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mccordia

Moved to it's own thread:Dressing for success in wingsuit formations.

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Sure, if you can not make that you are just a small bird, not a hawk....:S
I fly a Stealth and its still fun and challenge to fly formation with someone in a (PF) tracking suit or a hybrid like Access.



Thats fine and im sure very fun, but if someone with a tracking suit can stay up with what we are calling a WS world record, it kind of takes some of the point out of it. Im pretty split on the whole flocking vs. non flocking issue. I agree with Tony and Yuri that these suits are meant to fly, and nothing to me in the world is more fun than a ws base jump off a huge cliff in the back country. I also enjoy flocking with large groups and have been lucky to be on some cool stuff at lodi. Im torn weather to be excited by this thread or mindlessly bored.


I really enjoy to fly 200Km/h (horizontal) and over, but that has nothing to do with flocking. If I fly with a formation I don't really care how slow we go, nothing compares to a high 5 after a good jump.

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If you fly in dock smooth enough it makes you fly better. Me and Juho made a two way dock fly very nice with our increased wingspan. My Altitrack thought that canopy was opened.

Wingsuits are made for flying.

Flying dirty is for fun.

Flying like r e a l l y flying is SUPER fun.
- No mercy in the flock! Straighten your legs!!! -

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If you fly in dock smooth enough it makes you fly better. .



That applies to RW and VRW too. However, that is falling, not flying.

Geese don't take grips. Maybe they've learned something in millions of years of evolution.
...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

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An 8way docked diamond as the minimum? It would sure be interesting for the tail guy, especially if we've all got the gas on.

Jarno implies that his suits allow his arms to be level with his shoulders (when standing). I'd like to see a pic of that.

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We made some test flights with Juho. We were flying very close but not taking grips just a little bit behind from front flyers wing. In right position the airflow made you float very easily.

The formation where the geese are flying is using the same phenomenon. It really works with wingsuits too.

We tested it also behind the front guys tailwing. Behind the tail there is a point just under the turbulence that makes you really floaty. You have to be very near and just under the turbulence. The envelope is very small but really effective.
- No mercy in the flock! Straighten your legs!!! -

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On my Stealth, i can get the arms all the way up to shoulder level/straight.
But even a swept wing position, like I have on my Acro doesnt seem to give any placement issues (see attachment..and thats with a huge/tall helmet).

A 2 meter person flying on your left, and 1.50 meter person flying on your right will be a more difficult thing to deal with than suit design. but even that may be solves easy with grippers from knee to toe. Who knows...

Its funny how we are compared to FS/RW and FF one time. Than tracking and atmonauti the other. And than suddenly we are airplane formations who just dont dock (cause the pussy metal birds dont have hands:P)


Its easy to do a simple and selective copy paste from each dicipline in terms of limitations. But like many things in our sport, we have to see which ones actually apply. We are a bit of this, a bit of that. But a completely different thing all together.

If your father is a relentlessly self-improving boulangerie owner from Belgium with low-grade narcolepsy and a penchant for buggery, and your mother a 15-year-old French prostitute named Chloe with webbed feet...does that automaticly mean you will become a bald supervillain, because thats all other say you can be?
Isnt it up to you to see what you actually can and cant do?


Its great to be all theoretical about what does and doesnt work in terms of gripped and/or non-gripped formations. But in the end, throwing our tight and fit looking ass (as we're all athletes according to our websites;)) out the door of an airplane, and actually doing some flying and trying it all is the only thing we can do to make sure it actually gets tested.


So lets first so a double dozen videos on what we can do, and in the process of discovering also see how awesome the 'I guess it doesnt work' videos look as well...and than draw conclusions..

As so far...a 5 way docked line, should be something easily beaten?

JC
FlyLikeBrick
I'm an Athlete?

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On my Stealth, i can get the arms all the way up to shoulder level/straight.
But even a swept wing position, like I have on my Acro doesnt seem to give any placement issues (see attachment..and thats with a huge/tall helmet).

A 2 meter person flying on your left, and 1.50 meter person flying on your right will be a more difficult thing to deal with than suit design. but even that may be solves easy with grippers from knee to toe. Who knows...

Its funny how we are compared to FS/RW and FF one time. Than tracking and atmonauti the other. And than suddenly we are airplane formations who just dont dock (cause the pussy metal birds dont have hands:P)


Its easy to do a simple and selective copy paste from each dicipline in terms of limitations. But like many things in our sport, we have to see which ones actually apply. We are a bit of this, a bit of that. But a completely different thing all together.

If your father is a relentlessly self-improving boulangerie owner from Belgium with low-grade narcolepsy and a penchant for buggery, and your mother a 15-year-old French prostitute named Chloe with webbed feet...does that automaticly mean you will become a bald supervillain, because thats all other say you can be?
Isnt it up to you to see what you actually can and cant do?


Its great to be all theoretical about what does and doesnt work in terms of gripped and/or non-gripped formations. But in the end, throwing our tight and fit looking ass (as we're all athletes according to our websites;)) out the door of an airplane, and actually doing some flying and trying it all is the only thing we can do to make sure it actually gets tested.


So lets first so a double dozen videos on what we can do, and in the process of discovering also see how awesome the 'I guess it doesnt work' videos look as well...and than draw conclusions..

As so far...a 5 way docked line, should be something easily beaten?



But your pic goes back to ankle grips. Even in RW, which I suggest is easier than WS because you're not flying in a straight jacket, ankle grips are very bad news and strongly discouraged.
...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

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When replying, a full quote of the post above you isnt needed..but that aside..:P

Its all Theory..in RW your lower legs/feet point up, so ankle docks would stack a formation. Not an issue that bother us, but even there its not needed.

Again..when talking judging theory is great...but this stuff needs to be figured out flying. You'll be amazed to see where it might go in just a few short years...

JC
FlyLikeBrick
I'm an Athlete?

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When replying, a full quote of the post above you isnt needed..but that aside..:P



OK.

The primary reason is that ankle docks mess with the free movement of the lower legs, nothing to do with stacking.
...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

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re: Kallend...
Hmmm....thats kinda negative, doc. We are neither geese nor aircraft (although that last is debatable). I've got more experience with docked formations than most (see the 5-way docked lines that have been done) and with a bunch of seriously precise wingsuit pilots I don't see any particularly impossible problems. I would argue that the reasons geese and aircraft do not do docked flight do not apply to us. Aircraft lack hands and living, flexible airframes. Geese flap. Neither are factors for us.
And the fact is, stable ankle docks have been done, on my ankle. Probably others as well. We know it can be done. Its just difficult. Thats never a good reason not to learn to do something.

Re: Notsane...
Scott, I'll admit the minimum complete size poses a challenge but I see no reason why it can't be built in pieces. Chances are, most experimental runs would have to be, anyway. Most of the time we don't have 8 pilots around who are THAT good. But we can try to build half at once and see how flyable it is. Most of the difficulty is, frankly, that as a group wingsuiters lack discipline and don't want to spend even a single day trying the same dive over and over. Kinda goes against the "free flight" reasons most of us do this. And that does include me. I've got the attention span of your average chipmunk so I just do my experiments and tests in an erratic fashion.

The ankle docks are the tricky part.
There are some weird burble effects in play there...


-B
Live and learn... or die, and teach by example.

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Technique, Monkey, its all about the technique.
I put a lot of thought into it, take my time, say it the way I gotta when I'm ready to. Wouldn't wanna suffer from premature explanation.:D
-B

Live and learn... or die, and teach by example.

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