shady 1 #13 February 26, 2010 Quote i'm no expert either, but experimented 200 jumps with a stiletto 150 (1.6 WL) whilst wingsuiting. you jumped a stiletto with a wingsuit ?? you crazy motherf###er !! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dragon2 0 #14 February 26, 2010 QuoteSo downward velocity is ABOUT 120 for a normal person in belly down free fall, and what would it reduce to with say a camera suit and booties? Perhaps 100 ish? Same speed as whatever your team/tandem is doing, which usually in my experience is 110mph-135mph. ciel bleu, Saskia Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The111 0 #15 February 26, 2010 QuoteQuoteSo downward velocity is ABOUT 120 for a normal person in belly down free fall, and what would it reduce to with say a camera suit and booties? Perhaps 100 ish? Same speed as whatever your team/tandem is doing, which usually in my experience is 110mph-135mph. But again, as I've already pointed out, it's not just about speed. It's about direction. Opening while moving chest/belly first, vs opening while moving headfirst. In the latter situation, you go through more of an rotation on opening, and all rotations are accelerations. If you want to minimize opening shock (which is dependent on accelerations), you should be moving straight down (in a head high position) as much as possible on opening.www.WingsuitPhotos.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dragon2 0 #16 February 26, 2010 Agreed, however I was replying to the statement that big camera wings would slow you down - at least it better be not JUST you going slow if you want to actually film anyone So, yes you can go slow with big camera wings, but mostly you would only do that when filming someone lighter than you, say a 9yr old tandempassenger ciel bleu, Saskia Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The111 0 #17 February 26, 2010 Yeh, I was more replying to the guy you were quoting... should have just quoted his post.www.WingsuitPhotos.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
