whats a good freefall time for a beginner?

[skittles_of_SDC 0]

I just did my first (through third) wingsuit jumps today. I got 57 sec on the first and 59 sec on the second both from ~13.3k then 62 sec from ~14.0k. Is this a normal range for someone who is just beginning and using small wings? What kind of numbers should I be aiming for for say the next 10 jumps?

Tony, Eric, if you guys read this thanks for taking me on my first wingsuit jump. I owe you some beer next time you are out at SDC.

[Bones 0]

1) What was your pull altitude?

2) Screw the time, did you have fun?

[skittles_of_SDC 0]

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1) What was your pull altitude?

2) Screw the time, did you have fun?

I was starting my deployment sequence at 5500'

Hell yeah I had fun. I was loving every minute of it. No wonder I heard it called the 'nylon crack'.

[phoenixlpr 0]

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Is this a normal range for someone who is just beginning and using small wings?

What wings are you using? How tall are you, what is your weight?

[skittles_of_SDC 0]

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Is this a normal range for someone who is just beginning and using small wings?

What wings are you using? How tall are you, what is your weight?

tony suit acrobat (wasn't doing acrobatics, it was just the smallest wing they had to demo)

I'm 5' 10" 215 out the door.

[phoenixlpr 0]

Freefall time does not really tell anything about your trajectory.

Try to get some coaching flight with someone more experienced with camera on. You might able to improve your body position and you angle too.

There is more that 100 ways to fly between floating, flying like a dart and going vertical.

There are more important things than FF times. A rock solid exit is a nice tool to have.

[mccordia 73]

Time is fun, but there are definately more important things.

Getting good and stable in your exits and flight.
Also when you have a tumble or flip.

Practice barrelrolls (single ones, double ones) and see how 'on heading' you can make those.
And if they dont go as planned, they are exelent recovery practice for small spins.

Experiment with different flight angles.
Try flying a bit steeper, feel the forward speed increase.
Try flying a little 'headhigh' and see how that feels (feel the forward speed bleed off, flaring, untill you loose lift/stall and suddenly the downward speed builds up again)

For weird and funky moves which might result in unstability, set yourself a hard-deck below which you dont initiate any new exercises/do any practice loops/rolls anymore, so you always have some altitude left for recovery (if needed).

These are all things that will help you. Especialy in wingsuit formation flying.

But still the biggest asset is getting some solid formation experience in normal (FF and RW) formations, where there is no forward speed in formations and closing distances are a lot smaller, and thus the reaction each body-position/action makes/creates is a lot clearer.

JC
FlyLikeBrick
I'm an Athlete?

[NSEMN8R 0]

Hey Skittles! Nice jumping with you this weekend. Congrats and welcome to the flock! You and Crystal both did great on your first flights. Especially considering the condition you were in from the Halloween party the night before! I had a lot of fun with you guys!

If I can make it back next weekend I'll bring my camera helmet. Video will help you A LOT. If I can't come, I'll send the Eagle down with Hoyt if you want to jump it some more. Don't worry too much about freefall times. When you forget about that stuff and just focus on flying the suit your times will get better. Just keep your feet off your butt and have fun!

If you want to get better at flying wingsuits, fly wingsuits more.

[droquette 0]

you are a big guy to be jumping a suit with such small wings... I am a big guy as well.. my recomendation is to not even think/worry about your fall rates untiull you dominate that suit and move up to one that has larger wings.

in the mean time do what one of the other posts says and practice practice practice all different types of manuevers; this way when you do get your ass in a bigger suit you have more experience and understand the dynamics better.

HISPA 72 ----- "Muff Brother" 3733

[Butters 0]

Big guy in a little suit ... but seriously, how much tracking experience do you have?

"That looks dangerous." Leopold Stotch

[VectorBoy 0]

What kind of numbers should I be aiming for for say the next 10 jumps?

The answer is highly classified and un publishable in public. we don't want the freefallers to know. The best thing to do is proceed to where flocks are flying, introduce yourself, they will teach you the secret handshake and pass you a folded scrap of note-book paper with exactly the numbers you are looking for.

[Butters 0]

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The best thing to do is proceed to where flocks are flying, introduce yourself, they will teach you the secret handshake and pass you a folded scrap of note-book paper with exactly the numbers you are looking for.

Did your piece of paper look like mine?

"That looks dangerous." Leopold Stotch

[JohanW 0]

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What kind of numbers should I be aiming for for say the next 10 jumps?

According to your profile, 176, 177, 178, 179, 180, 181, 182, 183, 184 and 185.

And make sure you walk away from them.


(Seriously? Keep pressure on your lower legwing. You will fly.)

Johan.
I am. I think.

[NSEMN8R 0]

The suit is actually an Eagle, not an Aerobat. He's the same size I was when I bought it. Once we get him to straighten out his legs and stop arching, there's no reason he can't be flying it comfortably in the 50-60 mph range.

[DSE 3]

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...Once we get him to straighten out his legs and stop arching, there's no reason he can't be flying it comfortably in the 50-60 mph range.

Some tracking dives before wearing the nylon might fix that....? Sorry, I keep forgetting it's not all about jump numbers.

[mccordia 73]

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Sorry, I keep forgetting it's not all about jump numbers.

