mrbiceps 0 #1 November 22, 2009 Having recently taken up wingsuiting with 7 jumps on my firebird i got a great deal on a mach 1 suit. Ill put it away until my instructor and i feel that i am ready to fly it. What i am curious about is how many jumps did others do before they upgraded to a bigger suit with more wing and what difference did they find when flying it? Do u feel u waited long enough or did u fly a bigger suit too soon and scare the crap out of yourself? Tell me your story. Thanks guys. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mccordia 74 #2 November 22, 2009 Glad you said 'upsize' and not 'upgrade', as thats not always what it is. I think for most people its like cars. You always want the coolest/newest. And these days, bigger and bigger seems to be the thing everyone pushes for from the start. Quite similar to premature downsizing in canopy flying. Not fully learning the performance curve of the model you are flying, and expecting the bigger one to improve your exit, approach, docks, pull, body podition etc. All of which wont really happen. Sometimes actually the opposite. Only hangtime may improve, due to the added surface area. But the other things will actually take more time/effort to learn. Depending on funds, quite often, using the 'big suit money' to do more 'smal suit jumps' makes people a lot better flyers, and in general, much more agile. Smaller suits are also much more ideal for aerobatic manouvres/learning to backfly/docks etc, as its your body you are flying. On bigger suits, its more of fight sometimes to make the suit/fabric behave the way you want it to. Only for big/heavy people, larger suits can change their flying quickly, when coming of a xmall suit. As suddenly, they are flying with a formation, and learning to fly relative, docks etc. Compared to smaller suits, where all they can do is fight to stay up... I did my first 400 or so wingsuit jumps on the (6 years ago ENORMOUS) Skyflyer3.. Flyingwise, I cant say Ive seen/been in lots of big flocks that would warent/demand anything bigger. The huge suit I fly now is fun on solos, cool for canopy flybys...but its making me extremely lazy (skillswise) when I fly it in any flock...not using more than half of the wingsurface the suit has.. Could fill 5 more pages on big wings vs small wings..but in the end, its about flying your body. And when thats the thing you train..the suit is merely an extention... As a wise Jedi master once said... Fly the body and learn you must, for bigger wings you need not! JC FlyLikeBrick I'm an Athlete? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DSE 5 #3 November 23, 2009 I'm gonna downsize for more of what I do. After jumping with Brian and Charlie in their Phantom2 suits....No matter how much I closed it down, just couldn't maintain forward speed AND lift with them when they punched it out. Those P2's are GREAT suits. SO much better than my P1. Front loops are harder in a big suit too, of course. All that said, "dress for success." What is it you want to do and who do you want to do it with? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BenediktDE 2 #4 November 23, 2009 QuoteWhat i am curious about is how many jumps did others do before they upgraded to a bigger suit with more wing and what difference did they find when flying it? 250 jumps on my Phantom (1st version) and when I moved to a Ghost2 I was happy I did not use bigger wings earlier. If you upsize just be sure you don't do so to comensate a bad flying style. Then a big suit might even slow down your learning speed.For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
flusspirat 0 #5 November 23, 2009 150+ on my Expert (still use it in skydiving) before I switched to my ProFly. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mnskydiver688 0 #6 November 23, 2009 I flew an S-6 for about 150-160 flights before I upsized to a Ghost 2. While I love the Ghost 2 and have really found a suit I can be completely comfortable in I would be interested in trying a P2z as I have heard great things. Remember, if it is a cool trendy look your going for, wingsuits look the best when fully stretched.Sky Canyon Wingsuiters Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The111 1 #7 November 23, 2009 I did 75 jumps on a GTi which is slightly smaller than a Firebird. Then I did about 500 jumps on an S3. (upsize) Then I jumped a Super Mach 1 for a while. (upsize) Now I have a P2Z that I really like and have been flying a lot. (downsize) Out of those 4 suits, my favorites were the S3 and the P2Z. It's not about finding the biggest suit or even the best... it's about finding the best for you. And you won't know that until you have hundreds more jumps anyway, so enjoy the Firebird for now, and look for great deals on big suits later. There will ALWAYS be great deals. How hard was it to find this one? And never buy a suit you haven't flown... www.WingsuitPhotos.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Butters 0 #8 November 23, 2009 This thread makes me sad because I bought the P2 right before the release of the P2z. Oh well, the P2 is still a great wingsuit. Back to the thread topic ... I did ~225 jumps on my P2 before upsizing to a V3. However, I don't recommend upsizing based on number of jumps, I recommend upsizing based on skills. Can you exit on your belly, back, diving, etc...? Can you fly on your belly, back, diving, etc...? Can you do acrobatics? Can you recover from tumbles, spins, etc...? And the list goes on ..."That looks dangerous." Leopold Stotch Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mccordia 74 #9 November 23, 2009 QuoteHowever, I don't recommend upsizing based on number of jumps, I recommend upsizing based on skills. Yea..100% agreed. Just because a wingsuit has backfly inlets, or the ability to fly a certain glide ratio or fallrate according to other people/manufacturers, that doesnt do a single thing, unless you actually have the skills to make it fly that way. And the $800 to $1000 one spends on a bigger suit, is (for a lot of beginning flyers) often much better spent on some actual jumps...JC FlyLikeBrick I'm an Athlete? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BenediktDE 2 #10 November 23, 2009 Yup, I also love my Ghost2 and with over 100kg exit weight this is my choice for flocks. But I also think about buying a Phantom2 or an Acro2 for the acrobatic stuff I'd like to get into more.For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RMK 3 #11 November 23, 2009 Quote150+ on my Expert (still use it in skydiving) before I switched to my ProFly. Also love my Expert and am maybe looking at their Verso or a Phoenix. This concept of people "outgrowing" their suit to go bigger?? Watch the videos of Loic Jean-Albert or others pushing the Experts; then ask yourself can you do it that well and need more suit? I agree with the concept of it being more about piloting and less about "suit of the month""Pain is the best instructor, but no one wants to attend his classes" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hjumper33 0 #12 November 23, 2009 about 100 on an s3 with like 10 other suits demoed. probably 10 skydives and 50 base jumps on a v2. now love my p2 with maybe 30/15 jumps, but feel like it can do anything. v3 on order for hopefully jan. arrival. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dragon2 2 #13 November 23, 2009 10 jumps on a classic1, 10 on a MTR1, 60-70 on a classic2, then on to a S3 with no trouble, followed by a S1 (scaaary suit), my own S3, then a S3S and last a Blade. I like the S3S the best I think as it's easier to fly with beginners than the blade, flying shut-down al the time is not much fun. I know I'm a lazy flyer, mostly because of that I'm not much of a (bigway) flocker, so don't know what suit is best these days for that, but if I had to buy a new wingsuit now for what I do with it, I think it might be a phantom. Not sure I want the biggest wings anymore ciel bleu, Saskia Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mccordia 74 #14 November 23, 2009 A problem a lot of light flyers under-estemate when they go for big wings, is that they lack the wingload to fly it at the same speed the others are flying. Even though you may be flying the same glide-angle, you will be doing at at much slower speeds (in both directions). Going with something more fast and agile (less drag) is usually what makes a world of difference. Light people coming of big suits will usually notice they can all of a sudden keep up with flocks and get there faster.. Its not that much different from canopies in that aspect..JC FlyLikeBrick I'm an Athlete? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jdatc 0 #15 November 23, 2009 200+ on my phantom 1 (first suit) before I bought my V2... Flew that for a while waiting for my stealth. A lot of jumps on my stealth. Last 2 years of wingsuit base on my V2 and phantom. I am waiting on my V3, shouldn't have procrastinated on putting in the order. Have flown the Phantom 2, and liked it a lot, but can't justify buying one.... However, it is an amazing suit, and if I could have just one wingsuit, that would be what I would own.... It's an awesome suit that does all most everything well. I also agree with DSE, if I want to go out and do aerobatics and have a nice easy fun flight, I like my phantom. Plenty of range and I Still enjoy flying it. If I want to burn across the sky, the V2 is great... you can fly it head down, dock on tandems in FF, take it on track dives, whatever.... If I want to hang in the sky forever, backfly, or flock, I fly my stealth. Different tools for each job. Oh, I never flew anything before I bought it. And I have never been disappointed... with Phoenix fly gear anyway.... My birdman tracking suit on the other hand....._justin Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DSE 5 #16 November 24, 2009 Guess I shoulda given my numbers... GTI-10 jumps Firebird-22 jumps Phantom-90 jumps Blade-103 jumps Mach1-388 jumps Just ordered a P2z Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