Thats usually a line used by low-timers who dont care about jump numbers as it doesnt mean a thing...

Though they do update their profile with every single jump they make, and often suddenly round em off to 200 or remove the jump numbers all together if people ask too much or actually show a bit of care for their well-being (knowing that persons background and skill-level).

But hey...lets not hop on that train again..

JC
FlyLikeBrick
I'm an Athlete?

[VectorBoy 0]

Did your piece of paper look like mine?

Your scrap of paper is way better than mine.
The advice not to fixate on time aloft numbers should be in the sticky FAQ Jarno.

[mccordia 73]

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The advice not to fixate on time aloft numbers should be in the sticky FAQ Jarno.

The FAQ seems to be aimed at everything leadin up to making your first wingsuit jump. And not so much coaching/advice for after that one.

But if we do put it in there..would you like it above or bellow the line that says
why do I need to have 200 jumps before I can jump wingsuit?


On a more serious note...
Ill see if I can give JB a push, and maybe put together a small FAQ thingy on advice/practice for people after making their first jump.
With some links to online resources/tutorials and tips on making progress in terms of skills etc.

I already tried doing this (more elaborate) with this article a year or so ago.

http://www.flylikebrick.com/articles/flb_wingsuit_formation_flight.pdf

Though not completely what the initial poster was looking for, some of this stuff (regarding time not being the only focus) is also (be it in a different way) covered in the 'need for speed' video in our flight manuals section on our website

JC
FlyLikeBrick
I'm an Athlete?

[Butters 0]

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...Once we get him to straighten out his legs and stop arching, there's no reason he can't be flying it comfortably in the 50-60 mph range.

Some tracking dives before wearing the nylon might fix that....? Sorry, I keep forgetting it's not all about jump numbers.

Which is why I asked, how much tracking experience does he have? Why not treat wingsuiting like swooping and have a progression of things (besides just a number) to do before you get into it along with a progression of things to do once you've gotten into it.

"That looks dangerous." Leopold Stotch

[NSEMN8R 0]

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Sorry, I keep forgetting it's not all about jump numbers.

Uh-oh... Here we go again with the jump numbers..

Let me just say first that 'safety-wise' he did fine. He was stable right out the door, he did his practice touches, he flew the pre-planned pattern, he pitched on time, landed on airport... (Please don't anyone say "..but he doesn't know what he doesn't know..")

'Performance-wise', I would agree that if he either had more jumps or he'd spent more of his first 175 jumps tracking he probably would have flown better on his first WS jump. Some might also say that if he started flying wingsuits at 100 jumps, he would have been flying better this weekend.

You guys have never seen someone with "enough" jumps have weak leg position on their first flight???

I think watching some video of himself flying so he can actually see what he was doing would do more for his wingsuit skills than some tracking or RW jumps.

[DSE 3]

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You guys have never seen someone with "enough" jumps have weak leg position on their first flight???
.

I've certainly seen it, I was one of those myself, even though I waited til nearly 400 jumps for my first wingsuit jump, and then waited another 200 jumps due to a horrible first-jump experience. You'd have to ask Scott Campos how I did on my 'second' first-jump.
I've also seen a person with 8 times the "enough jumps" get into a hairy situation and nearly blow it.

It's more than the nylon itself, IMO. Traffic pattern, awareness of other canopies, experience in bad situations. My first WX jump...I got by without injury BECAUSE I had nearly 500 jumps behind me. Luck and experience combined kept me from anything more bruised than my ego.

I f''d up recently and taught someone with only 170 jumps. He is a *very* current and heads-up guy, which colored my thinking.
I learned my lesson after he had a cutaway on a borrowed rig and lost the freebag in the desert. Would another 30 jumps have made all the difference? He panicked in both deployment and linetwists. Would he have been more calm with more jumps? Maybe, maybe not.
It did teach me to be a better instructor, and it did teach me to watch for some things I'd not been trained/taught to watch for. Personally, I was very embarassed at my error and glad it didn't go worse.
200 jumps is the USPA-recommended minimum, and based on the stupidity of my earlier ignorance of the BSR, I'm sticking to the rules from now on. I usually learn in one.
YMMV.

[skittles_of_SDC 0]

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The suit is actually an Eagle, not an Aerobat. He's the same size I was when I bought it. Once we get him to straighten out his legs and stop arching, there's no reason he can't be flying it comfortably in the 50-60 mph range.

I actually grabbed the aerobat out of para concepts to demo after I tore up my pinky.

[NSEMN8R 0]

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It did teach me to be a better instructor, and it did teach me to watch for some things I'd not been trained/taught to watch for. Personally, I was very embarassed at my error and glad it didn't go worse.

Maybe not appropriate for this thread, but I'd like to hear more about this. What was your error? Did you teach him something incorrectly or leave something out? What things do you watch for now that you weren't before? If you've already posted the story, could you send me a link? Thanks.

[skittles_of_SDC 0]

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Big guy in a little suit ... but seriously, how much tracking experience do you have?

I'll be honest I only have 1 track dive.

[Butters 0]

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Big guy in a little suit ... but seriously, how much tracking experience do you have?

I'll be honest I only have 1 track dive.

Why not do more tracking dives before wingsuiting?

"That looks dangerous." Leopold Stotch